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View Full Version : Just inherited a Glock 23...



BaiHu
10-18-2011, 10:11 PM
My dad just gave up his Glock 23 and I thought I'd give it a try, but this might be my first/last week using it. I find the grip angle difficult to contend with-meaning, everything I've ever fired/held/fondled present dead on with the front sight nestled in b/w the rear notch, but the Glock always presents with the front sight high above the notch. I know I have heard people on the forum with the same issue and if the GFA does help this, and you all like the GFA and therefore a more 'natural' grip angle is what you prefer as a Glock user, then why did Glock choose this grip angle?

On the plus side, I shoot it well, but I just want to know why they chose an 'unnatural' grip angle and whether you all think it's worth getting used to or simply trading it in for something with a more natural grip angle that is also striker fired like an M&P or XD.

Looking for opinions, so fire away.

Lastly, thanks and my preemptive apologies if this is a dead horse I'm wailing on.

mnealtx
10-18-2011, 10:22 PM
I'd say grab a GFA and see if it works for you....as to why Gaston chose the grip angle he did...who knows?

JeffJ
10-19-2011, 07:52 AM
It took a little getting used to but I really like the Glock grip angle as it pertains to my weak hand, it really promotes an aggressive locked out wrist. Most people can get used to it with a little dry fire. I'm running the GFA right now and I really like how it adjusts the angle for SH and keeps he angle for WH - best of both worlds

Chuck Haggard
10-19-2011, 10:35 AM
Nothing wrong with a Glock grip angle. Seriously.

"Natural" is overrated. We did not evolve to hold small pipe bombs in front of our faces to use controlled explosions to launch metal pellets at things we want to poke holes in, so no pistol is "natural". It's all in what you have trained on.

I know many folks bitch about the Glock grip angle, but it seems more natural to me than guns like 1911s, due to promoting a better lockout of the wrist at extension and a solid thumbs forward grip. This angle is also close to that of guns famous for pointing well, like S&W K frames.

BaiHu
10-19-2011, 10:50 AM
Nothing wrong with a Glock grip angle. Seriously.

"Natural" is overrated. We did not evolve to hold small pipe bombs in front of our faces to use controlled explosions to launch metal pellets at things we want to poke holes in, so no pistol is "natural". It's all in what you have trained on.

When I say 'natural', I refer to the natural pointing angle of the wrist when the index finger is extended towards the object of your focus. If you cock your wrist down, as a Glock requires you to do, it forces your index finger down, rather than out.

I agree with your point about evolution, wrist lock and training (most importantly for me, wrist lock), but when it comes to ergonomics and 'natural' body movement, I find it odd that a natural movement wasn't considered in this design. Having said all of that, I do like the results having come from HK, CZ, FN and S&W, but it does require a conscious change for me when I switch from one to the other.

In the end, I believe the wrist lock position might end up making me a Glock person, but I'm not willing to take the plunge just yet.

Thanks for all of the opinions/suggestions.

BH

jslaker
10-19-2011, 05:27 PM
When I say 'natural', I refer to the natural pointing angle of the wrist when the index finger is extended towards the object of your focus. If you cock your wrist down, as a Glock requires you to do, it forces your index finger down, rather than out.

I agree with your point about evolution, wrist lock and training (most importantly for me, wrist lock), but when it comes to ergonomics and 'natural' body movement, I find it odd that a natural movement wasn't considered in this design.
When my wrist is properly locked out, my thumb pointing at my target is the "natural" motion, not my index finger. I think that was kind of the point.

Albeit, it's a bit of a post hoc justification for the Glock since the Glock was designed before Leatham and Enos popularized the thumbs forward grip anyway.

JeffJ
10-19-2011, 08:39 PM
I think the whole grip angle thing was thought up by old guys in gun stores that needed more reasons not to buy a reliable plastic pistol for $400 - 500 instead of a man's gun 1911 that either costs as much as my first car or doesn't run. I mean if you use the sights does it really matter where your wrist is "naturally" which probably has a much to do with a lot of trigger time with a 1911 as it does biomechanics - I find it hard to believe that everybody's wrists naturally fall the same way

Tamara
10-20-2011, 07:16 AM
Actually, the Glock's grip angle has been touted in their marketing from Day One as "natural" and the result of actual ergonomic research.

And let's not forget that the Government Model had its effective grip angle changed in 1924 by substituting an arched mainspring housing for the flat one* to correct an alleged tendency to shoot low. Of course, that was when everybody was crouching and shooting from the hip; find me a modern competition 1911 with an arched MSH and I'll be shocked... Plus, the change was based on field reports from WWI doughboys who had received all of ten minutes of pistol instruction before being thrown into the trenches, so it doesn't require a crystal ball to surmise that the low shooting had precisely dick-all to do with the pistol's grip angle.

*Interchangeable backstraps: Another JMB innovation! ;)

Al T.
10-20-2011, 09:53 AM
Started out as a 1911 guy, then had to carry a G22 for money. Figured I'd learn to shoot the Glock as I was carrying it. :cool:

Once I realized out it needed a firmer grip than a 1911 and that atrocious white "U" blacked out (better yet, replace the sights) I was satisfied. After watching 60 folks fire 75 rounds each for quarterly qualifications for a couple of years with no firearm induced malfunctions, I was impressed.

The other feature that Glock enjoys (IMHO) is that working on your Glock is simplicity, especially compared to the 1911/revolver families.

Get some coaching and I think you'll like it. :D

David Armstrong
10-22-2011, 09:33 PM
On the plus side, I shoot it well, but I just want to know why they chose an 'unnatural' grip angle and whether you all think it's worth getting used to or simply trading it in for something with a more natural grip angle that is also striker fired like an M&P or XD.
I've been teaching handgun shooting for a long time, and I've found lots of folks (myself included) that find the Glock grip angle quite natural. It may be an individual thing, like JeffJ said, "I find it hard to believe that everybody's wrists naturally fall the same way." I've heard all my life about how natural the grip angle was for the 1911 and the Luger, but I've found them to be far less natural than many other guns, including the Glock.

JonInWA
10-25-2011, 01:00 PM
I'm a little surprised no one has asked this yet-Which generation G23 do you have? If it doesn't have the fingergrooved-frontstrap, dished-in thumb indentations and the light-rail, it's either a Generation 1 or Generation 2 G23; if it has all of the above it's a Gen 3 gun. I've personally found that the earlier generation Glocks did tend to point a bit high, especially until thoroughly acclimated to them. The Generation 3 guns, what with the re-sculpting of the frontstrap and the very subtly re-sculpted rear tang remove (or redistribute) just enough polymer to make the guns come to a more natural/instinctive point for me.

Regardless, as others have suggested, merely spending some quality time with the gun will likely serve to adjust you to the tool.

Best, Jon