Let's talk GSD's

[StraitR]

I've wanted a GSD since my daughter was born almost four years ago, then even more when I started traveling for work, and now exponentially more that I have a little boy due in nine days. I want a dog that is as concerned with the safety of our family as I am, and equally driven to see it through at any cost.

Main goal is family security -

1- In the house
2- In the yard (neighbors have a 100lbs doberman, and he's a total asshole (the dog))
3- Family walks around the neighborhood without me (wife works from home and this is a common occurrence).
4- I carry AIWB when at home. Now that my daughter is older, the long guns stay locked in the safe.

GSD's seem to live in condition yellow when around the family. Our eight year old Golden Retriever is an amazing dog, but he's never even seen condition yellow, let alone orange/red, and the only sound he pays attention to is that of something hitting the bottom of his food bowl. The same for our Long Haired Miniature Dachshund, though he tends to bark at random sounds outside. My wife (God love her) is basically oblivious to anything outside the walls of our house when at home.

Due to the little one coming, I have informed the XO that a GSD will also be coming aboard, and I have the green light. The last thing I (think) want is a puppy and a newborn, since two things crapping at once that need my attention does not sound fun. So, it probably won't happen right away, but I want to start my research on the pros, cons, breeders and schools now.

I've followed the pets thread since it started, and a lot of you have GSDs, so I can't imagine a better place to start looking for experience based information.

I'll be sharing any info about kids/GSD's in this thread with my wife, as that's her number one concern. Any help/advice speaking directly to that issue (and pics, she's a visual learner) would be much appreciated.

[Luke]

I know nothing about GS's but if it were me I'd want to have a dog that was already very very loyal to me/family before letting them be around a baby. OR get a puppy and let him grow with the family around.

I have a lab/pit mix, I've had him since a puppy and he's now ~9 years old. When my daughter was born I brought a blanket she had been wrapped up in home and let him sniff it and play with it. He was so excited! He knew what it was and when we brought my daughter home he was even more excited. We now have a 1 year old son as well. They both play and antagonize rock (the dog) and he loves every minute of it!

[HCM]

I've wanted a GSD since my daughter was born almost four years ago, then even more when I started traveling for work, and now exponentially more that I have a little boy due in nine days. I want a dog that is as concerned with the safety of our family as I am, and equally driven to see it through at any cost.

Main goal is family security -

1- In the house
2- In the yard (neighbors have a 100lbs doberman, and he's a total asshole (the dog))
3- Family walks around the neighborhood without me (wife works from home and this is a common occurrence).
4- I carry AIWB when at home. Now that my daughter is older, the long guns stay locked in the safe.

GSD's seem to live in condition yellow when around the family. Our eight year old Golden Retriever is an amazing dog, but he's never even seen condition yellow, let alone orange/red, and the only sound he pays attention to is that of something hitting the bottom of his food bowl. The same for our Long Haired Miniature Dachshund, though he tends to bark at random sounds outside. My wife (God love her) is basically oblivious to anything outside the walls of our house when at home.

Due to the little one coming, I have informed the XO that a GSD will also be coming aboard, and I have the green light. The last thing I (think) want is a puppy and a newborn, since two things crapping at once that need my attention does not sound fun. So, it probably won't happen right away, but I want to start my research on the pros, cons, breeders and schools now.

I've followed the pets thread since it started, and a lot of you have GSDs, so I can't imagine a better place to start looking for experience based information.

I'll be sharing any info about kids/GSD's in this thread with my wife, as that's her number one concern. Any help/advice speaking directly to that issue (and pics, she's a visual learner) would be much appreciated.

A buddy of mine just got a Dutch Shepard Puppy for similar purposes. An option worth considering.


2- In the yard (neighbors have a 100lbs doberman, and he's a total asshole (the dog))

If the dog is an asshole either the owner is as well or worse, the owner does not have control and the dog thinks he's in charge.

[breakingtime91]

I have two GSD. They are a handful, intelligent, very protective, and great companions. Both of my dogs are well behaved but I wish I would of taken them to a trainer early on so I could learn beside them. Like others have stated, its a good idea to raise the dog around the kids or having an established long term relationship (my dogs are 4 and 3 years of age) is a good idea. My dogs love kids, find them fascinating, and don't leave their side. My niece was all over both my shepherds, climbing, sitting, pulling on their ears and they just took it all while keeping a watchful eye on adults they didn't know. I know there are quite a few people on here who don't seem to be too invested in pets but mine are a firm part of my family and I like that they are willing to die to protect my wife and I.

[SeriousStudent]

I have two GSD. They are a handful, intelligent, very protective, and great companions. Both of my dogs are well behaved but I wish I would of taken them to a trainer early on so I could learn beside them. Like others have stated, its a good idea to raise the dog around the kids or having an established long term relationship (my dogs are 4 and 3 years of age) is a good idea. My dogs love kids, find them fascinating, and don't leave their side. My niece was all over both my shepherds, climbing, sitting, pulling on their ears and they just took it all while keeping a watchful eye on adults they didn't know. I know there are quite a few people on here who don't seem to be too invested in pets but mine are a firm part of my family and I like that they are willing to die to protect my wife and I.

This mirrors my experience. I have a GSD mix who is very devoted to myself and my granddaughter. He was six when the little kiddo arrived, and took to her immediately. He is a constant, watchful companion when she is present.

[StraitR]

Definitely getting a puppy so he/she will grow up with the kids, as everyone has pointed out. He/she will definitely attend appropriate training, along with myself.

Will look into the Dutch Shepard as well. Thanks

I've also considered a Mal, but based on what I read, they seem a little more high maintenance. As in needing to stay busy with daily tasks aside from guard duty. That's the sense I got from a few of LL's and Todd's posts. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Dagga Boy]

Our "Chiwienie" had to be put to sleep Tuesday. It was my wife's therapy dog and lived in bed with her the last couple years of her life with cancer. He was weird, neurotic, and not normal, but we tried. I actually miss the little guy, but he was my only small dog. We are also looking at a German Shepard as the next dog. My kid is 13, so should be good. Not sure with GSD's for little kids. The one we had when I was younger (14) bit a lot of people and was over protective of the family. Also had a Rottweiler that was the same way.

For babies, I can HIGHLY recommend a Boxer. Generally dumb but sweet. They are great with kids, as they are like having a puppy their whole lives. They are also very intuitive about who is good and who is not when people come to your home, where my experience with the Shepards and Rotts are that everyone is a suspect. While Boxers are super sweet, they look intimidating and will bow up to threats. Also, they are not afraid of mixing it up with other animals that may be aggressive...they got the name for a reason.
I would agree with a younger dog raised with the child if you are going the Shepard route. Training is also critical.

[Poconnor]

I would talk to local k-9 officers about where they get their dogs. Too many GSD have health problems. My Dept got their dogs from Czechoslovakia via a local trainer. Often they can point you to k-9 dogs that didn't make the cut. I went with a bull terrier.

[Dagga Boy]

Definitely getting a puppy so he/she will grow up with the kids, as everyone has pointed out. He/she will definitely attend appropriate training, along with myself.

Will look into the Dutch Shepard as well. Thanks

I've also considered a Mal, but based on what I read, they seem a little more high maintenance. As in needing to stay busy with daily tasks aside from guard duty. That's the sense I got from a few of LL's and Todd's posts. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Mal's are the tweekers of the dog world. I spent a ton of time and many years agitating both GSD's and Malanuts, along with the other Euro variations of Shepards. We had several guys who also had Malanois pets. They were all hyper spastic.

[JAD]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160319/d25418e50844d2b3775eb3d22cfa985d.jpg

Katie is the best dog I've ever met, let alone had. We guess about 1/2 GSD 1/2 lab. 50 pounds -- big enough to scare those that don't know better and small enough to control easily. Very protective of the kid -- rushes me if I tickle him and controls my arm. Literally perfect disposition. Hybrid vigor is not to be underestimated.

She had been dumped on the side of the road in the sticks after what the vet guesses was her third litter. Tits to her knees, no real shot at being adopted. We think that's why she's so sweet, but it also has resulted in her nickname being Lurlene.

[Willard]

The Monks of New Skete publish several GSD focused books. Highly recommend "How To Be Your Dog's Best Friend."

Also, a lot of information on breeders and other relevant topics here: http://www.germanshepherds.com/

[StraitR]

Great suggestions. The Monks first book, The Art of Raising a Puppy is excellent, and a must for any first time puppy owner, regardless of breed. Unfortunately, I loaned it out years ago and never received it back. And FYI, book thieves make poor dog owners IME.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1620/25822437371_9883acfc55_z.jpg

[11B10]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160319/d25418e50844d2b3775eb3d22cfa985d.jpg

Katie is the best dog I've ever met, let alone had. We guess about 1/2 GSD 1/2 lab. 50 pounds -- big enough to scare those that don't know better and small enough to control easily. Very protective of the kid -- rushes me if I tickle him and controls my arm. Literally perfect disposition. Hybrid vigor is not to be underestimated.

She had been dumped on the side of the road in the sticks after what the vet guesses was her third litter. Tits to her knees, no real shot at being adopted. We think that's why she's so sweet, but it also has resulted in her nickname being Lurlene.

My grandpa was vet, I always had dogs and I must tell you, your dog's story and picture are right at the top of them all! Thanks so much for sharing.

[Lester Polfus]

Hey man,

I'm on GSD #3 and will never own a different type of dog.

Will the dog be left alone for significant periods of time? If so, you may wish to reconsider. That's a problem with all dogs, and a prime source of bad behavior, but is particularly an issue with GSD's. Many of the adult GSD's that wind up in "rescues" are there because the owner(s) thought they could leave the dog in the morning and not come home that night to a neurotic, overly anxious GSD that had done thousands of dollars of damage to the house and shit all over the place.

Does your family do things on nights and weekends that are amenable to including the GSD? If you like to hike, walk and go places where a dog can go, I would highly recommend taking the dog whenever you can. One common mistake is to only socialize GSD's with members of the immediate family. Then when they come in contact with other people on the rare occasion they are brought out in the world, they can get super leash aggressive and have other issues.

Are you willing to treat owning a GSD as a sort of hobby that consumes a fair amount of time? I've taught my GSD's some nosework, to go find my oldest daughter hiding in the woods, to run obstacle courses etc. The time spent doing that made them better dogs in general, but it was also time I couldn't devote to other stuff. They can be high maintenance dogs, but the more you put into them, the more you get out.

Beware of rescues and other avenues for re-homing adult dogs. I've gotten all my dogs this way but there are often pitfalls. GSD #1 had some significant socilization issues when I got him. Within a few days of getting him, he would have taken a bullet for me, my ex-wife or my daughter, but he was convinced everybody else was a axe murderer. My oldest daughter was about 10 then, and I had the time and energy to basically do nothing but work, eat, sleep and train the dog for several months and he turned into a a really good boy who genuinely enjoyed meeting strange people, but that is not how that story usually turns out.

GSD #2 had severe health problems that weren't disclosed by the animal rescue organization, as well as some pretty bad socialization issues that weren't apparent on first meeting him. We got him when my current wife was pregnant, with the hopes of settling him in before we had the baby. Long story short, it turns out he probably had lymphoma when we adopted him and had to be put down, but likely would have had to have had a new home anyway, because of the socialization issues.

GSD #3 is my first female, and is an absolutely sweetheart, but doesn't have quite the drive for training or protectiveness that many GSD's do. She'll bark, and she's super tolerant of the baby, so that's enough for me right now.

[NGP]

If a malinois is too much for you, don't even consider a dutch, they are the mals neurotic cousin and can give even experienced handlers great difficulty. They are awesome dogs but require a great deal of commitment, in my experience more than any of the other working breeds. Will come back and add more when I get a bit more time.

[NGP]

Also check out https://www.facebook.com/LoganHausKennels he has washout DOD contract dogs from time to time that could very well fit your needs.

[Coyotesfan97]

A buddy of mine just got a Dutch Shepard Puppy for similar purposes. An option worth considering.


Dutch Shepherds and German Shepherds are apples and oranges. They have completely different drives. Especially if you get a working line.

If I were going to go DS with what the OP describes if get a rescue from the North American Dutch Shepherd Rescue.


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[Coyotesfan97]

Definitely getting a puppy so he/she will grow up with the kids, as everyone has pointed out. He/she will definitely attend appropriate training, along with myself.

Will look into the Dutch Shepard as well. Thanks

I've also considered a Mal, but based on what I read, they seem a little more high maintenance. As in needing to stay busy with daily tasks aside from guard duty. That's the sense I got from a few of LL's and Todd's posts. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Dutch Shepherds are Mals with brindle coats. My experience with Dutchies, at least K9s, is that Dutchies are a little quirkier then Mals. I love working my Dutchie but he spends a lot of time in his kennel.

That being said there are a lot of Dutchies who make fine pets. Just know what you are getting.


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[breakingtime91]

6623


This is my female. She is a really easy going dog. I exercise her and then she just loves to lay around and play with her toys. I grew up with labs and she is so easy going in comparison.

[Mickey]

I'm on GSD #2
My first one was brought over from Germany as a sport prospect. I Had been working with a shutzhund club and they had a judge coming over from Germany and he agreed to bring the pup over with him. Unfortunately after I had her for a very short time my deployment rate increased and I didn't get to train her in shutzhund very often. But she still had all her working drive and was a total PITA in the house. She always had to have a job. Luckily when she was two we moved to a 10 acre hobby farm and she alway had something to do. She was the one dog in which I will always judge others by, she was a lot of work but she was also a heck of a dog.

After she passed we couldn't stand not having a GSD around. I suggested to my wife we work with our local GSD rescue. We volunteered and fostered dog for them for several months. Helped a lot of good dogs find good homes yes we had some problem child's come though. But we also had some great dogs come though. I was always honest and upfront with people about and issues good or bad that the dogs had. We had a disagreement with the way some of policy's of the rescue and we no longer work with them.

GSD #2 after having the high drive sport dog I knew that I didn't want another one. I talked to the breeders that had help me bring over my first dog over to see if they would have any pups coming up that would fit my criteria. They did not at the time but we did eventually get another female from them. She was an owner return, her first owners got a little more dog than they wanted so we agreed to work with her and see if she might fit our needs. The rest shall we say is history.

I will say that if you go though a breeder make sure they do the tests that a good breeder should. They should at the minimum be doing an OFA certified test on at least the hips and preferably the elbows as well. Also check too see if they do any kind of "enrichment" for the pups when they are little. Small stuff that the breeder does when they are young can help a lot after they leave there litter.

[BJXDS]

Great Choice. I had 2 growing up, and 1 that grew up with my kids. My kids are now grown and the dog had to be put to sleep I could probably write you a book. I had the same concerns as you, and since I was familiar with GSD's we decided to get one. Best move I ever made.

I would however be wary with small kids and big dogs, I think mine were 6 and 8 when we got the dog so they grew up together. Honestly a true working/guard dog and family dog are hard to mix together. ie its not a good idea for an aggressively trained dog to be allowed to lay around with the kids.

My GSD was naturally protective of our family, but it was definitely my sons dog. The dog thought he was one of my kids, but instinctively knew when something was not right and went into full protection mode.

Some issue to consider:
You need to establish who the big dog is, To quote the Dog Whisperer " Calm Assertive Energy"
Great dog if you are able to make him part of the family
They appear and can be intimidating to others, but when properly trained they are really big babies with the family, assuming the pack order has been established
They do get bored and will chew shit up, we probably should have crate trained him for 2 years, before we could let him have the run of the house when we were not home
They are very intelligent, but will test you, kinda like kids do when they are teenagers
They SHED like NOTHING you have ever seen, so be prepared to deal with dog hair forever!
Check into health certifications OFA/DM can be very expensive
Mine liked the cold would lay on the deck in snow and did not want to come in
The poor things tongue hung out all summer[/SIZE]

I was more at ease and felt safer when we had our GSD, than I am now with my alarm system. He was and alarm, guard, and fury kid rolled into one! Never really if the door was locked. We lived in the country and the dog and kids ran through the woods together, just an added piece of mind.

I swear the dog would let anyone in the house if we told him it was OK, but if he didn't know them, I swear he watched them with a DON'T FUCK UP attitude. You would have to see it it believe it.

Me and my wife were sitting on the deck one day, and the dog's ears perked up, then he started wagging his tail and got up and walked off the deck, just then a good friend pulled in the driveway. The dog was excited to see him, but when he got out of the truck the dog started growling... WTF then he spoke to the dog and the dog got excited again, then started growling, then the dog ran back by my wife's side and started growling. Every time my buddy spoke the dogs tail would wag, then he would growl again.. WTF AGAIN!

To make a long story short my buddy was picking berries, and stopped by to bring us some. As ole timers use to do, he wrapped rags soaked in diesel fuel around his legs to keep the chiggers and ticks off him. This confused the hell out of the dog, their primary sense of recognition is smell. After we figured out what was going on, it was truly amazing to see him go from puppy dog to Bad ASS. My wife said Now I know I am safe with the dog when your not around!

Kinda like my kids I wouldn't take 10 million$ for them, but I wouldn't give you a nickel for another one!
Sorry enough rambling, I really don't think you can wrong. I gotta go look at some old pics of the dog and kids.......
I hope this was helpful

[Mickey]

And as far as dog training goes. I have made the switch from using adversives (pinch collars, shock collars and other painfull devices) to use positive training. I enjoy it much more and so do the dogs. You can find a trainer that uses positive methods here (https://apdt.com/default.aspx)

[idahojess]

Katie is the best dog I've ever met, let alone had. We guess about 1/2 GSD 1/2 lab. 50 pounds -- big enough to scare those that don't know better and small enough to control easily. Very protective of the kid -- rushes me if I tickle him and controls my arm. Literally perfect disposition. Hybrid vigor is not to be underestimated.


Cool story. When I was born, my parents had a German Shepherd/Lab mix that looks exactly like your girl, with those half straight/floppy ears. He was an adult when I came into the world, and lived a long time--16 or so. My dad credits that dog with saving him from a charging bull that we had on our small farm -- got right in the bull's face. He had a lot of hybrid vigor, and was 100 percent dog. (Eating everything-- including chickens, neighbor's rabbits etc...I believe there was an incident when I got too close to his food dish as toddler, too). Good dog though... lifted his leg on an ornery neighbor once, too.

[Trooper224]

I'm a dog lover, surprising I know, as I've often stated my opinion on the asshatish behavior of people who insist on humanizing their pets. It's the owners I have a problem with, not the dogs. I'm going to assume GSD means Genral Service Dog? (the acronym addicts strike again) I'd never consider a Malanois as a family pet. They're wound too tight and sometimes I think they're bi-polar. Great police K-9's, lousy family pets. A boxer would be great around the kids, dumb as the proverbial box of rocks, but a good choice if you don't want to worry about it eating your baby's face off. You'd better like training him though, as they're so stupid that's all you'll be doing. A German Shepard is a good choice, but be very conscious of where and from whom you obtain it, otherwise your significant investment will soon go to doggy heaven from things like hip dysplasia and heart disease. We had a Doberman for years that was a wonderful addition to the family. Treat it right and you'll never find a more loyal and loving security system for your family. Be aware that the dobie forms a very close bond with it's pack, in this case your family. It needs regular contact with the family and isn't the choice for the pet owner who leaves it in the backyard most of the time and just throws it food once a day. Be that guy and stand by for the aforementioned face eating. We haven't owned dogs for several years now, as we simply grew tired of the boat anchor that dogs become. However, if I was ever to get another it would be a Doberman.

[breakingtime91]

I'm a dog lover, surprising I know, as I've often stated my opinion on the asshatish behavior of people who insist on humanizing their pets. It's the owners I have a problem with, not the dogs. I'm going to assume GSD means Genral Service Dog? (the acronym addicts strike again) I'd never consider a Malanois as a family pet. They're wound too tight and sometimes I think they're bi-polar. Great police K-9's, lousy family pets. A boxer would be great around the kids, dumb as the proverbial box of rocks, but a good choice if you don't want to worry about it eating your baby's face off. You'd better like training him though, as they're so stupid that's all you'll be doing. A German Shepard is a good choice, but be very conscious of where and from whom you obtain it, otherwise your significant investment will soon go to doggy heaven from things like hip dysplasia and heart disease. We had a Doberman for years that was a wonderful addition to the family. Treat it right and you'll never find a more loyal and loving security system for your family. Be aware that the dobie forms a very close bond with it's pack, in this case your family. It needs regular contact with the family and isn't the choice for the pet owner who leaves it in the backyard most of the time and just throws it food once a day. Be that guy and stand by for the aforementioned face eating. We haven't owned dogs for several years now, as we simply grew tired of the boat anchor that dogs become. However, if I was ever to get another it would be a Doberman.

Not to be dick, but maybe to be, it means German shepherd dog..

[Dagga Boy]

Not to be dick, but maybe to be, it means German shepherd dog..

It is German Shepard Dog.....but otherwise, a pretty good assessment by trooper 224.

[Hambo]

I'm going to assume GSD means Genral Service Dog? (the acronym addicts strike again)

You did better than me. I had no idea what GSD stood for until I opened the thread. Shepherds are great dogs, but everyone knows that the LRD is the kid of canines.

PS-Get some of that, acronym lovers.

[Matt O]

They SHED like NOTHING you have ever seen, so be prepared to deal with dog hair forever!


Sweet jesus yes. I love my GSD but my god does she shed. Given I'm somewhat OCD about keeping the floor clean, this part has driven me slightly nuts.

[JM Campbell]

You did better than me. I had no idea what GSD stood for until I opened the thread. Shepherds are great dogs, but everyone knows that the LRD is the kid of canines.

PS-Get some of that, acronym lovers.
Try this furminator...it works.

http://www.furminator.com/pet-deshedding-solutions-tools.aspx

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[breakingtime91]

It is German Shepard Dog.....but otherwise, a pretty good assessment by trooper 224.
Agreed. Funny my wife and I had the "boat anchor" conversation the other day. There is no way around it, they do complicate a lot of stuff.

[Welder]

I'm going to assume GSD means Genral Service Dog? (the acronym addicts strike again)

And when I saw the title, I had thought we had another thread on Berettas starting.

Boxers have been mentioned a couple of times in this thread, which are what I grew up with. A big, "true that" to the statements about their lifelong puppyhood, and I believe that stink bugs would give them a run for their intelligence money. But that everlasting joy that they're endowed with from birth isn't something I've seen in other dogs, and I like it. If my wife ever gets to leave her job and stay at home, a Boxer is what we'll be getting. But I can't stand the thought of an active dog being cooped up in the house with only a few hours' worth of attention per day, which is why we are dogless right now.

Good luck with your search.

[LittleLebowski]

My personal experience is that a Mal can be an excellent family dog but GSDs are better for that role. The problem is getting one of these Northern European herding breeds (the Mals, Duchies, and GSDs are what I speak of, very closely related) and encouraging their innate protective instincts without being in full control of said instincts, understanding what sets off said instincts, and knowing how to control the dog period plus not putting the dog in the wrong situation where its instinct is telling it to Do The Right Thing And Protect The Pack as per its ancestry. These Northern European herding breeds are so good at being K9 breeds because as opposed to say Border Collies, they were bred to walk a post, to patrol around the herd, and keep the herd safe.

Another problem is that folks endlessly preach that Mals are "furry chainsaws on meth" and then think that a GSD is "totally chill, no problem, treat it like a Lab," etc. GSDs are quite capable of nearly the same level of a similar but more pack oriented drive to protect and that drive can manifest itself without encouragement. So, your GSD still needs an Alpha and it still needs rules and a job to do. It definitely needs socialization as do Mals. Socialization is key to keeping the dog from biting strangers unexpectedly.

I adopted a full grown, high drive Mal. The dog was fantastic with toddlers, children, and newborn. He was also fantastic at Schutzhund. I'm not saying all Mals are capable of this but it's my belief you can shape the dog the way you want within reason.

It is absolutely true that GSDs are overbred and you need to be very fucking careful about the bloodline you choose. Case in point (http://www.seamammalswithgreys.org/column11/herders/werklijn_kynologische_lijn.jpg). However, the same goes with Mals. Get to know the sire and bitch of the bloodline. Figure out what you need, not what you want. If you're gone 10-12 hrs a day and your spouse isn't used to a high(er) drive dog, guess what, despite your own alpha tendencies, you cannot provide a good home for a high(er) drive K9 breed, even if it is "just" a GSD instead of that working dog line Mal that you're sure you need.

Right now, I have a medium-ish drive female GSD. Her health and hips are guaranteed for 5 years. She was raised in the breeder's home as a family. If I tussle with her, she'll grab my arm and shake it but she's never broken skin. I can whack her pretty good and throw her around but when we're play fighting, she is fearless and you just don't get that out of a Lab/Boxer, etc. If I'm paying rough with a boxer and whack him around, kick him medium hard while he's mouthing me, he's going to back down. Other dogs were not bred to have that warrior spirit and that's that. Realistically, nearly everyone on this forum only needs a dog that can alert the adults in the house as to a disturbance. However, the members of this community are the exception and let's face it, not all of our spouses possess the mindset to respond with the ability to protect themselves and the family if a dog alerts. The K9 breeds with the right rearing will fight and die for your family and that (plus I like smart dogs) is why I will always have a Mal or GSD in the home.

If you've gotten this far in my poorly worded screed about my experiences with these dogs, I recommend GSDs for most folks looking for a protective dog. I've personally found Dobermans too twitchy for my preference and a good friend who is a practicing veterinarian and Army veterinarian (Reserve officer) says he's not a fan of Dobermans. I have seen Dobermans I would own if I was single, though.

Original German Shepherd from over 100 years ago:
http://www.dragongsd.com/VA_Beowulf_vom_Nahegau.jpg

My high drive adoptee Mal:
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/Dogs/IMG_20130113_104107.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/Dogs/IMG_20130620_103747_zpsddda6c44.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/fbad8576.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/705b3688.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/5ae8b5b5.jpg

[Pennzoil]

The wife and I are big GSD fans and we are on our second one currently. Looking back on the first GSD I did a number of things wrong and still had an awesome pup. Second one I did better but both ended up with health issues in the end despite her parents being papered in Germany. The next one, which hopefully we won’t need to get for a while, I’ll spare no expense on traveling/researching the breeding.

I’m far from an expert but I find the 6Ps (proper preparation prevents piss poor performance) extremely important when getting a new pup so it sounds like your on the right track from your post. I’d recommend reading a number of books, watching videos, and deciding on a trainer prior to selecting a pup. I view training literature like shooting classes, take what you want leave the rest. Regarding dog training, I’d rather talk religion and politics with drunks then dog training with dog people.

I usually take the first week or two when the dog comes home off work to be honest which probably isn’t an option for most people. I feel you can really get a good start this way. Here is my Aussie the first week we got her and watching the video I see a number of mistakes on my part.


http://youtu.be/nt5HAH-FKg4


I could really go on and on about GSD but will save you the wall of text. Mine was my backpacking buddy and I trained her on air scenting before the rear hips went out. I have an Aussie now for those tasks.

[Risto]

My personal experience is that a Mal can be an excellent family dog but GSDs are better for that role. The problem is getting one of these Northern European herding breeds (the Mals, Duchies, and GSDs are what I speak of, very closely related) and encouraging their innate protective instincts without being in full control of said instincts, understanding what sets off said instincts, and knowing how to control the dog period plus not putting the dog in the wrong situation where its instinct is telling it to Do The Right Thing And Protect The Pack as per its ancestry. These Northern European herding breeds are so good at being K9 breeds because as opposed to say Border Collies, they were bred to walk a post, to patrol around the herd, and keep the herd safe.

Another problem is that folks endlessly preach that Mals are "furry chainsaws on meth" and then think that a GSD is "totally chill, no problem, treat it like a Lab," etc. GSDs are quite capable of nearly the same level of a similar but more pack oriented drive to protect and that drive can manifest itself without encouragement. So, your GSD still needs an Alpha and it still needs rules and a job to do. It definitely needs socialization as do Mals. Socialization is key to keeping the dog from biting strangers unexpectedly.

I adopted a full grown, high drive Mal. The dog was fantastic with toddlers, children, and newborn. He was also fantastic at Schutzhund. I'm not saying all Mals are capable of this but it's my belief you can shape the dog the way you want within reason.

It is absolutely true that GSDs are overbred and you need to be very fucking careful about the bloodline you choose. Case in point (http://www.seamammalswithgreys.org/column11/herders/werklijn_kynologische_lijn.jpg). However, the same goes with Mals. Get to know the sire and bitch of the bloodline. Figure out what you need, not what you want. If you're gone 10-12 hrs a day and your spouse isn't used to a high(er) drive dog, guess what, despite your own alpha tendencies, you cannot provide a good home for a high(er) drive K9 breed, even if it is "just" a GSD instead of that working dog line Mal that you're sure you need.

Right now, I have a medium-ish drive female GSD. Her health and hips are guaranteed for 5 years. She was raised in the breeder's home as a family. If I tussle with her, she'll grab my arm and shake it but she's never broken skin. I can whack her pretty good and throw her around but when we're play fighting, she is fearless and you just don't get that out of a Lab/Boxer, etc. If I'm paying rough with a boxer and whack him around, kick him medium hard while he's mouthing me, he's going to back down. Other dogs were not bred to have that warrior spirit and that's that. Realistically, nearly everyone on this forum only needs a dog that can alert the adults in the house as to a disturbance. However, the members of this community are the exception and let's face it, not all of our spouses possess the mindset to respond with the ability to protect themselves and the family if a dog alerts. The K9 breeds with the right rearing will fight and die for your family and that (plus I like smart dogs) is why I will always have a Mal or GSD in the home.

If you've gotten this far in my poorly worded screed about my experiences with these dogs, I recommend GSDs for most folks looking for a protective dog. I've personally found Dobermans too twitchy for my preference and a good friend who is a practicing veterinarian and Army veterinarian (Reserve officer) says he's not a fan of Dobermans. I have seen Dobermans I would own if I was single, though.


I think this post is pretty accurate. It's very important to do your due diligence regarding the bloodlines. Raising/training the dog is the most important thing though, the more time and effort you put in the first year or two the more dividends you will reap later on.

My maligator is an absolute guard dog in her blood, I did not train her to be that way nor discourage her. In my experience, most dogs don't bite when it comes down to it, but some do. Mine bit the doofus from up the street who climbed over my 6ft fence "to find my kids ball". He required several stitches on his forearm. My dog was never bite trained.

She requires regular exercise as well as mental stimulation and close family time. She will not take harsh corrections.

She is constantly testing her place in the pack and every few months does something drastic to check (for her - jumping on the couch or bed to see what we do).

She is the best dog I have ever had and is super smart and super athletic. She does whatever I ask her to do, and expects the praise, encouragement and reinforcement for doing it.

My wife has mentioned a few times that the dog has scared off a few "creepy" guys while out walking with her. If we give her the command "guard" she starts barking and pulling on leash, and stays fixated and keeps amping herself up until we redirect her and move on.

I found the Leerburg website to be full of good information and ideas.

Sorry about the rambling post; just typing as I think.

[StraitR]

Life is super busy with a baby due in eight days and our daughters 4th B-day party in five. It will be a well thought out and researched purchase decision, starting with yes or no and followed by addressing any timing concerns we might have. My "honey do" list is RE-friggen-diculous at the moment, so first things first.

Just figuring out bloodlines and breeders is a daunting task, as it's definitely one of those "I don't know, what I don't know" at this point with GSDs. We did the same research on our Golden and paid $1500 for his immaculate bloodlines. While he's still healthy at seven years old, he suffers from massive allergies that were not present in either parent or their parents. Allergies are one thing, hip dysplasia is another. GSD prices that I've found have been double or several times what we paid for the Golden. We both expected this, so it's not a detractor, but price isn't a guaranteed indicator of quality. My car was expensive, and it sucks.

My major concern was touched on by LL in this statement.... "If you're gone 10-12 hrs a day and your spouse isn't used to a high(er) drive dog, guess what, despite your own alpha tendencies, you cannot provide a good home for a high(er) drive K9 breed"

We do have a super high drive 3yo daughter, and she's masterfully trained my wife without her even knowing it. Maybe it's a mommy thing, but at least the wife acknowledges the fact, and we've already started the discussion about how that would apply to the dog. This may be the deciding factor.

I'll try to put together a more comprehensive response based on the input from everyone, but I wanted to acknowledge and say thank you for the responses in the meantime.

[Chance]

We had a disagreement with the way some of policy's of the rescue and we no longer work with them.


Would you be willing to discuss the disagreement? Animal rescue is pretty much the only thing I'm a bleeding heart about, so hearing that a rescue organization was misbehaving is a little disconcerting.


Our eight year old Golden Retriever is an amazing dog, but he's never even seen condition yellow, let alone orange/red, and the only sound he pays attention to is that of something hitting the bottom of his food bowl.

You never really know with animals.

One time, after a technique adjustment on my end, my SO was making a noise that could have been interpreted as "distress." I had to stop, because the cat was about to attack me. Never seen the cat do that before; she's usually of the "humans are house staff" disposition, and I wouldn't have imagined she'd try to protect one of us.

My father had a similar experience with their 13-year-old, 20 pound schnauzer. And I've seen video (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?17128-Speed-Surprise-Violence-of-Action)of a cat saving a boy from a dog before, too.

I'm not recommending you get a cat or a schnauzer to guard your family, mind you. But I'd bet money if your goldie ever thought one of your family was in trouble, he'd step up.

[Trooper224]

Not to be dick, but maybe to be, it means German shepherd dog..

Intentionally being a dick here. Maybe typing in plain english would avoid any confusion? :p

[Trooper224]

Agreed. Funny my wife and I had the "boat anchor" conversation the other day. There is no way around it, they do complicate a lot of stuff.

One year as a surprise my wife looked into getting me another dobie as a birthday present. Fortunately, she'd been searching on the computer and had walked away without logging off, so I was able to see what she was doing. I had to tell her that "I don't want another dog." meant exactly that. After that we had two smaller mutts that my wife and youngest son brought home. When I transferred to my current assignment we got rid of them. My wife is now on board with the freedom that comes from not owning a pet.

[OnionsAndDragons]

I haven't had experience with permanent living arrangements with GSDs. I've worked with a few volunteering at shelters, and they all were great studies given the right trainers. Get a good foundation of training.

I have had multiple 1/2 GSD mutts. Our first was my first dog growing up; a GSD/Collie mix and an amazing hiking and alert dog. Since then 2 different GSD/Lab mixes that were high energy, pack oriented and moderately protective but easy to socialize.

My current dude, Doctor Gonzo, is a Lab/Aussie mix and is about perfect for us. High alertness with a good memory for who the friendlies are, great with the kids, but big and intimidating. He's getting old, and I'm not looking forward to the day.

This thread rekindles my occasional nagging desire to have a GSD around... But I'll probably stick with what has worked for me so far: a working dog halfbreed. Unless a great rescue opportunity comes up.

If you're dedicated to training and giving it attention, and either your wife or eldest can be your beta for the dog, I'm sure you'll do fine. Having someone around regularly is a must; working dogs go stir crazy easily.


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[Mjolnir]

Definitely getting a puppy so he/she will grow up with the kids, as everyone has pointed out. He/she will definitely attend appropriate training, along with myself.

Will look into the Dutch Shepard as well. Thanks

I've also considered a Mal, but based on what I read, they seem a little more high maintenance. As in needing to stay busy with daily tasks aside from guard duty. That's the sense I got from a few of LL's and Todd's posts. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Both the Malinois and Dutch Shepherd are HIGH DRIVE dogs. The Mal may be A BIT (but only a bit) more "drivey" but if you're not an experienced dog person... You may wish to look elsewhere or REALLY start learning do behavior, dog training and about the breeds you're interested in.


-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."

[Mjolnir]

Also, there is a HUGE difference between a working strain animal and a show dog strain or "pet strain" dog of any breed.

Working strain GSD are no joke. They are dominant and high-drive dogs. Make no mistake about it. Please.


-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."

[NEPAKevin]

Also, there is a HUGE difference between a working strain animal and a show dog strain or "pet strain" dog of any breed.

Working strain GSD are no joke. They are dominant and high-drive dogs. Make no mistake about it. Please.


-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."


Isn't this related to the difference between American and European lines? My understanding is that the European dogs tend to be high drive while the American ones are more laid back and aloof. I don't know if is a new thing, but a couple guys I know recently got dogs that were described as Chech GSDs?

[Dagga Boy]

Isn't this related to the difference between American and European lines? My understanding is that the European dogs tend to be high drive while the American ones are more laid back and aloof. I don't know if is a new thing, but a couple guys I know recently got dogs that were described as Chech GSDs?

One of the most impressive police K9's we ever had (and we had numerous great dogs) was a monstrous Czech Shepard. Long hair, blondish, it was essentially a police lion. Some of his bites were legendary (all four K9's through a skull), and one ER doc filed a complaint due to the level of injury on two felons (both very righteous bites and not excessive) from him. Brave as hell to. Went back under a house to haul out a felon who had stabbed him multiple times. Don't know about as a pet or companion, but I was impressed at how good ours was as a working dog.

[Mjolnir]

Isn't this related to the difference between American and European lines? My understanding is that the European dogs tend to be high drive while the American ones are more laid back and aloof. I don't know if is a new thing, but a couple guys I know recently got dogs that were described as Chech GSDs?

Yes and no.

We have working strains here, too, but I *believe* the Euro bloodlines to be "better".

Check out Leerburg's website.

Google "working strain, GSD" and don't make a move until you thoroughly understand what they are. If you're not an experienced dog person please pass.


-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."

[Failure2Stop]

I have 2 GSDs, and I don't think I'll ever own another breed.

Sitting on the couch, watching TV or whatever, seeing two dogs lying on their beds, staring at me with what can only be described as undyingly loyal devotion drives me to be the best possible Alpha to them. It is constantly obvious that we are their entire lives.

[Dagga Boy]

I have 2 GSDs, and I don't think I'll ever own another breed.

Sitting on the couch, watching TV or whatever, seeing two dogs lying on their beds, staring at me with what can only be described as undyingly loyal devotion drives me to be the best possible Alpha to them. It is constantly obvious that we are their entire lives.

Got approved last night from a rescue here as an adopter from their outstanding program. We go to our first adoption event today. I am looking forward to getting a Shepard again. As jacked up as the dog I had as a kid was, they were mainly problems with over protection and he was so loyal that it was a fault, but one you could appreciate. There is nothing like that look they give you that it is a given that they will do anything for their pack.
The hard thing about going through the rescue process is seeing the abuse cases. Some people need to be beaten to death for what they do to their animals and kids. One of the dogs we are looking at is an amputee from an abuse case.

[LittleLebowski]

I have 2 GSDs, and I don't think I'll ever own another breed.

Sitting on the couch, watching TV or whatever, seeing two dogs lying on their beds, staring at me with what can only be described as undyingly loyal devotion drives me to be the best possible Alpha to them. It is constantly obvious that we are their entire lives.

Yup. Fortunately, I have a loaner handy for when you visit next week :cool: She kept on checking on voodoo_man throughout the night when he stayed here :D

[LittleLebowski]

Got approved last night from a rescue here as an adopter from their outstanding program.

That was a LOT of work, congrats!


The hard thing about going through the rescue process is seeing the abuse cases. Some people need to be beaten to death for what they do to their animals and kids.

Concur, have club, will travel.

[Dagga Boy]

That was a LOT of work, congrats!.

I have been through easier background processes with high end EP jobs and other employment. I would imagine the worst thing you can do with one of these rescues is take them away from one abusive piece of crap and put them into another problem. It's funny, the lady who did my interview was German.....all she needed was the intense light over my head and it would have been complete.

"In looking at zee satellite photo of your home you have no grass". "Yes, but if you zoom out there is a park just four houses down". "So, at 3:00 AM and snowing and zee dog has diarrhea you will go to zee park with zee dog and stay with zem?"......sweat pouring down my head, "yes, I will stay with the dog.....no, I swear, I will, please believe me".

[JAD]

Is it safe?

[LittleLebowski]

I have been through easier background processes with high end EP jobs and other employment. I would imagine the worst thing you can do with one of these rescues is take them away from one abusive piece of crap and put them into another problem. It's funny, the lady who did my interview was German.....all she needed was the intense light over my head and it would have been complete.

"In looking at zee satellite photo of your home you have no grass". "Yes, but if you zoom out there is a park just four houses down". "So, at 3:00 AM and snowing and zee dog has diarrhea you will go to zee park with zee dog and stay with zem?"......sweat pouring down my head, "yes, I will stay with the dog.....no, I swear, I will, please believe me".

I laughed. Bunch of crazy, bored housewives is my experience with these adoption orgs.

[11B10]

My personal experience is that a Mal can be an excellent family dog but GSDs are better for that role. The problem is getting one of these Northern European herding breeds (the Mals, Duchies, and GSDs are what I speak of, very closely related) and encouraging their innate protective instincts without being in full control of said instincts, understanding what sets off said instincts, and knowing how to control the dog period plus not putting the dog in the wrong situation where its instinct is telling it to Do The Right Thing And Protect The Pack as per its ancestry. These Northern European herding breeds are so good at being K9 breeds because as opposed to say Border Collies, they were bred to walk a post, to patrol around the herd, and keep the herd safe.

Another problem is that folks endlessly preach that Mals are "furry chainsaws on meth" and then think that a GSD is "totally chill, no problem, treat it like a Lab," etc. GSDs are quite capable of nearly the same level of a similar but more pack oriented drive to protect and that drive can manifest itself without encouragement. So, your GSD still needs an Alpha and it still needs rules and a job to do. It definitely needs socialization as do Mals. Socialization is key to keeping the dog from biting strangers unexpectedly.

I adopted a full grown, high drive Mal. The dog was fantastic with toddlers, children, and newborn. He was also fantastic at Schutzhund. I'm not saying all Mals are capable of this but it's my belief you can shape the dog the way you want within reason.

It is absolutely true that GSDs are overbred and you need to be very fucking careful about the bloodline you choose. Case in point (http://www.seamammalswithgreys.org/column11/herders/werklijn_kynologische_lijn.jpg). However, the same goes with Mals. Get to know the sire and bitch of the bloodline. Figure out what you need, not what you want. If you're gone 10-12 hrs a day and your spouse isn't used to a high(er) drive dog, guess what, despite your own alpha tendencies, you cannot provide a good home for a high(er) drive K9 breed, even if it is "just" a GSD instead of that working dog line Mal that you're sure you need.

Right now, I have a medium-ish drive female GSD. Her health and hips are guaranteed for 5 years. She was raised in the breeder's home as a family. If I tussle with her, she'll grab my arm and shake it but she's never broken skin. I can whack her pretty good and throw her around but when we're play fighting, she is fearless and you just don't get that out of a Lab/Boxer, etc. If I'm paying rough with a boxer and whack him around, kick him medium hard while he's mouthing me, he's going to back down. Other dogs were not bred to have that warrior spirit and that's that. Realistically, nearly everyone on this forum only needs a dog that can alert the adults in the house as to a disturbance. However, the members of this community are the exception and let's face it, not all of our spouses possess the mindset to respond with the ability to protect themselves and the family if a dog alerts. The K9 breeds with the right rearing will fight and die for your family and that (plus I like smart dogs) is why I will always have a Mal or GSD in the home.

If you've gotten this far in my poorly worded screed about my experiences with these dogs, I recommend GSDs for most folks looking for a protective dog. I've personally found Dobermans too twitchy for my preference and a good friend who is a practicing veterinarian and Army veterinarian (Reserve officer) says he's not a fan of Dobermans. I have seen Dobermans I would own if I was single, though.

Original German Shepherd from over 100 years ago:
http://www.dragongsd.com/VA_Beowulf_vom_Nahegau.jpg

My high drive adoptee Mal:
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/Dogs/IMG_20130113_104107.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/Dogs/IMG_20130620_103747_zpsddda6c44.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/fbad8576.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/705b3688.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/5ae8b5b5.jpg


Don't know how I missed this post until now. IMHO, really solid analysis, LL - and the kids-with-dogs pictures are priceless. Thanks!

[Mitch]

That was a LOT of work, congrats!



Concur, have club, will travel.

I'm in, let's ride.

[LittleLebowski]

I'm in, let's ride.

It would not be safe to beat kids or dogs in front of folks on here.

[Chance]

I laughed. Bunch of crazy, bored housewives is my experience with these adoption orgs.

I was about to say.... Admirable commitment, but that was a little creepy.

[Dagga Boy]

Is it safe?

Not sure.....they did let you in. They all fall for your "just a geek" undercover look...;)

[Dagga Boy]

I laughed. Bunch of crazy, bored housewives is my experience with these adoption orgs.

I was impressed. Mostly "dog people" who are doing really good work. The foster folks are something special. Taking in some really tough cases, doing a ton of work, and then letting them go.

Getting the stories on these dogs first hand on the abuse, neglect, and just plain evil stuff is very hard. We got our hearts broken today. Found two dogs we really liked. One had been available for over a year because it was not a pure Shepard, but a half GSD half Cathaloua, which I liked. Finally had the family conference and tried to get the mix and it was adopted before they got my email. Still looking at the other one. 20 pounds overweight from owners who free fed the dog, fed table scraps, and walked her a couple times "a week". Then when they had to move didn't want her because she was too big. Already losing weight and we are waiting for a medical review as I have some hips concerns. We' ll see. The process is an emotional roller coaster.

[Ronin_Jedi]

OP,

Sorry, haven't read entire thread but consider a Hungarian Kuvasz. Very family-oriented and docile with kids, friendly with guests so long as family around and not threatening family. Tear you alive if you show up and family not there even if dog knows you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuvasz

Best

ETA: for clarity.

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[SeriousStudent]

I was impressed. Mostly "dog people" who are doing really good work. The foster folks are something special. Taking in some really tough cases, doing a ton of work, and then letting them go.

Getting the stories on these dogs first hand on the abuse, neglect, and just plain evil stuff is very hard. We got our hearts broken today. Found two dogs we really liked. One had been available for over a year because it was not a pure Shepard, but a half GSD half Cathaloua, which I liked. Finally had the family conference and tried to get the mix and it was adopted before they got my email. Still looking at the other one. 20 pounds overweight from owners who free fed the dog, fed table scraps, and walked her a couple times "a week". Then when they had to move didn't want her because she was too big. Already losing weight and we are waiting for a medical review as I have some hips concerns. We' ll see. The process is an emotional roller coaster.

Good luck with the process. My GSD is a rescue, and I have never had a more loyal friend.

And he likes Chuck, so you know he's a good judge of character. :D

[Jackdog]

Got approved last night from a rescue here as an adopter from their outstanding program. We go to our first adoption event today. I am looking forward to getting a Shepard again.

Hey DB! Which rescue did you use? I used Good Shepard Rescue and Sanctuary of North Texas to adopt my GSD 2 years ago. Got the same type of grilling about my house, yard, Fence, kids etc. he is a great pup and very protective of the house and yard and family.

On a different note, got a couple of houses for sell in my town. All on one acre lots.



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[Dagga Boy]

Hey DB! Which rescue did you use? I used Good Shepard Rescue and Sanctuary of North Texas to adopt my GSD 2 years ago. Got the same type of grilling about my house, yard, Fence, kids etc. he is a great pup and very protective of the house and yard and family.

On a different note, got a couple of houses for sell in my town. All on one acre lots.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep, same place. One of our regular students and a friend has gotten three from them. They seem very squared away and do a very good job.

[Jackdog]

Yep, same place. One of our regular students and a friend has gotten three from them. They seem very squared away and do a very good job.

Yeah, they are pretty good. Went out to the rescue ranch for the meet and greet on Jäger. Then back to for the adoption After the vet visit. I'm impressed enough with there operation to also donate money to assist. If I can talk my wife into it we will get another one after the middle daughter graduates, gets married and moves out this fall with her Boston Terrier.


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[Dagga Boy]

We are going to the ranch next weekend. Hopefully it will go well.

[98z28]

And as far as dog training goes. I have made the switch from using adversives (pinch collars, shock collars and other painfull devices) to use positive training. I enjoy it much more and so do the dogs. You can find a trainer that uses positive methods here (https://apdt.com/default.aspx)
Us too. It made a significant difference in how quickly our GSD mix picked up consistent behavior. He is far more motivated by rewards than by avoiding a negative outcome. I don't know if it's a personality quirk with our one dog, or if positive training is more effective in general. Our neighbors got a puppy about the same time we did and decided to use a shock collar for training. Their dog will behave as long as the collar is on and functioning. Once the collar is off, he goes crazy. Good luck getting him back when he runs outside the range of the collar.

No such issues with our pup. He is just about always well behaved because he knows he'll get neck scratches, belly rubs and treats for following specific directions (e.g. sit, stay, come here, lay down, etc.).

Definitely seek professional training for you and the dog early. We didn't and wish we had. You already said you would, but it's important enough to repeat. We adopted our dog at nine months (rescue) and he was eager to figure out his place in the family and what his jobs were. Some things would have gone much faster with professional help.

GSDs won't sit around and wait for you to give them a job. They'll find something to do, which usually includes chewing up your stuff. Having a base of commands and activities from training is very helpful in directing the dog's energy.

Be ready to walk and play...a lot! I read somewhere that a tired GSD is a well behaved GSD. That's been true for us. Our dog plays two to three games of fetch each day at about 15 minutes each game. We also go for a ~30 minute walk in the woods each day, weather permitting. That's an hour or more of time with the dog each day. Any less and he gets bored.

I'll throw this in since it sounds like you'll be in a similar situation as us: Our dog needs as much direction from my wife as he needs from me. My wife home schools our oldest son during the day while I'm at work. Jake (our dog) would constantly pester my wife and son while they were in the middle of lessons. He'd whine at their feet trying to get them to play or otherwise pay attention to him. When they'd ignore him, he'd go to another part of the house and chew up the carpet and furniture. So my wife gave him a job. During the lessons, Jake's job is to sit or lay down and listen to the lesson. Between lessons, they'll go outside and play or practice commands. It's worked great. Jake just needed someone to tell him what his job was.

As someone else mentioned, be ready to live with the hair. I grew up with multiple large dogs in the house and never experienced this much shedding. It's insane. We use a FURminator daily. It helps, but there's no eliminating the hair.

Our pup LOVES to chew stuff up. He figured out quickly what he is allowed to chew and what he isn't, but we have to keep plenty of bones around for him to chew up or he will find something to chew.

I'd also back up an earlier comment on socializing the dog. I'm not sure you could over do it with a GSD. We live in a neighborhood with a lot of young families. Our house is like grand central station. We have neighborhood kids, adults, and pets over just about everyday. Jake is the biggest, sweetest, goofiest puppy with people and animals he knows. He's downright scary with strangers. He won't let a stranger approach the kids until me or my wife tell him it's OK. I'd hate to see how he'd be without a lot of exposure to other people and animals.

Good luck on your research and search for a pet. It's a lot of work, but it sure is rewarding (kind of like having kids).

Just finished a game of fetch: http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160327/db1a41337746e6573f26875fc772cf1b.jpg

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[LittleLebowski]

Snapped this pic of my girl today. Look at that good back!

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/6368B89A-6685-4B78-83F4-3CEE134CBB11_zpsqolsaper.jpg

[11B10]

Snapped this pic of my girl today. Look at that good back!

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/6368B89A-6685-4B78-83F4-3CEE134CBB11_zpsqolsaper.jpg


She's locked on to something/body - that's for sure! Good looking canine, Sir. May I ask what she weighs?

[LittleLebowski]

She's locked on to something/body - that's for sure! Good looking canine, Sir. May I ask what she weighs?

I think it was a squirrel. 85lbs.

[Dagga Boy]

I think it was a squirrel. 85lbs.

That is the goal weight for the one we are looking at right now. She was brought in at 105.....:(

[Shellback]

Definitely getting a puppy so he/she will grow up with the kids, as everyone has pointed out.

Personally, I don't think it's necessary. Why would you want to clean up poop from 2 little animals? ;) We got a 4 year old Mal, after our Boxer died, and he bonded with our family almost immediately. ETA - The Mal's a lot more work than the Boxer was and if I was going to recommend a family friendly, fun dog, I'd go with the Boxer. I've never had a GSD but more than likely that will change in the near future.

http://i68.tinypic.com/6qi2p0.jpg

http://i67.tinypic.com/fwlwte.jpg

[Mjolnir]

OP,

Sorry, haven't read entire thread but consider a Hungarian Kuvasz. Very family-oriented and docile with kids, friendly with guests so long as family around and not threatening family. Tear you alive if you show up and family not there even if dog knows you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuvasz

Best

ETA: for clarity.

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

The "tear you apart of the family isn't at home even if it knows you" that nails your sensitive parts to the ceiling in court.

I feel you; but I'm trying to be a voice of reason relative to the state of the nation.

BTW, ALL of the livestock guardian breeds are like this and most of the livestock herding dogs make superb "watchdogs".

The LGDs and the Molossers (Old World Mastiff breeds) which the Kangal and Alabai are, btw, are amongst the most stable temperament dogs (depending on breeding, of course).

All bets are off on the AKC show dogs. Not that they are biters; they are bred for confirmation first and foremost NOT function which is what temperament is.

No easy answer.

[LittleLebowski]

OP,

Sorry, haven't read entire thread but consider a Hungarian Kuvasz. Very family-oriented and docile with kids, friendly with guests so long as family around and not threatening family. Tear you alive if you show up and family not there even if dog knows you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuvasz



Have you owned one?

[Mjolnir]

Have you owned one?

Had a friend who did and it was just as he described.

I hated that damned dog...

LOL

Wouldn't let us out of the pool. Couldn't do anything if the owner/alpha wasn't in close vicinity and watching. We were just kids.

If it had more rigorous, structured training he would have been awesome, though.

[Ronin_Jedi]

Have you owned one?
Hi, no. But an ex-client of mine did. Looked like a polar bear - really. Very furry (whitish), big and strong. Stood up to my chin when on 2 legs (I'm 6.1).

Friendly when I visited the client. Decided to research the breed and learned of its traits, confirmed by my client at the time. But felt it too furry for hot and humid south Luziana (Louisiana).

Best

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Ronin_Jedi]

Had a friend who did and it was just as he described.

I hated that damned dog...

LOL

Wouldn't let us out of the pool. Couldn't do anything if the owner/alpha wasn't in close vicinity and watching. We were just kids.

If it had more rigorous, structured training he would have been awesome, though.
Interesting. Was quite friendly with me whenever I was there, but then I was always with the client or his wife, so I never felt threatened.

Suppose to be very gentle with kids; can pull its long hair, even ride it like a horse, and it won't bite them. Very protective of entire family.

Best

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Mjolnir]

Interesting. Was quite friendly with me whenever I was there, but then I was always with the client or his wife, so I never felt threatened.

Suppose to be very gentle with kids; can pull its long hair, even ride it like a horse, and it won't bite them. Very protective of entire family.

Best

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

Comment çava, mon ami! (BTR, LA)

Yeah, he was always watchful. When the head of the household was home he'd lie at his feet but watching. Always. When the HOH would step inside he'd stand up and watch us intently.

I've no doubt that he would have pinned us; not sure he'd bite unless you ran.

I'm a working bulldog (Pit Bulldog) man, myself so that was alien dog behavior to me as gamebred Bulldogs don't usually show that much interest in humans and unless you began to stomp the owner or family member they'd just wag their tails and lick you.

To be fair, the average guy does not need an attack dog or personal protection dog. They just do not. If one thinks he does he'd better:

(A) be a through and through knowledgeable dog person;

(B) have lots of experience with personal protection / livestock guardians, livestock herders and Molossers;

(C) be a capable dog trainer; purchasing a puppy then HAVING to go to school to train the dog is sad and with the breeds we are speaking about is potentially dangerous.

A working strain GSD with good hips ($$$$) is a remarkable animal and is probably the best all around dog, all things considered.

But be aware that ALL dogs are INDIVIDUALS and some will NOT track the "typical breed temperament". Never leave your child with the dog unattended. If the dog "is for the child" I would wait until the child is about 4 or 5 years old - they can help take care of it and you can teach them how to behave and interact with the dog.

If the dog is an immediate need then by all means look into it now. But caveat emptor: a dog is a pistol that can press its own trigger: while you're with it YOU determine the level of threat and YOU control the dog's reaction to same; when you're not around the dog will do this all by itself - correctly or incorrectly...

[Ronin_Jedi]

Mjolnir

I agree, This guy had it to protect his petit wife and of course the house, as it was just the two of them.

Love German Sheps, always have. My current one is a Plot Hound rescue. Took one look at her and she bought me.

And I agree people need remember that dogs are dogs, individuals, and can be like a loaded gun. Especially around kids and strangers.

Mine, sadly, is not socialized much and has a tendency to paw or even pounce on dogs introduced to. She's 5-ish so we need to constantly work on it. Around people she's fine, though a bit rambunctious.

But this threads about GSDs, not Plots.

Best

Sent from my Sero 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Peally]

If they're really bad you can just send them off to jail.

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[Armiger]

Lots of good info in here, OP.

Whatever you do, find a trainer and stay the course.


Older shot of our young kydex QC inspector overseeing a quick photoshoot...

http://i.imgur.com/GH7GzDI.jpg

[Dagga Boy]

Pick her up in a week after spaying. Can't wait!

[SeriousStudent]

Good girl! :)

[Jackdog]

Gorgeous girl!

[HCM]

Nice !

[Mike Pipes]

Pick her up in a week after spaying. Can't wait!

Nothing quite like a GSD......hope you enjoy her as much as we enjoy ours!

[JMorse]

I've had 3 shepherds, all wonderful dogs. I'd get another in a second, and don't think I'd seriously consider another breed, apart from a Lab.

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I

[Dagga Boy]

Brought Dolly home last night. Unbelievably mellow dog and just a sweetheart who seems very happy being in a spoiled rotten environment rather than where she came from.

[SeriousStudent]

She does look very happy.

And we spoilers prefer to use the term "appreciated" rather than spoiled. :cool:

[11B10]

Brought Dolly home last night. Unbelievably mellow dog and just a sweetheart who seems very happy being in a spoiled rotten environment rather than where she came from.


nyeti - that is one fine looking canine, Sir!

[PNWTO]

GSD's?? Here's my monster.

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[Dagga Boy]

That puppy is really cute!

[breakingtime91]

Brought Dolly home last night. Unbelievably mellow dog and just a sweetheart who seems very happy being in a spoiled rotten environment rather than where she came from.

thats awesome. If it were up to my wife we would of rescued 6 different GSD by now... two is enough lol

[Dagga Boy]

thats awesome. If it were up to my wife we would of rescued 6 different GSD by now... two is enough lol

The biggest battle with this process was my "Just one" rule. Because of our lifestyle, one dog is ideal. Of course, when you get to these rescue places you want to take the whole place home......which is how you become a rescue. It is just tough seeing all these wonderful dogs and cannot fathom the crap people have done to them. The only one that I appreciated was the dog they had just taken in that was pretty and in great shape. The owner gave the dog up as they could not afford to properly care for the dog. I would rather see that than not caring for the dog, or starving them.

[Ed L]

Congrats to Nyeti on the adoption.

A question: are Rottweilers more lay-around-the-house type dogs than shepherds and require less activity?

I've only owned a Rottie, never a Shepherd.

thanks,

[LittleLebowski]

A question: are Rottweilers more lay-around-the-house type dogs than shepherds and require less activity?



Yes, they are. I like them but I don't like the drool from the Molossor breeds (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molosser) and generally speaking, the GSDs are smarter and more eager to please.

[LittleLebowski]

Pick her up in a week after spaying. Can't wait!

Good job. It will take a few weeks, maybe even a couple of months to really to see her true personality, speaking from my experience of adopting a full grown GSD and a full grown Malinois. Just remind yourself of that as she settles into your house. Her protectiveness will almost certainly grow with time, just let her settle in.

[JMorse]

Brought Dolly home last night. Unbelievably mellow dog and just a sweetheart who seems very happy being in a spoiled rotten environment rather than where she came from.

She's beautiful. Congrats nyeti.

[Dagga Boy]

Congrats to Nyeti on the adoption.

A question: are Rottweilers more lay-around-the-house type dogs than shepherds and require less activity?

I've only owned a Rottie, never a Shepherd.

thanks,

My Rottie was far more active than this shepherd. It is hard to make any judgements because when you are adopting rescues, you really don't know what "training" or lack of went into the dog before you. Right now, we are going on short walks to the park or around the block 6 times a day, otherwise....Dolly is camped out somewhere. I am hoping for a her to settle in in a few weeks to realize it is her house. The pool guy came today....got a head lift and a stare. Our Chiwienie went nuts when the pool guy came, or mailman, UPS, etc. I have yet to hear the dog bark....which from having a GSD before is a blessing. She is now coming to the window when she hears me pull in the driveway, so it is daily progress. She also moves with me around the house and always wants to be close. Funny....she is not a morning dog. Absolutely refuses to budge for my girlfriend who wakes up at the crack of dawn and has been trying to take her out. Also, this is the first big dog I have ever had who does not need a choke or pinch collar. Overall, still overjoyed and glad we got the dog we did.

[breakingtime91]

My Rottie was far more active than this shepherd. It is hard to make any judgements because when you are adopting rescues, you really don't know what "training" or lack of went into the dog before you. Right now, we are going on short walks to the park or around the block 6 times a day, otherwise....Dolly is camped out somewhere. I am hoping for a her to settle in in a few weeks to realize it is her house. The pool guy came today....got a head lift and a stare. Our Chiwienie went nuts when the pool guy came, or mailman, UPS, etc. I have yet to hear the dog bark....which from having a GSD before is a blessing. She is now coming to the window when she hears me pull in the driveway, so it is daily progress. She also moves with me around the house and always wants to be close. Funny....she is not a morning dog. Absolutely refuses to budge for my girlfriend who wakes up at the crack of dawn and has been trying to take her out. Also, this is the first big dog I have ever had who does not need a choke or pinch collar. Overall, still overjoyed and glad we got the dog we did.

my female shepherd gets up in the morning, eats, gets let out, and runs straight back up to the bed to go sleep next to my wife... Lasiest/most perfect dog I have ever had.

[11B10]

If they're really bad you can just send them off to jail.

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I LOVE this picture ^^^^!

[breakingtime91]

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My female GSD gets mad at my wife and puts her shoes all over the house. Doesn't chew them, just places them in obvious places to show her disdain. Never had dog quite like her. As soon as you grab the shoe she goes in what we call "oh shit" mode.

[olstyn]

My female GSD gets mad at my wife and puts her shoes all over the house. Doesn't chew them, just places them in obvious places to show her disdain. Never had dog quite like her. As soon as you grab the shoe she goes in what we call "oh shit" mode.

That is straight-up hilarious. *Almost* makes me want a dog, even though I really don't have the space for one. (Our 800 sq ft condo is not exactly "real" dog compatible.)

[Peally]

I LOVE this picture ^^^^!

It's OK, he did his time for public nudity and eventually got a position on the force.

God help you if he's your backup though, he has a short attention span and no thumbs.

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[Flamingo]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160414/bcb34de1e03560a277f6ffb76bb8564c.jpg

Here is my beast. She is from East German lines. We got pretty lucky, she loves the cat and spends a lot of time herding him around the house.

The only thing she likes more than the cat is a ball, and she is in heaven if we let her have a ball in her mouth when she herds the cat.

I wish I would have done some protection training with her, but I spent too much time overseas.

[Dagga Boy]

Question for the experts...Things are going great with the new dog. She loves us, we love her, lots of walks, hates squirrels and cats, is losing weight, never had an accident in the house, etc...

Problem, she has gotten VERY protective. My dad is at the house 4-5 days a week, and she is now barking, snarling, and if I wasn't home, likely would not allow him in. First week, she was laying next to him on the floor so he could pet her while he was laying on the couch. It is now that way when walking where she just doesn't like most people outside our family. This is not a huge concern, but I really want to have company without risking them getting bit. My last shepherd was the same way and ended up biting a lot of people when I was a teen. Anyway to train them to like specific people? She will not even take a treat from my dad.

[Peally]

My initial reaction would be: get a shitload of socialization and training in with various people/things in various places, but I'll let the more knowledgeable chime in.

[LittleLebowski]

Question for the experts...Things are going great with the new dog. She loves us, we love her, lots of walks, hates squirrels and cats, is losing weight, never had an accident in the house, etc...

Problem, she has gotten VERY protective. My dad is at the house 4-5 days a week, and she is now barking, snarling, and if I wasn't home, likely would not allow him in. First week, she was laying next to him on the floor so he could pet her while he was laying on the couch. It is now that way when walking where she just doesn't like most people outside our family. This is not a huge concern, but I really want to have company without risking them getting bit. My last shepherd was the same way and ended up biting a lot of people when I was a teen. Anyway to train them to like specific people? She will not even take a treat from my dad.


Dog parks. Lots and lots of time there. Also, walks in public with a pinch collar and muzzled if need be. Also, your dad CANNOT show fear nor act suspicious in her eyes. He needs to greet her as an old buddy verbally and have her favorite food in hand. He needs to act overjoyed to see her.

Dog parks. Walks in public. Rinse, repeat.

[LittleLebowski]

Thursday, I was bucking logs with my chainsaw (also German :D). My son was watching from a safe distance with hearing protection on and I was fully kitted out in PPE.

Anyway, I noticed that our GSD Margaret Thatcher Lebowski or Maggie for short, was on edge and nervous. She would NOT let that evil chainsaw get close to my 3.5 yr old son and was in front of him and glued to him like white on rice. It took me a while to figure out what she was doing but I did immediately clue in on the fact that she was perturbed about something. I'm talking less than one 3.5 yr old boy's arms length from him to the dog that was constantly positioning herself between him and the chainsaw. This went on over an hour.

German Shepherd being a good shepherd. #JustGermanShepherdThings

[Willard]

Thursday, I was bucking logs with my chainsaw (also German :D). My son was watching from a safe distance with hearing protection on and I was fully kitted out in PPE.

Anyway, I noticed that our GSD Margaret Thatcher Lebowski or Maggie for short, was on edge and nervous. She would NOT let that evil chainsaw get close to my 3.5 yr old son and was in front of him and glued to him like white on rice. It took me a while to figure out what she was doing but I did immediately clue in on the fact that she was perturbed about something. I'm talking less than one 3.5 yr old boy's arms length from him to the dog that was constantly positioning herself between him and the chainsaw. This went on over an hour.

German Shepherd being a good shepherd. #JustGermanShepherdThings

LL,

You may already be watching for this, or it may sound silly, but guard against the dog having a go at the chainsaw. I once knew of a Dutch Shepherd that would attack the lawnmower when the owner started it. Almost was ugly first time, as it was unexpected. The dog had perviously not shown any particular interest in running mowers outside (dog was typically indoors when owner mowed) or when neighbors mowed. Perhaps the dog saw the owner pushing it and thought it was some kind of struggle and owner was in danger. You just never know what they are thinking. Happily, the dog was not hurt and appropriate precautions were exercised from then on. Would have felt bad if something happened and I hadn't chimed in.

[LittleLebowski]

LL,

You may already be watching for this, or it may sound silly, but guard against the dog having a go at the chainsaw. I once knew of a Dutch Shepherd that would attack the lawnmower when the owner started it. Almost was ugly first time, as it was unexpected. The dog had perviously not shown any particular interest in running mowers outside (dog was typically indoors when owner mowed) or when neighbors mowed. Perhaps the dog saw the owner pushing it and thought it was some kind of struggle and owner was in danger. You just never know what they are thinking. Happily, the dog was not hurt and appropriate precautions were exercised from then on. Would have felt bad if something happened and I hadn't chimed in.

Oh yeah, two dogs ago I had a GSD that would go after the push mower but I fixed that. I don't think that this girl has that inclination at all with regards to my beloved chainsaw.

[Mickey]

Anyway to train them to like specific people? She will not even take a treat from my dad.

Use a HIGH value treat that she only gets when that person is around. You will need to be the one feeding her the treats, at least at first. Don't have your dad (or whoever you want her to like) give her the treats, people have been bitten doing this before.
That's because they are conflicted about the person, but that person has a treat. But once they get the treat the dog is no longer conflicted and that's when a bite will happen.

But if that doesn't work you might contact the rescue and see if they have a trainer that the use or would recommend.

[LittleLebowski]

Sent you a PM, nyeti.

[NEPAKevin]

Oh yeah, two dogs ago I had a GSD that would go after the push mower but I fixed that. I don't think that this girl has that inclination at all with regards to my beloved chainsaw.

Friend told me his one Corgi had a real dislike for mowers. We had a female shepherd who considered vacuums to be the spawn of Satan.

[Peally]

Vacuums are hilarious. My guy will play fight with them but is paranoid about being touched by the wand bit.

[Alembic]

Thought this thread needed to be kept alive.

9684

Mom on the left, daughter on the right.

[Tuesday]

Great suggestions. The Monks first book, The Art of Raising a Puppy is excellent, and a must for any first time puppy owner, regardless of breed. Unfortunately, I loaned it out years ago and never received it back. And FYI, book thieves make poor dog owners IME.


They did you a favor. The book is hilariously bad and contrary to established best practices.

Here are few links to peer-reviewed journal articles:

https://positively.com/dog-training/positive-training/the-science-behind-positive-training/

[Alembic]

Mom is second generation out of Slovakia, no papers, sire's owner had just come over from the old country and had no interest in the AKC. Pup's sire, Kazan was also paperless He was owned by a Czech family in our little Colorado ski town. Both dogs had a known history of good health and good hips going back many generations. She approached us, and after a year we gave in and let the adults get together. The result was a litter of just two females. Alpha and Beta, born Dec. 15, 2014, negative 20 outside. The sire's owner was unable to take a female, Kazan was still intact. Alpha went to a friend who was well experienced with Shepherds. We kept Beta. My daughter renamed Beta "Chilly".

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[Duelist]

Beautiful! My wife's allergies preclude a GSD, but they are amazing dogs and I'm jealous of your good fortune.

[Alembic]

Yep, I'm very lucky, but they are a hand full. I joke they're my kids that won't grow up.

We put in a minimum of two hours a day with them, sometimes just walking in the morning and at night, other times they are the center of attention for most of the day. We play hide and seek and fetch, ball vs. stick vs other toys. Try to keep their mind engaged. Other times just an afternoon swimming in a pond or river.

In reference previous posts, just be honest with yourself, if you want a dog, but can't put the time in, get a Bernese Mountain Dog, they're protective and lazy.

[Duelist]

I have a great little Brittany. Her amount of hair and shedding is our limit of tolerance for my poor spouse's allergies. Our previous dog was a Schnauzer, but they're a little tough to hunt birds with. And you're absolutely right - time every day focusing on them and getting them the exercise they need is key to having a harmonious pet and home experience.

[NEPAKevin]

We have a new addition to the family. After loosing Remi to a nine month struggle with an aggressive adenocarcinoma, I wasn't sure if I was ready to get another dog, but household six mentioned in passing that one of the local shelters had six GSDs of various ages. So we went to "AWSOME (https://www.awsomanimals.org/)" to donate Remi's left over bag of kibble and "just look at" the sheps, which I knew was bullshit when I said it. We adopted the one that had been there the longest who had been taken from her previous owners by the local police for neglect. One and a half year old female with a flop ear which we renamed Sadie(as per HH6 who wasn't a fan of her old name). Apparently, I managed to wear her out a little on our last outing.

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[blues]

^^^^^

Well done, my friend. :cool:

Kind of how our current resident arrived at the household after losing my Weim in my avatar. :cool:

[Ichiban]

Well done.

You will be rewarded beyond measure. The rescued ones understand what has happened to them.

[JAD]

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Our GSD/something mix was a rescue, a stray from a rural town who had several litters and whose teats dragged the floor — we knew she had slim chances so we grabbed her. She has a frenetic aversion to storm drains. I don’t know what fresh hell she found in one some dark day in her past, but I block traffic to go into the street with her so she can walk the yellow line between them.

[DDTSGM]

Your a good person JAD.

[fixer]

I've only ever had rescue dogs of varying breeds and yes they are intensely loyal and appreciative.

The rescue GSD I had many many years ago took what I remember to be about 6 months to acclimate to everything.

The lab I rescued took about half that.

[JohnO]

Two GSDs here. My female turned 5 yesterday. My male will be 4 in December. Both are trained in German and have done obedience, protection and nose work.

My sons were constantly asking to get a GSD and for the longest time the timing wasn't right. Partly because my wife was afraid/concerned about the breed and we had a dog/s at the time. She was very hesitant but finally became comfortable with the idea.

I did my homework looking for the right dog. I learned not all GSDs are created equal. Just like any breed there are GSDs that are a 'coat of paint', meaning GSD looks on the outside generic dog on the inside. Quality purpose breed GSDs range widely in their level of 'drive'. A GSD suitable for police or military work may not be a great family dog (not impossible but it takes a special dog that can be comfortable in both worlds). However from what I have seen a GSD stands a better chance of bridging that gap than a Belgian Mal.

I relied on the recommendations from a few LEOs I know who all pointed me in the same direction. https://grassoshepherds.com/ourDogs.html

Crate training has been the way to go and in my opinion should be done with every dog. I've housebroken or been around (as a kid) many many dogs. Struggling to teach them to do their business outside can be a challenge. I can count the total number of times my two GSDs had an accident in the house on one hand. The crate works! They were never left alone. When they were puppies I put their crates next to my bed and elevated it to bed top level. They could see me all night. My wife is jealous of the attention I get and how the dogs eyes follow my every move.

Speaking of my wife, the one that was concerned about getting a GSD and thought we should stay with a sporting breed like a Golden. She is the one who encouraged me to get the 2nd GSD. She was so enamored with our 1st GSD she wanted a 2nd. A total change in heart about the breed once familiar.

The reason why Amazon, UPS & FedEx can be reluctant to deliver.
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Male vs. Female size comparison.
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On one of out daily outings.
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[Balisong]

We have a new addition to the family. After loosing Remi to a nine month struggle with an aggressive adenocarcinoma, I wasn't sure if I was ready to get another dog, but household six mentioned in passing that one of the local shelters had six GSDs of various ages. So we went to "AWSOME (https://www.awsomanimals.org/)" to donate Remi's left over bag of kibble and "just look at" the sheps, which I knew was bullshit when I said it. We adopted the one that had been there the longest who had been taken from her previous owners by the local police for neglect. One and a half year old female with a flop ear which we renamed Sadie(as per HH6 who wasn't a fan of her old name). Apparently, I managed to wear her out a little on our last outing.

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She is gorgeous! Thank you for providing a good home to a sweet girl in need. I'm very sorry to hear about Remy :( it looks like you gave him a good home for 12 years, and I'm sure he loved every minute of it. Every time that time comes, I don't know how I could possibly do it with another dog, but I always do and they're always worth the inevitable heartbreak. I figure best we can do is make their time on earth as good as it can be for them. And they always seem to do the same in return.

[JAD]

Your a good person JAD.
No, but I know what to do about it.

[NEPAKevin]

She is gorgeous! ... Every time that time comes, I don't know how I could possibly do it with another dog, but I always do and they're always worth the inevitable heartbreak. I figure best we can do is make their time on earth as good as it can be for them. And they always seem to do the same in return.

Thanks. And that last part sums up our experiences very well.

[DDTSGM]

[QUOTE=JohnO;1278338]When they were puppies I put their crates next to my bed and elevated it to bed top level. They could see me all night. My wife is jealous of the attention I get and how the dogs eyes follow my every move.

Male vs. Female size comparison.
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Hey you stole my dogs!

[dsa]

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This is our boy, 3 yo recently earned his IGP1 (modern version of Schutzhund 1) this summer. Our first GSD, wish I would have got into them earlier. Amazing dogs.

[Bratch]

Double post

[Bratch]

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That’s our little monster. He’s a rescue that we got about 18 months ago, currently about 3 y/o.We have definitely had some adjustment pains. He doing good with me and the wife but still dislikes others even people who he liked previously.

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His favorite thing to do is sit at the edge of the house and patrol. We refer to that as Patrol Point Alpha and it offers a >180* view, he’ll spend hours watching and letting the world know he is there.

[Flamingo]

Here is my beast, she is 11 now so she isn't as mobile as she used to be. She still loves to chase Frisbees (but not balls). She has worked through a gang of indestructible ones.

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[Borderland]

My neighbor keeps his dads GS every summer. She used to come and visit us almost everyday and hang out. Might have been the chicken treats I gave her, I don't know. Really nice dog and very intelligent. When I talked to her she listened intently. Very well behaved and friendly. She acted like she was on vacation and respected the fact that my Wirehaired Griffon ran the place. Socialized with other dogs and people very well. Haven't seen that with too many other breeds but mostly I've been around bird dogs. The Rots and Dobermans I've been around I've never cared for much.