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Korenwolf
10-16-2011, 12:10 PM
Two McDonald's customers get into an argument with the cashier. What follows is a slap in the cashiers face, he shoves (or slaps not clear), and the female customers decide to jump over the counter. The cashier retreats to the back of the kitchen, and returns with a metal rod, and beats the two women. The two women lay on the ground and are beaten, apparently in order to keep them on the ground.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tFvPKHABgk&feature=player_embedded

Some background information:
http://www.dnainfo.com/20111014/greenwich-village-soho/mcdonalds-cashier-caught-on-cell-phone-video-beating-unruly-customers


My question is of course what would you do?
What if the guy was CCW-ing? I know this is a NY no-no (in most cases), but for the sake of argument, what would you do if you were CCW-ing and found yourself in that situation?

TCinVA
10-16-2011, 02:42 PM
My question is of course what would you do?
What if the guy was CCW-ing? I know this is a NY no-no (in most cases), but for the sake of argument, what would you do if you were CCW-ing and found yourself in that situation?

If by "in that situation" you mean if you have the same view of events that the cell phone has, it's simple: Leave. A group of idiots bent on mutual combat is a problem you leave the police to deal with. Odds are that in the moments prior to when the footage picks up there was some sort of verbal altercation that led to it getting physical. When you see such an altercation taking place it's God's little way of telling you that a swirling torrent of stupidity is forming and it would be best to not be there when the massive dumbass funnel cloud touches down.

If by "in that situation" you mean if you have the same view of events that the cell phone has when the McDonald's employee is beating the two women with a stick: Laugh, then leave. Then laugh some more. If one wishes to not get hit by an angry dude with a stick, then one probably shouldn't call him names, slap him, and then chase him behind the counter. He might just get ticked off and decide to beat you like a drum. The man's level of force may have been excessive, but that's not your problem. Intervening in that situation isn't something you do unless you have a duty to do so that you adopted when you signed up for a badge.

If by "in that situation" you mean being the McDonald's employee, there's nothing I see in the video that shows a lethal threat...so he wouldn't have been justified in shooting the women.

Kyle Reese
10-16-2011, 03:39 PM
If by "in that situation" you mean if you have the same view of events that the cell phone has, it's simple: Leave. A group of idiots bent on mutual combat is a problem you leave the police to deal with. Odds are that in the moments prior to when the footage picks up there was some sort of verbal altercation that led to it getting physical. When you see such an altercation taking place it's God's little way of telling you that a swirling torrent of stupidity is forming and it would be best to not be there when the massive dumbass funnel cloud touches down.

If by "in that situation" you mean if you have the same view of events that the cell phone has when the McDonald's employee is beating the two women with a stick: Laugh, then leave. Then laugh some more. If one wishes to not get hit by an angry dude with a stick, then one probably shouldn't call him names, slap him, and then chase him behind the counter. He might just get ticked off and decide to beat you like a drum. The man's level of force may have been excessive, but that's not your problem. Intervening in that situation isn't something you do unless you have a duty to do so that you adopted when you signed up for a badge.

If by "in that situation" you mean being the McDonald's employee, there's nothing I see in the video that shows a lethal threat...so he wouldn't have been justified in shooting the women.

This.

SecondsCount
10-16-2011, 03:46 PM
First post nails it. :)

Korenwolf
10-16-2011, 04:35 PM
If by "in that situation" you mean if you have the same view of events that...............


Apologies, yes I was referring to the McDonald's employees view. Indeed there seems to be no lethal threat.

And all the other viewpoints outlined: I agree. I would have probably left at the first sign of trouble........something about stupid games and associated prizes

Ga Shooter
10-16-2011, 06:13 PM
First post is dead on. As a side note the McDonald's employee is being charged pretty heavily for the excess force. I don't remember excatly but I think weapon charges and malicious assault.

Korenwolf
10-16-2011, 08:17 PM
Felony assault and criminal possession of a weapon for the cashier. He seems to be in bigger problems however, as it seems he is on parole for a manslaughter sentence.

The two women were charged with menacing, trespass & disorderly conduct.

Kyle Reese
10-16-2011, 08:20 PM
Felony assault and criminal possession of a weapon for the cashier. He seems to be in bigger problems however, as it seems he is on parole for a manslaughter sentence.

The two women were charged with menacing, trespass & disorderly conduct.

I'm shocked. I had them all pegged as Rhodes Scholars.

Korenwolf
10-16-2011, 08:35 PM
I'm shocked. I had them all pegged as Rhodes Scholars.

ROFL LOL

TCinVA
10-16-2011, 09:04 PM
When you deal with strangers you have no way of knowing how deep that rabbit hole goes. In this case the two dimwit customers apparently picked a fight with someone who had already killed a man. The sort of man who would waste no time in finding a weapon and proceeding to literally crack their skull.

In Virginia a couple of weeks ago a dumbass gangbanger was wandering around a college town threatening people with a realistic airsoft gun. The last guy he threatened with this realistic looking airsoft pistol pulled a Ruger LCP and shot him in the leg. The round bounced off his femur and then went through both of his testicles. I don't yet have any feedback on whether or not he got himself neutered before he was able to reproduce.

It doesn't sound very macho to say this, but your chances of ending up with a cracked skull or a 90 grain JHP vasectomy are considerably lessened if you refuse to participate in stupidity. This means that if someone starts jawjacking at you, do not jawjack back...just get away. If you see a stupid situation developing, extricate yourself from it with all possible speed. Drop whatever you have to in that instant and get away from the problem. This may mean some inconvenience, but you know what? Having a fight is a hell of a lot more inconvenient. Even if you win...even if it's a completely lopsided victory...it's still pretty damned inconvenient to have to explain to the cops why you punched that guy/stabbed that guy/shot that guy in the face.

If you must fight, by all means fight hard and win...but every fight isn't inevitable. In many situations if you act early and decisively enough you can avoid finding yourself in an unpleasant mess.

mscott327
10-16-2011, 09:19 PM
When you deal with strangers you have no way of knowing how deep that rabbit hole goes. In this case the two dimwit customers apparently picked a fight with someone who had already killed a man. The sort of man who would waste no time in finding a weapon and proceeding to literally crack their skull.

In Virginia a couple of weeks ago a dumbass gangbanger was wandering around a college town threatening people with a realistic airsoft gun. The last guy he threatened with this realistic looking airsoft pistol pulled a Ruger LCP and shot him in the leg. The round bounced off his femur and then went through both of his testicles. I don't yet have any feedback on whether or not he got himself neutered before he was able to reproduce.

It doesn't sound very macho to say this, but your chances of ending up with a cracked skull or a 90 grain JHP vasectomy are considerably lessened if you refuse to participate in stupidity. This means that if someone starts jawjacking at you, do not jawjack back...just get away. If you see a stupid situation developing, extricate yourself from it with all possible speed. Drop whatever you have to in that instant and get away from the problem. This may mean some inconvenience, but you know what? Having a fight is a hell of a lot more inconvenient. Even if you win...even if it's a completely lopsided victory...it's still pretty damned inconvenient to have to explain to the cops why you punched that guy/stabbed that guy/shot that guy in the face.

If you must fight, by all means fight hard and win...but every fight isn't inevitable. In many situations if you act early and decisively enough you can avoid finding yourself in an unpleasant mess.

Very well said! I totally agree

fuse
10-17-2011, 12:33 AM
When you see such an altercation taking place it's God's little way of telling you that a swirling torrent of stupidity is forming and it would be best to not be there when the massive dumbass funnel cloud touches down.


Have you ever thought of being an author? Or radio talk show host?

JV_
10-17-2011, 05:24 AM
Have you ever thought of being an author?

TC already has women swooning after his golden hair, I can only imagine the swirling torrent of women that would surround him if he wrote romance novels too! I'll have some fun coming up with a pen name for him .... LOL.

In all seriousness, TC, you do have a way with words.

TCinVA
10-22-2011, 09:48 PM
Have you ever thought of being an author? Or radio talk show host?

I wouldn't last a week on the air. By the third day I would be screaming the F word over and over on the mic and then they'd take me to a padded room. The X button on the internet browser has kept me from making a damn fool of myself on more than one occasion. When I manage to type something that sounds reasonably intelligent it's probably more the result of the Infinite monkey theorem (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infinite_monkey_theorem) than a real gifting.


TC already has women swooning after his golden hair

Well, if you ain't rich you gotta be pretty. I'd trade the rock-star quality hair for $300 mil (after taxes) in a heartbeat.