Appendix carry revolver preference

[Eastex]

I know from reading the semi-auto forum that there's a real safety based move, on Pistol-Forum anyway, for carrying a TDA hammer fired pistol or Gadget equipped striker fired pistol in the appendix position. When it comes to revolvers do you think the heavier trigger pull provides enough extra safety to ease your mind or do you prefer a external hammer model so you can also ride the hammer when re-holstering?


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[Dagga Boy]

I have no issues with most revolvers on this. The trigger weight, travel, design and having a cylinder that also needs to rotate all are factors where I have no issue carry a revolver AiWB

[Totem Polar]

I have *always* liked revolvers more than bottom feeders, on a visceral/fun level--while acknowledging their deficits relative to current quality service weapons. As I've been experimenting with AIWB, I'm just liking them more. As might be expected, Darryl has spoken for more than one wheelie enthusiast with his analysis. What he said.

(Not trying to proselytize for revolvers; I'm a low-key guy leading a low-key life. I've never left the J-frame, or k-frame for that matter, lifestyle for very long at any time)

[1slow]

I think a Snub Revolver in AIWB is probably the ultimate GTFOM pistol at contact range.

[entropy]

To be honest, the revolver is the ONLY handgun I am comfortable carrying AWIB. I do it regularly. I never warmed up to ANY auto in this position. I know lots of folks that do it, some exclusively...just not for me.

[scott]

I will carry a hammerless revolver AIWB, but I prefer to have a (ideally bobbed) hammer I can control. I exclusively carry revolvers, and it's always a j or k AIWB + a centennial in the off pocket.
Since I've got a whole mess of revolvers, anything appendix has a hammer. I feel a lot better being able to ride it on the reholster.

[Hambo]

I've got an AIWB holster coming for my 442. As Nyeti says, there are a lot of things that have to happen for a revolver to go bang.

[Dagga Boy]

I think a Snub Revolver in AIWB is probably the ultimate GTFOM pistol at contact range.

And......we have known this for an awfully long time. While "AIWB during a FUT during ECQC" is all the latest buzz lately, the reality is a ton of squared away LE folks were carry like this for a very long time. You didin't hear much about issues because it was done with snub revolvers. Many of the issues came to play when we used the same methodology with striker fired pistols that are very unforgiving of mistakes.

Personally, I find the J frame almost too small in the AIWB role, but super concealable. With that said, the 2-3" Round butt K frame with a bobbed hammer is almost a perfect AIWB gun for me.

[Jeep]

With that said, the 2-3" Round butt K frame with a bobbed hammer is almost a perfect AIWB gun for me.

It's almost like Smith made those 2.5 inch round butt Model 19's specifically for this purpose.

[Hambo]

And......we have known this for an awfully long time. While "AIWB during a FUT during ECQC" is all the latest buzz lately, the reality is a ton of squared away LE folks were carry like this for a very long time. You didin't hear much about issues because it was done with snub revolvers. Many of the issues came to play when we used the same methodology with striker fired pistols that are very unforgiving of mistakes.

Personally, I find the J frame almost too small in the AIWB role, but super concealable. With that said, the 2-3" Round butt K frame with a bobbed hammer is almost a perfect AIWB gun for me.

WTF is FUT?

My wish list for S&W is a modern bobbed hammer 2" M12.

[Chuck Haggard]

WTF is FUT?

My wish list for S&W is a modern bobbed hammer 2" M12.

Fucked Up Tangle Think stand up grapple, fight that goes to the ground, etc.

https://youtu.be/GQ7jBRZwiCg?t=352

[Chuck Haggard]

I've often carried a revolver of some sort AIWB for something like 35 years. Never had a worry about it.


As noted by nyeti, the cylinder having to spin in the holster for the revolver to go bang makes me worry not a bit about even a concealed hammer revolver.

[Eastex]

And......we have known this for an awfully long time. While "AIWB during a FUT during ECQC" is all the latest buzz lately, the reality is a ton of squared away LE folks were carry like this for a very long time. You didin't hear much about issues because it was done with snub revolvers.

So practical, useful information learned through decades of real world experience was ignored and considered out of date and obsolete. Huh, imagine that. The older I get the more I believe learning the history of anything is more important than keeping up with the "new" or current.


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[Dagga Boy]

So practical, useful information learned through decades of real world experience was ignored and considered out of date and obsolete. Huh, imagine that. The older I get the more I believe learning the history of anything is more important than keeping up with the "new" or current.


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I have always been a bit of a nerd student of history. When many of you were Kililing deer, shooting cans at grannies pond, and shooting as kids.......I was immersed in playing high level war games and glued to military history books as a recreational reading. That kind of nerd......almost made the Dungeons and Dragons kids look a bit normal. So, I delve hard into this stuff as far as history and how to learn from it. Hardcore gunfighters have always been different from the "rest of the force" or the "regular cops". There have always been those with a taste for the violence, and the thrill of hunting other armed dangerous humans. The ultimate in Dangerous Game. I try to examine the lessons of those folks. One of the trends you will see is "accessibility" to multiple guns. It is funny in that the snub guns that are often seen as convenient and more comfortable to carry by many LEO's, particularly the office cops, the hunters love them because they can carry more, and more means faster access and more opportunity to access.

[Dropkick]

What holsters is everyone using for revolver AIWB?
I'm especially interested in leather ones.

[okie john]

So practical, useful information learned through decades of real world experience was ignored and considered out of date and obsolete. Huh, imagine that. The older I get the more I believe learning the history of anything is more important than keeping up with the "new" or current.

A big part of the problem is that the guys who learned these lessons didn't talk much about them except to others like them, and they didn't write much down. They also didn't have the internet to connect them with other people so they could share information.

Today we have guys like Nyeti, Mac, LAV, the Irish NYPD guy, and others who are willing to share some of what they know, and places like PF where users value that kind of experience and information, and where those sources can share and comment in real time.


Okie John

[Dagga Boy]

What holsters is everyone using for revolver AIWB?
I'm especially interested in leather ones.

Safariland #27 is always a favorite. I have Desbiens, JRC leather, TT Gunleather and others.

[Eastex]

Do 'Squad Leader' and some of the other Avalon Hill games count? Growing up in Texas most of the gunfighter history I gravitated to was old western but even there there were things to pick up on. You can draw a line from Jack Hays to Bill Jordan pretty easily.


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[1slow]

And......we have known this for an awfully long time. While "AIWB during a FUT during ECQC" is all the latest buzz lately, the reality is a ton of squared away LE folks were carry like this for a very long time. You didin't hear much about issues because it was done with snub revolvers. Many of the issues came to play when we used the same methodology with striker fired pistols that are very unforgiving of mistakes.

Personally, I find the J frame almost too small in the AIWB role, but super concealable. With that said, the 2-3" Round butt K frame with a bobbed hammer is almost a perfect AIWB gun for me.


I agree it is very old news and certainly not original with me.

I seem to remember an old Charles Askins article where it was mentioned that the S&W square butt, with its trumpet like flare, was not optimized for shooting but for holding on to the revolver in a close fight.

The 2'' Square Butt K frames I have handled seemed good for this. Also some of the Colt snubbies.

The best grip shape for shooting, in my limited knowledge opinion, is not the same as the best for retention.

[Dropkick]

Safariland #27 is always a favorite. I have Desbiens, JRC leather, TT Gunleather and others.

So, best I can tell, the correct model for a S&W 642 is the Safariland 27-01-61 Can you confirm?

[Hambo]

Fucked Up Tangle Think stand up grapple, fight that goes to the ground, etc.

https://youtu.be/GQ7jBRZwiCg?t=352

Got it and good video. I think we just called it RAOTG (rolling around on the ground). ;)

[Dagga Boy]

Got it and good video. I think we just called it RAOTG (rolling around on the ground). ;)

Not around here. In order to fit in here with the Trekies of the gun world, you need to speak Klingon, or use lots of cool guy abbreviations of things from Southnarc's program. You get bonus points for how many you can use in a sentence.....

"I was out CCing my JMAK AIWB rig on my way to the store. Some guy came up to me and I had to MUC him so I didn't get into a FUT and have to WHO draw my CP and go to a SHO draw on my AIWB GGI 320 Compact that I carry. Once I got to the store I went full AMIS to the Dairy section for a half gallon of milk. There was only one left and ended up going ECQC on the dude who tried to get it first using my awesome Jits to grab the milk and E&E back to my car. Lucky for him I didn't have to rip a sub 5 second FAST on him. I had Mitchell, esq. on speed dial to review the UOF during the ECQC "

If you can read that and it makes total sense......too much time on P-F

[entropy]

Lol:)

Ive been using a simple home made IWB for about 2 years or so. Rough out, simple, double stiched. No clips, no snaps. The rough out and my "Milwaukee tumor" keeps everything nice and snug. Even during draw. Reholster not an issue with me. If it comes out, going back in is the least of my concerns right??

...so much good stuff here....

[okie john]

If you can read that and it makes total sense......too much time on P-F

Guilty.


Okie John

[BN]

Yikes, I understood the whole story. ;)

[LtDave]

And......we have known this for an awfully long time. While "AIWB during a FUT during ECQC" is all the latest buzz lately, the reality is a ton of squared away LE folks were carry like this for a very long time. You didin't hear much about issues because it was done with snub revolvers. Many of the issues came to play when we used the same methodology with striker fired pistols that are very unforgiving of mistakes.

Personally, I find the J frame almost too small in the AIWB role, but super concealable. With that said, the 2-3" Round butt K frame with a bobbed hammer is almost a perfect AIWB gun for me.

Something like this?
6306

[Dagga Boy]

Something like this?
6306

Great minds think alike.....

[Wondering Beard]

One of the trends you will see is "accessibility" to multiple guns. It is funny in that the snub guns that are often seen as convenient and more comfortable to carry by many LEO's, particularly the office cops, the hunters love them because they can carry more, and more means faster access and more opportunity to access.

I'm genuinely curious, how many and where did those guys carry the extra snubs?

I have limited real estate on my belt, can't stand ankle carry and my pockets tend to be rather full (I'm not a 'tactical pants' wearer and one of the pockets of my jacket or vest tends to be occupied by a 442). Rapid accessibility of snubby backups makes a lot of sense to me but the how of it has always been a difficulty.

[LtDave]

In SoCal it was very common for uniformed guys/gals to carry the snub in the waistband behind the mag/speedloader pouch. With a dark blue uniform and black rubber grips it was very low profile but easily accessible.

[Dagga Boy]

In SoCal it was very common for uniformed guys/gals to carry the snub in the waistband behind the mag/speedloader pouch. With a dark blue uniform and black rubber grips it was very low profile but easily accessible.

I was skinnier then....used a 3" Model 13 behind the loaders.

[LtDave]

I was skinnier then....used a 3" Model 13 behind the loaders.

Weren't we all...

[Lyonsgrid]

6324

These 64's carry great.

6325

[1986s4]

My 3" M13 for me.

[Dagga Boy]

Lyonsgrid.....great appendix set up! Hard to beat those for a good, safe, and dependable AIWB set up for an entangled fight.

[Eastex]

Lyonsgrid, are those the Hideout grips that Precision Gun Specialties makes? I'm looking at a set of those for my 642, any feedback from you or anyone else would be most welcome.


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[Lyonsgrid]

Lyonsgrid, are those the Hideout grips that Precision Gun Specialties makes? I'm looking at a set of those for my 642, any feedback from you or anyone else would be most welcome.

Yes they are.
They are nothing fancy but they work well with carry and they are low profile. They are smooth and don't grab your shirt like some rubber grips. I also like the fact that they leave the back strap open.

[Whiskey_Bravo]

What are your guy's thoughts on the Night Guard series as EDC/AIWB revolvers? Do the benefits outweigh the negative of having the factory internal lock? I know the recoil is tougher with the Scandi frames, but we are talking carry a lot and shoot little guns as mentioned before.

[Hambo]

6324

These 64's carry great.



Very nice. I will stumble across a 2" K frame eventually.

[Irelander]

Yes they are.
They are nothing fancy but they work well with carry and they are low profile. They are smooth and don't grab your shirt like some rubber grips. I also like the fact that they leave the back strap open.

Cool. I just ordered a set of Hideout grips with finger grooves for my 642. Anxiously awaiting their arrival. I had never heard of those grips until I saw Dr. House's 640 Pro with them.

Anyway, I am in the market for a kydex j-frame AIWB holster as pocket carry never worked very well for me.

[camsdaddy]

This is the first place I remember seeing them. http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/favorite_handguns-S&W%20Model%2064%20Snub.htm . I remember this was the article that gave me the k frame snubby itch

[Irelander]

I find myself carrying my PPS more than anything else. I carry it AIWB in a Dark Star clip on. I am thinking of running my 642 "weak" side AIWB with my PPS on the strong side. That should balance things out nicely.

[HCM]

WTF is FUT?

My wish list for S&W is a modern bobbed hammer 2" M12.

FUT- Fucked Up Tangle or Fouled Up Tangle if you are the sensitive type.

[EM_]

Not around here. In order to fit in here with the Trekies of the gun world, you need to speak Klingon, or use lots of cool guy abbreviations of things from Southnarc's program. You get bonus points for how many you can use in a sentence.....

"I was out CCing my JMAK AIWB rig on my way to the store. Some guy came up to me and I had to MUC him so I didn't get into a FUT and have to WHO draw my CP and go to a SHO draw on my AIWB GGI 320 Compact that I carry. Once I got to the store I went full AMIS to the Dairy section for a half gallon of milk. There was only one left and ended up going ECQC on the dude who tried to get it first using my awesome Jits to grab the milk and E&E back to my car. Lucky for him I didn't have to rip a sub 5 second FAST on him. I had Mitchell, esq. on speed dial to review the UOF during the ECQC "

If you can read that and it makes total sense......too much time on P-F

I had to read it through a second time before I realized I completed all those acronyms in my head and read them as complete thoughts.

I need other hobbies.

[entropy]

Lol. The first step is always the most difficult.;)

[Chup]

I carry 2" guns most of the time but I do carry a 4" once in a while. No problems with any of my revolvers AIWB every day.

[45dotACP]

Very nice. I will stumble across a 2" K frame eventually.
Not picking up a 2" model 10 that was percolating for 250 bucks at the local "tacticool centric" gun store is one of my life's greatest regrets

[serialsolver]

Not picking up a 2" model 10 that was percolating for 250 bucks at the local "tacticool centric" gun store is one of my life's greatest regrets

That will get you one demerit. Unless you can claim a hardship exception.


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[Dagga Boy]

Not picking up a 2" model 10 that was percolating for 250 bucks at the local "tacticool centric" gun store is one of my life's greatest regrets

Not PMing me the store's phone number was the real crime here.......if you don't I will is one of my mantra's..:p

[KPD]

I have tried carrying my Glock 19 in a few different AIWB holsters and always had the same problem with the sight gouging me or just overall uncomfortable.
Same thing with a SIG P229 and Glock 26.
Just about any revolver I carry AIWB is perfectly fine though! I have been carrying a .357 LCR AIWB for about a year now.

[Hideeho]

I started policing in New York in 1978. Have appendix carried from the start. My first holster, for a S&W Model 36, 2"barrel consisted of a plastic loop attached to a metal strut also covered in plastic. It worked for my Model 10 as well. Or for that fact, any revolver. It was the best holster I've ever owned. It prevented the piece from sliding down your leg a la Plaxico Burris. Metal clip secured it to your waistband or belt. Cannot find them anymore. If anyone has one or makes one, I will buy it. Here is a quick drawing that represents inside portion. Outside has clip at top.

6803

[1slow]

Local store has one of the S&W 327 8 shot snubs with lock. Pros/cons ?
Also they have a Performance center V comp 8 shot .357.

[WOLFIE]

Local store has one of the S&W 327 8 shot snubs with lock. Pros/cons ?
Also they have a Performance center V comp 8 shot .357.

I am also interested in the 8 shot 357 with 2" barrel for AIWB carry and i second your question.

[serialsolver]

Local store has one of the S&W 327 8 shot snubs with lock. Pros/cons ?
Also they have a Performance center V comp 8 shot .357.

I've had two of the 327pc revolvers. The first one was ok. The second one was a problem. They are accurate. Both got flame cutting on the cylinder. They are light, 27oz revolvers but they are still n frame smiths and n frame smiths are big guns. For me the big cylinder dug into my hip making it uncomfortable to carry. I have a thread here on my 327pc (problem child). Hope this helps.

[BillSWPA]

I started policing in New York in 1978. Have appendix carried from the start. My first holster, for a S&W Model 36, 2"barrel consisted of a plastic loop attached to a metal strut also covered in plastic. It worked for my Model 10 as well. Or for that fact, any revolver. It was the best holster I've ever owned. It prevented the piece from sliding down your leg a la Plaxico Burris. Metal clip secured it to your waistband or belt. Cannot find them anymore. If anyone has one or makes one, I will buy it. Here is a quick drawing that represents inside portion. Outside has clip at top.

6803

When I first started carrying a gun, I occasionally carried a Dan Wesson model 15-2 .357 magnum, which is similar or slightly larger in the frame as compared to a K frame S&W (although it accepts K frame speedloaders). The gun has Dan Wesson's interchangeable barrel system, and I usually used a 2 1/2 inch barrel. Every conventional IWB holster I tried carried the gun too high for good concealment when I bent at the waist.

I found a "holster" consisting of a single piece of leather. One end was a snap loop for a belt. The center section, which was folded downward from the top of the belt loop, was in the form of a sweat shield covering the bulk of the side of a revolver. The other end was in the form of another loop for receiving the barrel. This is the only IWB holster I ever found that could be used to effectively conceal this gun.

I have never and likely will never carry AIWB, preferring 3:30 on the belt, so I can say little with any authority on that subject, but I suspect that the height combined with the somewhat unconstrained gun position could work well for AIWB. I'll see if I can find out if it is still made and or if I can manage to post a picture.

One of the lessons from carrying this gun is how much easier it is for me to conceal a full size 1911 than this 2 1/2" revolver.

[entropy]

Like this one?

:o

http://s27.postimg.org/ynwnhuwvn/image.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
post images (http://postimage.org/)

[BillSWPA]

Like this one?

:o

http://s27.postimg.org/ynwnhuwvn/image.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
post images (http://postimage.org/)

Yes, with the only differences being that mine has an ejector rod shroud that maintains its full thickness all the way to the end of the barrel, and has the smallest size of Pachmayr Presentation grips that I could find (I am not sure if these grips were offered in different sizes, but I also have another, older set of the same grips for this gun that are slightly longer).

What kind of holster is that?

[BillSWPA]

Here is the holster I described above:

http://www.desantisholster.com/INVISIBLE-AGENT

It appears that I need to correct my description above: the sweat shield is on one side, the belt loop is in the other, and the strap around the barrel connects the two. It also does not currently appear to be made for revolvers, which is disappointing because I would have thought that this holster would be most useful with a revolver.

[1slow]

I've had two of the 327pc revolvers. The first one was ok. The second one was a problem. They are accurate. Both got flame cutting on the cylinder. They are light, 27oz revolvers but they are still n frame smiths and n frame smiths are big guns. For me the big cylinder dug into my hip making it uncomfortable to carry. I have a thread here on my 327pc (problem child). Hope this helps.

Thank you, I sort of remembered there was a problem, forgot it was flame cutting.

[entropy]

BillSWPA,

Thought you would get a kick out of seeing another one. Not the most common wheelgun out there. It was the first handgun I ever purchased. Bought it the day I turned 21. I have several barrels as well, but not the Pak.

The holster is a simple AWIB I made from some 6oz leather. The back side is covered with a non slip neoprene material that keeps it put. Holsers formthe DW arent exactly falling off the shelves.

[BillSWPA]

BillSWPA,

Thought you would get a kick out of seeing another one. Not the most common wheelgun out there. It was the first handgun I ever purchased. Bought it the day I turned 21. I have several barrels as well, but not the Pak.

The holster is a simple AWIB I made from some 6oz leather. The back side is covered with a non slip neoprene material that keeps it put. Holsers formthe DW arent exactly falling off the shelves.

Yes, I did get a kick out of it, and it was my first handgun as well.

Lack of holster availability was definitely an issue. I found myself largely stuck with the inexpensive nylon holsters. I didn't carry it very often, but when I did, I found the best way was in a Michaels of Oregon horizontal shoulder holster with a figure-8 harness. I put a belt pouch for two speedloaders on the plastic offside plate.

[Digiroc]

I will carry a hammerless revolver AIWB, but I prefer to have a (ideally bobbed) hammer I can control. I exclusively carry revolvers, and it's always a j or k AIWB + a centennial in the off pocket.
Since I've got a whole mess of revolvers, anything appendix has a hammer. I feel a lot better being able to ride it on the reholster.

I'm also an old school fan of hammers but shrouded weapons do make some sense in concealed carry. I have an Airlite which is a dream to carry but very unpleasant to actually shoot. I just purchased a 640 Pro and it's my shooter so I can train without being sore for days after. Also the Tritium sights are very nice, especially in darkness. The Airlite's light tube front sight works really well in daylight but the weapon is strictly point and shoot at night.

6939

Note the bobbed hammer on the Airlite

[Hideeho]

Bill--Thank you for posting the DeSantis holster. That is the basic idea. The difference is no sweat shield. There was nothing between your body and the gun. Will try the DeSantis.

[S Jenks]

I'm looking for a gunsmith to bob the hammers on my 3" 64 and GP100 WC. Any recommendations? And do you typically have to send the firearms or just the hammers?

[Digiroc]

I'm looking for a gunsmith to bob the hammers on my 3" 64 and GP100 WC. Any recommendations? And do you typically have to send the firearms or just the hammers?

Well I just took an angle grinder to it after taping it up so no grindings found their way into the works. Finished up with a file to smooth it out and take off the burrs. Thought provoking to take a grinder to a $1000 new S&W Airlite.

Digiroc

Life is good, enjoy it while you can

[camsdaddy]

I'm looking for a gunsmith to bob the hammers on my 3" 64 and GP100 WC. Any recommendations? And do you typically have to send the firearms or just the hammers?
I would buy a separate hammer to bob. I have sometimes regretted bobbing my 60. If I decide to bob my 65 I will keep original hammer.

[Hideeho]

Highly recommend Sand Burr Ranch, Denny Reichard. He worked on my 22-4, including bobbing hammer. His action tune up is something to consider along with hammer work. Pictures of what he did to my revolver are in the Favorite Revolver thread.