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wmu12071
03-01-2016, 11:37 AM
I just filed form 4 for an Omega. Now I'm visiting an engraver for a form 1 lower start. Being REALLY new to all this does anyone have any good source for info on setting up a 300 blk sbr with an Omega? Should I get an adjustable gas block? Sounds like a H or H2 buffer? I would like to run both subsonic and supersonic ammo. I don't own the upper yet. My idea was the 9" from BCM.

Thank you for any input.

LittleLebowski
03-01-2016, 12:44 PM
You probably won't have to dick around with it. I didn't with my 11.5" KAC SR-30, Saker 7.62, and subs/supers. I believe the BCM uses an H buffer. I wouldn't worry about it at all if I were you and buying from BCM, their stuff just works.

wmu12071
03-01-2016, 01:53 PM
You probably won't have to dick around with it. I didn't with my 11.5" KAC SR-30, Saker 7.62, and subs/supers. I believe the BCM uses an H buffer. I wouldn't worry about it at all if I were you and buying from BCM, their stuff just works.

Thanks, that's what I was hoping to hear. Just out of curiosity why an 11.5"? I thought the SR30 was a 9.5". Is there an advantage out side of a few extra ft/s?

rob_s
03-01-2016, 02:37 PM
Like with most things AR, I'd start with the gun as close to "stock" as you can and adjust as necessary. Start with an H buffer and standard GI spring, good quality GI trigger and other lower parts, etc.

BWT
03-01-2016, 06:33 PM
I'd agree 100% with LL and rob's input.

Keep it simple, and be reluctant to change things like springs, triggers, etc. Just shoot the gun.

We've had 4 positive experiences with BCM carbines (uppers and lowers) in my family; I would stick with that.

In fact I'd never had a malfunction in any of my BCM guns until I ran the VLTOR A5 system on a Sionics lower in a Midlength 16'' BCM recently.

God Bless,

Brandon

ETA: I can't speak for the 11.5'' barrel versus 9.5'' in .300 BLK but in 5.56mm it's more a dwell time issue.

.300 BLK it might just be for a bit longer barrel for a bit more velocity or to extend rail length. I'm not certain.

wmu12071
03-01-2016, 07:30 PM
Thank you gentlemen. I plan to run a mil spec trigger. I just want a gun that will run without killing itself. As someone relatively new to ARs I get a little scared with all the stories of guns not running or running poorly.

Anyone know how much difference you have to have between the handgaurd length and barrel length to mount a Silencerco Omega?

BWT
03-01-2016, 08:05 PM
Thank you gentlemen. I plan to run a mil spec trigger. I just want a gun that will run without killing itself. As someone relatively new to ARs I get a little scared with all the stories of guns not running or running poorly.

Anyone know how much difference you have to have between the handgaurd length and barrel length to mount a Silencerco Omega?

That's part of the reason to go with factory rifles if I can. They're designed to work well together and they warranty the gun. Barring that duplicating a factory configuration is a safe bet.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-Upper-Receiver-Groups-300-blackout-s/207.htm

Not many suppressor are reflexive these days (AAC M4-SPR or Ops Inc. models). I would shop suppressors and uppers.

Interestingly, it seems the 12.5" BCM is a pistol length gas as well as the 9".

What barrel length are you considering? Any ideas? Are you very familiar with suppressors?

God bless,

Brandon

ETA: Just saw Silencerco Omega. The mount indicates the suppressor ends pretty close to the beginning of the flash hider. I think others can give specifics on the Omega.

https://www.google.com/search?q=silencerco+omega&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS674US674&hl=en-US&prmd=vsin&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjUpPT-56DLAhXF5yYKHaqDDWAQ_AUICSgD&biw=375&bih=591#hl=en-US&tbm=isch&q=silencerco+omega+mount&imgrc=VAIJrVzbGt0aqM%3A

Were you thinking of a 9" or 12.5" BCM?

wmu12071
03-01-2016, 08:56 PM
That's part of the reason to go with factory rifles if I can. They're designed to work well together and they warranty the gun. Barring that duplicating a factory configuration is a safe bet.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-Upper-Receiver-Groups-300-blackout-s/207.htm

Not many suppressor are reflexive these days (AAC M4-SPR or Ops Inc. models). I would shop suppressors and uppers.

Interestingly, it seems the 12.5" BCM is a pistol length gas as well as the 9".

What barrel length are you considering? Any ideas? Are you very familiar with suppressors?

God bless,

Brandon

ETA: Just saw Silencerco Omega. The mount indicates the suppressor ends pretty close to the beginning of the flash hider. I think others can give specifics on the Omega.

https://www.google.com/search?q=silencerco+omega&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS674US674&hl=en-US&prmd=vsin&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjUpPT-56DLAhXF5yYKHaqDDWAQ_AUICSgD&biw=375&bih=591#hl=en-US&tbm=isch&q=silencerco+omega+mount&imgrc=VAIJrVzbGt0aqM%3A

Were you thinking of a 9" or 12.5" BCM?

I am not very familiar with supressors, I am a new to all of this. I have a 16" BCM on a PSA lower that has worked very well for me. I only have about 600 rounds through the setup but I have 0 complaints. This is why I am looking a BCM again. The little reading I have done for SBR setups makes me think that a 300 blk is a good idea. I have no need to throw fireballs with 223, however if I decide to switch it's only a barrel.

I want to get my form 1 started so my PSA lower that has worked with about 800 or 900 rounds (about 600 with my BCM upper, 100 with a colt carbine upper, and 100 on a suppressor set up a friend was trying to work out) is heading to an engraver and a new one will be here Thursday to take its place on my 16".

Since the paperwork won't be back until I have the engraving done I have a few months to sort out my decision.

My understanding is that most 300 blk is supposed to burn fully in a 9" barrel. That being the case I didn't see a reason for a 12.5". I also know enough to know I may not know what I don't know, you know?

From what I'm getting for feedback I was on the right track. Mil spec trigger, H buffer, and stock spring on a BCM 9" with some irons on it. Then shoot it and train until I suck less. I wouldn't be going SBR yet but I feel a bit like I should get one while I can. Besides, it was time for a "1 more year without punching someone at work" and I shot a glock for a year without going to buy the new hotness gift.

BWT
03-01-2016, 11:12 PM
I am not very familiar with supressors, I am a new to all of this. I have a 16" BCM on a PSA lower that has worked very well for me. I only have about 600 rounds through the setup but I have 0 complaints. This is why I am looking a BCM again. The little reading I have done for SBR setups makes me think that a 300 blk is a good idea. I have no need to throw fireballs with 223, however if I decide to switch it's only a barrel.

I want to get my form 1 started so my PSA lower that has worked with about 800 or 900 rounds (about 600 with my BCM upper, 100 with a colt carbine upper, and 100 on a suppressor set up a friend was trying to work out) is heading to an engraver and a new one will be here Thursday to take its place on my 16".

Since the paperwork won't be back until I have the engraving done I have a few months to sort out my decision.

My understanding is that most 300 blk is supposed to burn fully in a 9" barrel. That being the case I didn't see a reason for a 12.5". I also know enough to know I may not know what I don't know, you know?

From what I'm getting for feedback I was on the right track. Mil spec trigger, H buffer, and stock spring on a BCM 9" with some irons on it. Then shoot it and train until I suck less. I wouldn't be going SBR yet but I feel a bit like I should get one while I can. Besides, it was time for a "1 more year without punching someone at work" and I shot a glock for a year without going to buy the new hotness gift.

Have you shot a suppressed rifle without hearing protection?

I saw the 100 rounds for your friend's Colt Upper; the only reason I ask is my experience was vastly different than what I expected.

It's a significant wait, cost, and process for the suppressor. In fact, the suppressor is probably the portion of this purchase I'd scrutinize the most because it'll have effects on back pressure, tone, etc. and resale is not really an option worth considering. The attachment methods (and cost of mounts), warranty, end cap options, suppressor weight, POI/POA shift, etc. are all factors to strongly consider. The SBR's just a lower, and you can change the barrel length by changing uppers. Heck you can even put a 16'' upper on it and take it out of state without NFA hassles.

I imagine you've also counted the cost but the only other thing I'd advise some thought on is you mention training until you suck less. I could easily see (even with reloading) .300 BLK limiting the number of rounds you're able to shoot per year. Unless reloading is something you might consider.

If you shoot thousand or so rounds a year out of the gun (which could just be a few magazines every range visit), and introducing it to friends, etc. that might not be as big of a deal.

(ETA: moved this sentence to be before instead of after the following sentence) However, if you see yourself taking classes, competition, and using this as your go-to gun. That could get expensive.

Not meaning to be a debbie downer but just giving honest feedback on why I have a 12.5'' 5.56mm and decided not to pursue a 9'' 300 BLK back when I was interested. Also, why I went with an SBR over a suppressor.

Overall,


From what I'm getting for feedback I was on the right track. Mil spec trigger, H buffer, and stock spring on a BCM 9" with some irons on it. Then shoot it and train until I suck less. I wouldn't be going SBR yet but I feel a bit like I should get one while I can. Besides, it was time for a "1 more year without punching someone at work" and I shot a glock for a year without going to buy the new hotness gift.

This sounds like a pretty good plan.

I think you'll make a solid decision; your approach sounds very well thought out.

God Bless,

Brandon

ETA: Re-reading the thread (maybe I should post less); you've already made your decision on the Omega and I think that'll work great for what you're doing.

Robinson
03-01-2016, 11:35 PM
I am about a month into the wait on the Omega I purchased. It will be installed on a 16" .300 BLK rifle. I will have to swap out the flash hider for the one shipped with the Omega. Other than that I'm not planning any modifications to the gun in order to use the suppressor.

rob_s
03-02-2016, 05:05 AM
BWT makes good points about suppressors, but the Omega, to me, is the safe bet if you simply must buy a can because it can be used on so many different guns and calibers.

If you're planning on a 300blk upper, id do the 9". I can't tell you if you'll have to have the 7.0 handguard or the 8.0, but I bet silencerco can.

SteveB
03-02-2016, 07:12 AM
I went with the AAC 9" upper with the AAC 762-SD can. Works well, but this was a few years ago, and I think there are better cans out there now.

6243

LittleLebowski
03-02-2016, 07:31 AM
The Omega and a BCM upper are solid choices, backed by companies that stand by their products. You did well, it should run great.

Hansohn Brothers
03-02-2016, 09:04 AM
I just filed form 4 for an Omega. Now I'm visiting an engraver for a form 1 lower start. Being REALLY new to all this does anyone have any good source for info on setting up a 300 blk sbr with an Omega? Should I get an adjustable gas block? Sounds like a H or H2 buffer? I would like to run both subsonic and supersonic ammo. I don't own the upper yet. My idea was the 9" from BCM.

Thank you for any input.

Try it before making any changes. I prefer to use an adjustable gas block so I can tune the rifle to the load at the source. The 300BLK shines in short suppressed rifles; the 9" BCM and Omega combination should serve you well.

wmu12071
03-02-2016, 01:03 PM
Thanks everyone. Just to answer some of the questions. My main rifle will remain my 16" BCM. The controls will be kept as close as possible for both rifle.

I do have reloading equipment already so I will likely get 300 dies. I will probably end up with a short BCM upper for 556 at some point aswell. I like to have options. With the 556 I will probably try to stay at 11.5" or 12.5".

Again, thank you all for responding. It sounds like I was on the right track but there is a lot of useless crap online that people pretend to know. The signal to noise here tends to be much better.

StraitR
03-02-2016, 02:38 PM
I went with the AAC 9" upper with the AAC 762-SD can. Works well, but this was a few years ago, and I think there are better cans out there now.

6243

I still REALLY want a mini Acog.

SteveB
03-02-2016, 03:04 PM
I still REALLY want a mini Acog.

PM sent.

TR675
03-28-2016, 09:34 PM
I ignored all of the good advice above and went bananas/unconventional on my 300 build. Other than some problems with out of spec parts (since replaced) results have been very encouraging.

I used an Aero Precision upper, lower and BCG. An 8" Ballistic Advantage barrel (their budget option) and pinned non-adjustable low pro gas block. Demo Troy Alpha rail. Finally an MVB Arc stock because PDW. I'm using a Saker 762 as well.

So far it works with 300 subs and supers, both suppressed and unsuppressed. Supers run just fine unsuppressed, and subs run fine suppressed. Subs function unsuppressed but the action is sluggish and sometimes fails to lock back the bolt on an empty mag. Supers function suppressed but there is a LOT of extra gas and the gun isn't real happy about it. All of this is ok and I'm just glad it works across the board.

Happily the suppressors POI shift is vertical by a couple of inches. What this means is that when Remington 120 grain supers are dialed in to POA/POI at 50 yards unsuppressed, I get the exact same POI with suppressed Remington 220 grain subs. I'll see if this holds true for other ammo but for now I'm happy with these results.

My only complaints: (1) I've never shot suppressed before and I'm not loving the gas to face phenomenon. I'll use an adjustable gas block next time for that reason alone. (2) Magpul MBUS sights were tough to zero and the retention screws loosened up on me. (3) I wish the stock's LOP was a *bit* longer - fully extended its about where a four position Colt carbine stock is at its first position out from fully collapsed. Oh well - PDW.

As a side note I'm not real wild about the Saker's Trifecta mount. I don't have much to compare it to but it gets stuck on too easily. A few raps with a rubber mallet loosens up whatever carbon is making it stick, but that's still annoying. I'll try some high temp anti seize on the mounting surfaces next and hope for the best.

6806

StraitR
03-28-2016, 10:24 PM
Glad it's working for you. It certainly looks pretty sick.

My 16" 300blk BA barrel with factory pinned LPGB runs supers/subs both suppressed/unsuppressed just fine. Assuming yours is also a factory pinned GB, you may give BA a call just to see what they say about how yours is running. I called prior to ordering mine to discuss the gas port size and was assured the barrel would function with any combination of subs/supers/suppressed/unsuppressed. I forget who I spoke to, but he was both knowledgeable and helpful. Told me to give them a call back if it didn't work as advertised.

I found THIS (http://micromoa.com/300-blk-port-size-testing/) information on gas port sizing helpful when shopping for a 300blk barrel.

For gas to the face, try doing THIS (http://www.03designgroup.com/technotes/do-it-yourself-gas-buster-charging-handle) using THIS (http://www.amazon.com/Permatex-81160-High-Temp-Silicone-Gasket/dp/B0002UEN1A).

LittleLebowski
03-29-2016, 06:33 AM
Nice build and verrry interesting data on the POI shift.

On your mount issues, you have to dribble some lube into the part of the suppressor mount (on the suppressor) that moves and also wipe some lube on the Trifecta lugs and smooth part. Then unload the weapon three times, go to a room with no ammo in it, put on a motivating movie (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002AH3WSS/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=B002AH3WSS&linkCode=as2&tag=ratio07-20&linkId=4HKGGBU5AY3MOLNV), and just work the shit out of that mount and suppressor, add lube again after you done. It will break in but alway make sure it's lubed on the points I mentioned. You can use grease on the Trifecta mount but I highly recommend oil dribbled into the moving parts of the suppressor mount itself. Not that it really matters but I'm using Lucas gun oil (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IG20RM/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=B000IG20RM&linkCode=as2&tag=ratio07-20&linkId=XUIFF6XNHQTVMHNR) for this and it works great and is much cheaper than the usual boutique gun lubes.

TR675
03-29-2016, 10:12 AM
Thanks for the reminder about that Permatex solution, Craig - I remember that from years ago!- and for the Saker pro tip, LL.

I may monkey with buffer weights to see if that helps with the extra gas and recoil when suppressing supers - I've heard different things from different people. This is a fun project and a learning experience for me, so the more excuse to tinker the better. But I'm pretty happy with where it's at now and don't see myself shooting shores suppressed very much.

Hansohn Brothers
03-29-2016, 07:09 PM
Congrats on the build! For me, building, tweaking and tuning is the fun part.

BJXDS
04-01-2016, 10:38 PM
I just filed form 4 for an Omega. Now I'm visiting an engraver for a form 1 lower start. Being REALLY new to all this does anyone have any good source for info on setting up a 300 blk sbr with an Omega? Should I get an adjustable gas block? Sounds like a H or H2 buffer? I would like to run both subsonic and supersonic ammo. I don't own the upper yet. My idea was the 9" from BCM.

Thank you for any input.

Very interesting because I am thinking of a the same set up, actually, I think I will start with a BCM 16" 300 with Omega. Not 100% sure about the suppressor. In addition I want to also do a BCM SBR 300 with suppressor as well. I will most likely use 1 can for both riles not sure on the SBR length? it's all new to me so I have a lot to get figured out.

I am thinking I would run subsonic ammo with the can the majority of the time.

I am not sure if this helps you at all, but I saw the info noted below on BCM site:
BCM has taken great care to ensure the best possible performance and interchangeability. However, due to the large operational range of 300 Blackout ammunition in the market place, BCM cannot guarantee function will all ammunition types in all conditions. These barrels were designed to run with a carbine buffer with subsonic ammo and a H3 buffer with high velocity ammo. Fine tuning may be required in limited instances based on ammo and buffer choices that work best for the desired application. BCM also recommends running the Crane O-ring (provided with all BCM Bolt Carrier Groups) over the extractor with 300 Blackout.

Mike C
04-08-2016, 07:54 PM
Have you shot a suppressed rifle without hearing protection?

Heck you can even put a 16'' upper on it and take it out of state without NFA hassles.



How accurate is this statement? It is my understanding that you must notify ATF and have appropriate paperwork in order to go out of state with said registered SBR or suppressor. BWT are you just talking in terms of issues with states that do not allow SBR's? I am asking because I am really contemplating registering 2 rifles of mine at this time and would love to be able to just drop a different upper on and go out of state to a class without dealing with a bunch of garbage.

punkey71
04-08-2016, 08:00 PM
How accurate is this statement? It is my understanding that you must notify ATF and have appropriate paperwork in order to go out of state with said registered SBR or suppressor. BWT are you just talking in terms of issues with states that do not allow SBR's? I am asking because I am really contemplating registering 2 rifles of mine at this time and would love to be able to just drop a different upper on and go out of state to a class without dealing with a bunch of garbage.

Not BWT, but a registered lower is not an SBR without a
<16" upper attached. If upper is 16" or more, travel at will.

Suppressors don't require notification.

ETA - Tapatalk is killing me - keeps dropping half my post, sorry

Josh Runkle
04-08-2016, 09:27 PM
Not BWT, but a registered lower is not an SBR without a
<16" upper attached. If upper is 16" or more, travel at will.

Suppressors don't require notification.

ETA - Tapatalk is killing me - keeps dropping half my post, sorry

Not a lawyer, but this is not my understanding. My understanding is that the barrel length on the form is the actual length, and any other upper/barrel is just a temporary change. It's an SBR in non-SBR configuration...but it's still an SBR.

Call the NFA branch and ask for clarification: 304.616.4500

Mike C
04-08-2016, 11:02 PM
Not a lawyer, but this is not my understanding. My understanding is that the barrel length on the form is the actual length, and any other upper/barrel is just a temporary change. It's an SBR in non-SBR configuration...but it's still an SBR.

Call the NFA branch and ask for clarification: 304.616.4500

This was my concern. Sounds like a plan, will call Monday. Thank you for the great advice.

Mike C
04-08-2016, 11:13 PM
After a little more searching I found this: https://www.guntrustlawyer.com/2013/07/atf-form-53201-how-to-fill-o.html from an NFA gun trust lawyer. I will still call Monday but thought this was interesting.

Hansohn Brothers
04-09-2016, 06:06 AM
Punkey is correct. Once you remove the short barrel, it is no longer an SBR. If you put a >16" barrel on, it is treated as a title 1 firearm.

punkey71
04-09-2016, 08:30 AM
The last time I heard people calling the ATF for "clarification" they lost the ability to shoulder their Sig arm brace.

Im not saying this is the same thing, but I'd be hesitant to call the ATF and ask them to make "clarifications" to the existing laws and regs.

Just thinking out loud...

:-)

Josh Runkle
04-09-2016, 08:55 AM
The last time I heard people calling the ATF for "clarification" they lost the ability to shoulder their Sig arm brace.

Im not saying this is the same thing, but I'd be hesitant to call the ATF and ask them to make "clarifications" to the existing laws and regs.

Just thinking out loud...

:-)

In the example you give, BATFE had explained, in writing why the Sig arm brace configuration was ok. People said, "But, the law says this. Can you clarify why you're saying it's ok?" And then they reversed position to come into alignment with the law.

In this case, there are already positions on 5320.20 and interstate travel. You aren't asking BATFE "why" they allow what they do, or if, in fact it is in alignment with the law. You're just asking how something works, and what the existing policy is (because they change all the time).

It's not at all the same type of "clarification". People call the NFA branch all day long M-F, 8-5. I've seriously called like at least 50 times.

For example: once I made a DD on a form 1 from a flare gun. I was supposed to put the "original manufacturer of the firearm" on the form. Well, is that me, since a flare gun is not regulated as a title I or II gun and I would be the first person making it a title II gun, or do they still want the original manufacturer of the device in that place?

You can no longer put "multi" as a caliber on an SBR, but you can "temporarily" swap uppers and calibers. If you install a device in the magwell to take a different caliber's magazine, does that constitute a "permanent" change, and would I need to send ATF a letter informing them of the "permanent" change of caliber, or is that still just "temporary"?

They get questions on stuff all day long, and they are not earth shattering and have relatively little effect, and are not similar to the Sig pistol brace case.

When you eat leftovers out of your Mom's fridge during a visit home...that's when it's "better to ask forgiveness than permission". When you're facing the long dick of the law is not the time.

My understanding is that it is not Kosher. I have called the NFA branch and asked this specific question myself, about 7-8 years ago. They could easily have changed their position. My point isn't that I'm right and someone else is wrong, my point is that there is a place where you can get the information directly, and that should not be a buddy or the Internet. Call NFA directly.

Josh Runkle
04-09-2016, 08:58 AM
Also: if you have time, it's always better to write them, and have them respond back in writing, rather than just calling. That way you have a piece of evidence as to why you did what you did.

punkey71
04-09-2016, 10:28 AM
They have issued their opinion, in writing, in 2007.

The letter was to a Mr. Wade Bailey. I cant attach the entire letter but here is the relevant paragraph. Google it and you'll find his letter, I'm sure.

Between an existing letter, my NFA attorney and Hansohn Brothers (a dealer of ATF items), I'm confident I have the relevant information and clarification for my comfort.

By all means, do your own due diligence if you feel a new letter is needed. If a new letter IS needed, what value does the new letter have if the old one from 2007 is no longer valid?7115

Respectfully,
Harold

Josh Runkle
04-09-2016, 10:41 AM
They have issued their opinion, in writing, in 2007.

The letter was to a Mr. Wade Bailey. I cant attach the entire letter but here is the relevant paragraph. Google it and you'll find his letter, I'm sure.

Between an existing letter, my NFA attorney and Hansohn Brothers (a dealer of ATF items), I'm confident I have the relevant information and clarification for my comfort.

By all means, do your own due diligence if you feel a new letter is needed. If a new letter IS needed, what value does the new letter have if the old one from 2007 is no longer valid?7115

Respectfully,
Harold

Respectfully, (again, I'm not a lawyer) my understanding is that opinion letters from the ATF only hold up in court for the person that the letter was addressed to, and the opinion only applies to the person whom it was addressed to. The ATF writes conflicting information all of the time. Letters like these are not press releases or official rulings, and have no bearing on the public. I could almost guarantee that given enough time and money, we could track down a letter from the same branch from the same time period with an opposing viewpoint.

Respectfully, your business is your business. My advice is just simply to get your information directly from the source, rather than from the Internet. It takes like 5 minutes to call. You write down the name of the person you spoke with and you have a record of the phone call on your phone bill. You have a decent defense in court. You can still be arrested by people ignorant of the law. You might still have to give a defense of yourself. Ignorance of the law is not a sufficient defense. And, what happens when your source material is a private opinion letter to someone else and some posters on the internet?

The best source stated so far is your attorney. I would assume that your attorney has taken it upon their self to contact the ATF in writing, have an example of case law on hand, or the ability to cite a relevant statute. If not, find a different one.

Mike C
04-09-2016, 04:28 PM
There are a few things I've learned during my employment with Uncle Sam: 1. everything is subject to change, 2. you will not likely be put on notice, if you are it still won't save you from taking the giant green weeny, 3. ignorance is no excuse. I think I will call and write regardless of perception or opinion. I do appreciate some of the sound advice about having it in writing for myself.

BWT
04-09-2016, 04:55 PM
How accurate is this statement? It is my understanding that you must notify ATF and have appropriate paperwork in order to go out of state with said registered SBR or suppressor. BWT are you just talking in terms of issues with states that do not allow SBR's? I am asking because I am really contemplating registering 2 rifles of mine at this time and would love to be able to just drop a different upper on and go out of state to a class without dealing with a bunch of garbage.

SBRs are legally defined by their condition. You can swap uppers and keep it in non-NFA configuration, and not be subject to NFA restrictions such as filing a 5320.

Suppressors and AOWs do not require a 5320; IIRC. ETA: Everything else is subject to normal NFA procedures such as a 5320.20 across state lines.

God Bless,

Brandon

Years ago a manufacturer was selling Pre-registered SBR's that all stopped I believe because there wasn't an upper that kept the rifle in conditions that would be subject to NFA.

Josh Runkle
04-09-2016, 06:20 PM
Years ago a manufacturer was selling Pre-registered SBR's that all stopped I believe because there wasn't an upper that kept the rifle in conditions that would be subject to NFA.

Class II's are subject to entirely different regulations. It sounds like a case similar to what happened to Stag Arms, which was just simple non-compliance with the law.

BWT
04-11-2016, 11:29 AM
Class II's are subject to entirely different regulations. It sounds like a case similar to what happened to Stag Arms, which was just simple non-compliance with the law.

Potentially. The scuttle bud (correct word?) was when people were filing Form 4's and giving measurements to the ATF and the ATF learned there was no upper; they said it wasn't subject to NFA because there wasn't an upper with the gun that would subject the gun to NFA. Machine guns are machine guns regardless of condition (even just a sear or lower); people sometimes assume it's the same with SBR's and it's not.

God Bless,

Brandon

ETA: The only reason I'm mentioning that is to further indicate there is a history of SBR's not in SBR configuration not being considered SBR's by the ATF.

Drang
04-11-2016, 09:22 PM
scuttle bud
Scuttlebutt (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scuttlebutt)

1a : a cask on shipboard to contain freshwater for a day's use
b : a drinking fountain on a ship or at a naval or marine installation
2 : rumor, gossip
Definitions 1 a&b are the source of definition 2.

/sidetrack