Walther PPS M2

[SteveB]

Ah, the single-stack polymer 9mm. I used to wonder what it's for; then I bought a house in Florida. In steamy SW Florida, standard uniform is a Columbia Tamiami fishing shirt and a pair of light shorts, so a lighter, flatter pistol is easier to manage than my standard P2000 AIWB. I've tried the Shield, the Walther PPS, the Glock 43. The original PPS was too square in the grip, trigger was just OK and I didn't care for the paddle mag release. Today I got the updated PPS, the M2. This pistol is virtually the same size as the Shield, the G43 and the old PPS. It is a few ounces heavier.

5477

The M2 is nicely rounded through the grip, has a low-profile button-style mag release and an improved trigger. The trigger face is flat, feels like an Apex Glock trigger. I measured it at 6 lbs. I very much like the striker stud which protrudes enough through the endplate when pressure is applied to the trigger to work as a quasi-Gadget:

5478

With the 6-round mag inserted, the M2 fits as well in the front pants pocket as any of these others. Smacking the pistol while in the pocket did not release the mag.

I shot 150 rounds of 124-147 grain Fed American Eagle, Blazer and Gold Dots at 2" dots today, slow fire, fast fire, no issues. This pistol has the best inherent accuracy of any of the small plastic guns I've fired. The factory sights are very good, but I don't like 3-dot sights and will replace them, although I'll start by Sharpie-ing out the rear dots. I'm sending it off to Tony next week, so holsters should be coming. Looks like a keeper.

[Nephrology]

How does it compare to the Shield? Considering flipping my shield for the PPS, not sure if the juice would be worth the squeeze, though... Already mostly satisfied with the Shield.

[SteveB]

How does it compare to the Shield? Considering flipping my shield for the PPS, not sure if the juice would be worth the squeeze, though... Already mostly satisfied with the Shield.

The M2 is more accurate and has a better out-of-the-box trigger than any of the Shields I've shot. I like my Shield, but it needed an Apex kit to improve the trigger. Of course, now it has a great trigger and, for a small pistol, it's accurate enough for me. I like the texture of the M2 grip better than the smooth surface of the Shield. The mag release button is lower profile on the M2, but easy to activate. We're talking small differences here. Because you're "mostly satisfied", you should shoot one before you flip.

[RJ]

I've been scouring Central Florida to try and find one of these to see in real life the last two days. No luck so far.

Could I ask where you picked this up?

Thanks for posting a shooting review. This pistol has really piqued my interest.

[SteveB]

I've been scouring Central Florida to try and find one of these to see in real life the last two days. No luck so far.

Could I ask where you picked this up?

Thanks for posting a shooting review. This pistol has really piqued my interest.

Bought it off of GB and had it shipped to the LGS:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Semi-Auto-Pistols/BI.aspx?Keywords=walther+pps+m2

[GJM]

Bought it off of GB and had it shipped to the LGS:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Semi-Auto-Pistols/BI.aspx?Keywords=walther+pps+m2

And he paid $70 more than where I bought mine, and sent him the link to! :)

https://www.kygunco.com/mobile/index.cfm


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[LOKNLOD]

I very much like the striker stud which protrudes enough through the endplate when pressure is applied to the trigger to work as a quasi-Gadget:


Maybe it's angle or foggy memory, but that looks like it sticks out further than I remember on my old PPS. Wonder if they lengthened it slightly to improve its Gadgetasiousness?

[SteveB]

Maybe it's angle or foggy memory, but that looks like it sticks out further than I remember on my old PPS. Wonder if they lengthened it slightly to improve its Gadgetasiousness?

That was my impression as well; it's been awhile since I had my old PPS but this thing seems to stick out further than the old one.

[GJM]

Steve, how grippy is the texture on the frame?

[SteveB]

Steve, how grippy is the texture on the frame?

It's a mild texture, not aggressive.

[YVK]

Did they change the mags along more conventional lines, Steve? I intensely disliked the original PPS' mag base plates.

[SteveB]

Did they change the mags along more conventional lines, Steve? I intensely disliked the original PPS' mag base plates.

Yeah, the original baseplates with those goofy rearward extensions bugged me too:

5490

The new plates are much improved, although Walther still wants to cover the frame gap (why not a grip plug?) with the extended mags:

5491

5492

5493

5494

5495

[Kram]

Steve,

Thank you for the pictures and your review of the PPS M2. The PPS is my EDC and favorite single stack 9mm. I just have never been a fan of its paddle release. I planning on picking up the M2 especially with Tonys holsters being available soon.

[GJM]

Just picked my M2 up at LGS a few hours ago. Haven't shot it, just handled it, alongside my 43.

As a pure pocket pistol, I think the 43 is a tad smaller, and enough to matter in a pocket. As a pure shooting little gun, I am pretty sure the M2 will be better. The little amount it is bigger than the 43 is all in the right places. I particularly like the wide, flat trigger on the M2, and of course that it has a micro Gadget like feature built in.

I like the classic PPS, but for a few things, and the M2 addresses all of them. I bet Walther sells bushels of the ew M2, especially at their price.

[Hot Sauce]

and of course that it has a micro Gadget like feature built in.

I've only heard this talked about a few times. Does covering the back protrusion reliably work similar to a Gadget/Hammer? I imagine it might be pretty sensitive to finger placement.

[GJM]

I've only heard this talked about a few times. Does covering the back protrusion reliably work similar to a Gadget/Hammer? I imagine it might be pretty sensitive to finger placement.

See bottom photo in post 1. Not as elegant as the Gadget, but workable.

[Hot Sauce]

See bottom photo in post 1. Not as elegant as the Gadget, but workable.

Roger. Anything else worthy of noting in your hands-on experience with it? I am theoretically aware of it but haven't played with it in person.

[LockedBreech]

I love my M1 but prefer button releases. I love the grip of the M1 but I like the look of those magazines better.

I must have changed my mind on whether or not to buy the M2 5 times since I heard about it.

[SteveB]

Roger. Anything else worthy of noting in your hands-on experience with it? I am theoretically aware of it but haven't played with it in person.

Now have 300 rounds of mixed ball and HP through it, no drama. I like the trigger; as mentioned previously, it is a smooth 6 lbs, feels lighter, but the shape of the trigger is great. It's a curved trigger with a broad, flat face which seems to promote a straight pull to the rear, regardless of where your finger ends up on the face. Great ergos for a small pistol, easy to control rapid fire.

With regard to the striker stud, it is obviously not the wide surface of the Gadget, but firm thumb pressure on the stud will push the trigger forward. If the idea is to give some tactile warning of trigger movement during reholstering AIWB, then I think this will do the job for me.

[RJ]

Still none to physically see here in the Tampa area.

Meanwhile:

Does it use a 'stepped' chamber?

Does the takedown 'really' require pressing the trigger?




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[SteveB]

Still none to physically see here in the Tampa area.

Meanwhile:

Does it use a 'stepped' chamber?

Does the takedown 'really' require pressing the trigger?




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Yes.

No.

[RJ]

No.

Orly? Ok, that is cool. I seem to recall the guy in the GunsAmerica do that (press trigger to release slide)...

So how do you field strip the gun if you don't pull the trigger?

It is not a huge deal, either way, I just thought by 2016 any new pistol would tend to avoid having to touch the trigger to get the slide off...

[SteveB]

Orly? Ok, that is cool. I seem to recall the guy in the GunsAmerica do that (press trigger to release slide)...

So how do you field strip the gun if you don't pull the trigger?

It is not a huge deal, either way, I just thought by 2016 any new pistol would tend to avoid having to touch the trigger to get the slide off...

Slightly retract slide, pull down on take-down levers (like Glock), slide comes off.

[RJ]

Slightly retract slide, pull down on take-down levers (like Glock), slide comes off.

Excellent, thanks. Makes sense. I'm going to make an effort to get one of these in my hands to check for fit this week. It really scratches a lot of the small CCW itches I have.

[GJM]

An observation from dry firing the M2. I would much rather speed reload with the six round magazine, as with the seven, I have to be extremely careful not to get a big flap of palm between mag and the frame.

[GJM]

Shot the PPS M2 this afternoon. 50 rounds of 124+P Gold Dot, 50 of Speer G2, and about 50 rounds of my Berry's 124 reloads. No stoppages, sights well regulated in elevation, comfortable shooting. Significantly easier to shoot than my G43. I was hitting an eight steel at 30 yards with it, at will, at a relevant speed.

Home run for Walther!

[GJM]

Rich, on my M2, I need to press the trigger to take it apart. You can do it before depressing the take down levers, at which point the slide comes right off as you move the take down levers, or after if the striker is still cocked.

I blacked my rear sight out with a Sharlie and it is very acceptable (sight picture and smoothness). Is there a tritium front sight of the same dimensions, that can replace the white dot front?

[RJ]

^^^ Thanks.

I asked over at the Walther forum, answer I got was Meprolight?

I googled and got this one:

MeproLight Walther PPS, PPX Front Sight, Green ML18802F.S https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IJZCXMQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awd_PMANwbXXM2J15

?

Are you thinking the HDs might be big (tall) for carry?


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[SteveB]

Orly? Ok, that is cool. I seem to recall the guy in the GunsAmerica do that (press trigger to release slide)...

So how do you field strip the gun if you don't pull the trigger?

It is not a huge deal, either way, I just thought by 2016 any new pistol would tend to avoid having to touch the trigger to get the slide off...

Sorry, Rich, I realize I didn't answer this clearly; GJM got it right.

[GJM]

^^^ Thanks.

I asked over at the Walther forum, answer I got was Meprolight?

I googled and got this one:

MeproLight Walther PPS, PPX Front Sight, Green ML18802F.S https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IJZCXMQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_awd_PMANwbXXM2J15

?

Are you thinking the HDs might be big (tall) for carry?


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I have some (uninstalled) PPS HD sights, but recall Jody saying they were too sharp. The HD sights on my 43 cut the crap out of me, even after taking sand paper to their edges. SteveB reports the TruGlo FX Pro sights are back ordered.

[GJM]

On more thing I forgot to say in my post above. I experimented with more finger with the PPS trigger, and it didn't work out for me, as it messed up how the pistol recoiled. I don't see this as a problem, as the trigger shape is much more forgiving than a Glock.

[GJM]

Fun practice session this afternoon on the plate rack. Near the end, I pulled out the new PPS M2. Went 6/6 on the plate rack at 25, then 5/6 with one shot micro press outs at 30. Here is a run at 10 yards -- no holster yet:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0dEPVXGaK4

Easily, the best shooting little gun I have shot.

[Trooper224]

This is seriously tempting me as a possible BUG, to replace my twenty year old Kahr K9.

[LockedBreech]

I'm concerned about holster fit. Chances of my Galco Stinger PPS M1 fitting that M2?


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[JodyH]

Got my grubby mits on a PPS-M2 today, grip is very nice.
I still prefer the paddle releases of the M1, but the M2 feels like a winner.

[RJ]

Well, I got one this afternoon. Took it home, range trip tomorrow.

It's a BF date code, S/N AN34xx. It was the only one they had, and the salesman did not know much about it. Got it home, field stripped and cleaned it with my Slip 2000 EWL. Looks like it had 10-15 rounds worth of powder and brass kisses. I believe Walther still fires a few rounds out of each gun at the factory, so that tracks. Chamber and bore were clean ish.

My wife really likes it. She said something like, "ooooh, it's a mini-VP9." :cool:

It does feel a lot like my HK. Polymer feels high quality. I like the full length guide rails. Grip is excellent, and it really fits my hand well (I wear a size M glove). Mags pop out like Hershey bars in a candy machine.

The striker thing that protrudes from the slide end cap is excellent. If you cover it with your thumb, you get an immediate tactile feedback if the trigger should move the striker. It is really cool.

I used it for my regular Dry Fire routine, and had no sight movement at the break. I used both 6- and 7- round mags. Both feel good in the hand, the seven rounder feels more stable, obviously. I'm moving out from the distal phalange (which I use for my VP9) to the pad; I got a few tweaks of trigger bite with more trigger finger. Backing out to the pad produced a crisp break and no bite.

I'd say the only downer I've noticed is that you do have to pull the trigger to field strip. I have seen people field strip Glocks, so I imagine it is similar (I don't know.) Anyways, in this day and age, I woulda thought any new design would not require a trigger pull for field strip, but here we are. I suppose for a carry pistol I'm not going to be cleaning it THAT often, but still.

As a lefty, I was a little worried about popping out the mags, and the fact there is no right side slide release. I've gotten used to the left side mag release on my MP9, and to lock the slide, I just swap it to my other hand. So, ya, it is not too lefty friendly but it is no big deal for me.

The trigger motion / action is ever so slightly bound, but it feels like a new pistol that just needs to be shot. What I mean is that there is some very imperceptible binding in the motion of the trigger; but it feels like it will "wear in" with dry fire and shooting.

Break is adequately crisp. Plan to head to the range with my Speer Gold Dot 124 carry load and Blazer Brass 115 training ammo tomorrow.

Also need to get a decent IWB holster. I'm conflicted about the sights. Normally I'd put on Trijicon HDs, but for now I've blacked out the rears with some candle carbon.

Although I had to wait two weeks to find one, I'm glad I did. Hopefully it shoots as well as it feels.

If anyone knows: I shoot top of the sights picture with this gun, right? I'm so used to shooting the dot with my HK, I was wondering...

[BJXDS]

Well, I got one this afternoon. Took it home, range trip tomorrow.

I'd say the only downer I've noticed is that you do have to pull the trigger to field strip. I have seen people field strip Glocks, so I imagine it is similar (I don't know.) Anyways, in this day and age, I woulda thought any new design would not require a trigger pull for field strip, but here we are. I suppose for a carry pistol I'm not going to be cleaning it THAT often, but still.


Good for you, I can't find one anywhere... Not that you asked but, depending on how often you carry and things you do while carrying you may be surprised how dirty it gets, Dust,dirt,fuzz balls,sand,saw dust. ie if you only wear it out to dinner or on a Sunday ride, probably won't get very dirty. If you cut grass/wood or your Sunday ride is on a 4 wheeler thru the woods and your dinner is by a camp fire probably a different story. ... just something to think about, a quick inspection and wipe down will take less than 15 min.

Also if you decide you don't like it let me know, but I doubt that will happen.

[RJ]

Good for you, I can't find one anywhere... Not that you asked but, depending on how often you carry and things you do while carrying you may be surprised how dirty it gets, Dust,dirt,fuzz balls,sand,saw dust. ie if you only wear it out to dinner or on a Sunday ride, probably won't get very dirty. If you cut grass/wood or your Sunday ride is on a 4 wheeler thru the woods and your dinner is by a camp fire probably a different story. ... just something to think about, a quick inspection and wipe down will take less than 15 min.

Also if you decide you don't like it let me know, but I doubt that will happen.

Thanks, good info. Yeah, I'm not real big on nail polish in roll marks, or worrying about external wear on a plastic pistol. :cool:

Turns out I'd contacted 35+ Walther dealers from Ocala to Tampa to St Pete to Orlando and Apopka. Some had not even heard of it. About five told me they can't get them from their distributor. My contact in Ft Smith indicated also that they were in short supply; apparently they really underestimated demand.

I did get an email today on one in Brandon, if you are anywhere near there. There are also a bunch (5 maybe?) of auctions on Gunbroker when I checked. I think finding one at a LGS is going to be hit or miss.

And no, I suspect I'll be keeping it. :cool:

[Sasage]

Thanks, good info. Yeah, I'm not real big on nail polish in roll marks, or worrying about external wear on a plastic pistol. :cool:

Turns out I'd contacted 35+ Walther dealers from Ocala to Tampa to St Pete to Orlando and Apopka. Some had not even heard of it. About five told me they can't get them from their distributor. My contact in Ft Smith indicated also that they were in short supply; apparently they really underestimated demand.

I did get an email today on one in Brandon, if you are anywhere near there. There are also a bunch (5 maybe?) of auctions on Gunbroker when I checked. I think finding one at a LGS is going to be hit or miss.

And no, I suspect I'll be keeping it. :cool:
GAG had one today but I believe they were asking $450

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[RJ]

GAG had one today but I believe they were asking $450

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That is not bad. Ky Gun Co. had them for around $403 I think before they sold out a few weeks ago.

List on mine was $549, but my LGS had a GB auction going. So the manager said he'd match that price at $450. I could not get my Visa card out fast enough. :cool:

[Sasage]

I put some rounds through a 43 today and that further solidified my already well carried Shield. This PPS M2 could tempt me though

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[olstyn]

I believe Walther still fires a few rounds out of each gun at the factory, so that tracks.

If anyone knows: I shoot top of the sights picture with this gun, right? I'm so used to shooting the dot with my HK, I was wondering...

My understanding is that Walther fires a 5-shot group at the factory, in addition to a proof load. That target is probably above the foam in the upper side of the plastic case it came in. Unless Walther has changed how they regulate their sights, it'll probably be drive the dot like your HK; that's how my P99c is.

[RJ]

Range Report

Shooting at my local indoor range, Florida Firearms Academy. About 65F.

Today I wanted to:

- Validate the PPS M2 reliability (0 malfunctions)
- Ensure it ran with my carry ammo
- Experiment with grip
- Check the sights for windage and elevation.

I was shooting new Blazer Brass 115 gr FMJ and Speer Gold Dot 124 HP standard pressure rounds.

Course of Fire (shorthand version, I keep these notes on my phone at the range):

HK 20x 115 BB 3 yds
PPS 13 BB warmup
PPS 13 BB on 6 dot
10 BB FYL 3 yd score:3/10
20 BB B8s 25 yd. 40%|20%
20 GD B8s 25 yd. 60%-1X|50%
10 GD FYL 3 yd score:
13 GD misc
7 GD Misc. (box of GD gone)n
10 BB on B8 at 3yds:
Trigger did not reset?
Dropped 7 round mag and cleared.
Reloaded. No issues after. (Note: Maglula?)
13 BB Circles. Same! 6 rounder. Not in battery? Lube? Reloaded, shot ok. Firm grip and rip. No issues.
13 BB misc.
13 BB misc.

Assessment

Shot 155 rounds, with 0 FTF and 0 FTE. Ejection was strong and to the right, in a nice pattern to my weak side. I had no rounds hit my eye pro or hat. Had no FTLB.

I did notice what whether it was me, the gun, or the ammo, my groups today shot consistently high. I was using an "HK cover the dot" hold that I use for my VP9.

After reviewing my notes, I had three watch items. These aren't huge concerns, but I wanted to get them down on paper.

The first one is the most important, and related to the slide not going forward. Twice (1x with 7 round, 1x with 6 round) the slide did not go all they way into battery when racked.

Here is what it looked like when it happened:

You can see the slide is not quite in battery. I dropped the mag, ejected the round, and reloaded. Enthusiastically racking the slide, the problem did not reoccur. It happened one time with the 6 round, and once with the 7 round.

Evaluation: Dirty slide / not enough lube / gun needs shooting more? It's also possible I need to give it more grip and rip. Maybe my technique from my VP9 doesn't carry over to this pistol. Or maybe I should release slide from catch?

I found myself being all tactical, and tapping the rear of the slide, operator like, with my balled up fist. Pity I don't have a beard. :cool:

The second watch item was some trigger finger bite. I had a definite hot spot on the bottom of my trigger finger after the session. No blister, but I noticed it.

Evaluation: Wear band aid? Reposition trigger finger?

The third was pretty minor: once every 20 rounds or so, my Maglula would not seat on the mag properly. Wiggling it a bit it freed up, then I could load the rounds normally.

And that was it. It ate both my ammo types with no issues, round after round. Having two mags was a pain.

All in all I'm happy (check that, very happy) with my new ccw. Need moar mags, but apparently they are not avail from Ft Smith to the dealers yet. I found the 7 round mag offered good purchase. Oddly even with the 6 round mag, my pinky rested under the mag and I did not really lose a lot in feel or accuracy, or so it felt.

I like this gun. A lot.

Edit to Add Target Photos

25 yard, GDs, 2 hand unsupported. First ten had 4 on paper, second ten had 6, and one in the X woohoo!!

This is at 3 yards, with BB, 2 hand for scoring on a B-8. This is typical, and why I think I'll go to a top of sight hold next time. Windage is good, I think my dry fire / breathing is helping at the range.

[S Jenks]

In regards to the slide failing to fully seat, if the M2 is like the original PPS it is extremely tight fitting for a polymer gun. When I picked up my early PPS I had this happen a number of times. I cleaned it and spent maybe 10 solid minutes racking the slide. That and a few more range sessions wore it in to "just right".

[Cool Breeze]

In regards to the slide failing to fully seat, if the M2 is like the original PPS it is extremely tight fitting for a polymer gun. When I picked up my early PPS I had this happen a number of times. I cleaned it and spent maybe 10 solid minutes racking the slide. That and a few more range sessions wore it in to "just right". THis happened with my buddy's pps classic. We added more lube, racked a bunch of times, seemed to fix it.

[Sasage]

Did you strip and lube the M2 or just run it from the box?

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[RJ]

Did you strip and lube the M2 or just run it from the box?

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Yes, per manual, did a basic field strip, clean and lube (Slip 2000 EWL) as soon as I got home.

I will say cleaning the second time, today, after the range session, I was a bit more enthusiastic in scrubbing the rails. Also applied a bit more lube as well.

[RJ]

I'm sending it off to Tony next week, so holsters should be coming. Looks like a keeper.

When you get this holster, could you post details?

Besides being on the hunt for magazines (the Walther gurus are telling me they haven't shipped spare mags from Germany yet), I also need to source a decent kydex IWB holster. Right now looking at the Dara Kydex IWB as an option. Thoughts?

http://www.daraholsters.com/iwb/

[HCM]

When you get this holster, could you post details?

Besides being on the hunt for magazines (the Walther gurus are telling me they haven't shipped spare mags from Germany yet), I also need to source a decent kydex IWB holster. Right now looking at the Dara Kydex IWB as an option. Thoughts?

http://www.daraholsters.com/iwb/

Not at all a fan of those plastic clips, see if they can do the holster with belt loops instead. If you need or want a clip, the Dark Star Gear metal clip is the way to go.

[Beat Trash]

I've been using Tony's (JM custom Kydex) OWB and IWB holsters since he was basically unknown on the internet. He is my "Go-To" holster guy.

I just recently started the road into AWIB after 34 years of carrying IWB at about 4 O'Clock. So I won't comment in AWIB carry until I get some more time with it this spring. I have one of his IWB #3 holsters for a M&P Shield that I use for cutting the grass and lazy around the house days. Also use this holster when in Sanibel and carrying the Shield (except for shirtless pocket carry of course). The clip works well.

http://www.jmcustomkydex.com/p/IWB3.html

[gtmtnbiker98]

THis happened with my buddy's pps classic. We added more lube, racked a bunch of times, seemed to fix it.

The PPS is extremely tight and needs to wear in in order for it to smooth out.

[RJ]

Not at all a fan of those plastic clips, see if they can do the holster with belt loops instead. If you need or want a clip, the Dark Star Gear metal clip is the way to go.

Mmmyeahhhhh...I saw the clips and remembered someone her saying they weren't a really good idea.

Ok, I looked at the jmck web site, wow do they have a lot of options. Maybe I need to call and discuss my requirements, or do ya'll think I could order one off the rack, as it were?

I mean, the PPS M2 is not real big. It would be my first evarrrr carry holster, so I will be self conscious about it.

Here is what I "think" I need, bearing in mind I don't know jack:

- Sturdy kydex build construction, ensuring trigger guard is covered
- Black
- Ride height such that a slide indexed firing grip is possible
- Belt loops or clips to allow taking off / putting on holster conveniently
- Smallest possible sweat guard
- Left side, 4 o'clock
- Straight cant *

Generally I will be wearing an untucked dri-fit T-shirt and cargo shorts. I will be buying a good 1" and 1/2" leather belt (e.g. Thebeltman).

* I see cants listed as 'straight' and 'FBI'. I've never been sure why it is called the 'FBI' cant. Do Federal Agents wear pistols at an angle? Do most .civ CCW wearers use a straight or FBI cant?

Is there one of the JMCK IWB holsters that matches up with the above for me for a PPS M2?

Sorry for holster advice request tangent. :)

[olstyn]

- Left side, 4 o'clock
- Straight cant *

Obviously individuals vary, but with the angles involved, if you're going to wear it at 8 o'clock like that, you may find that the FBI/15 degree cant allows you a smoother draw. The farther forward on your body you go, the more straight drop makes sense, but when you're reaching even a little bit behind yourself for the gun, a straight drop will cause you to contort your wrist a bit in order to get a good grip.

[JAD]

The rake also helps the profile of the butt hide inside the envelope of your torso when you bend over. For me that's important, but I wear the gun closer to 3:00.

[davisj]

...* I see cants listed as 'straight' and 'FBI'. I've never been sure why it is called the 'FBI' cant. Do Federal Agents wear pistols at an angle? Do most .civ CCW wearers use a straight or FBI cant?...

I believe FBI in this context stands for Forward Body Incline but could be wrong.

[Chuck Whitlock]

"FBI cant" generally = 15 degrees.

I don't have any experience with Tony's gear yet (I have a mag pouch on order), but I have a few Versa Clips and V2 Uno's from Rich at CCC ( and a couple more on the way):

http://www.customcarryconcepts.com/VersaClip_p_16.html

http://www.customcarryconcepts.com/The-Uno-version-2_p_47.html

The Versa Clip for my Kahr CW9 is full coverage, and the one for a Ruger SP101 leaves the muzzle uncovered. Since you will be carrying LH, and I am not sure if the mag catch is reversible on the PPS M2, one thing Rich's design does is protect the magazine release from accidental activation.

[Cool Breeze]

I think cant is a matter of both personal preference and where you wear the holster. For my body type concealability goes right out the window past 3:30ish (cant or non cant). As such, I wear at 2:30/3 straight drop. At 2:30/3:00 I hate drawing from a cant as my wrist has to get all convoluted to get to the gun. Put an unloaded gun in your pants at different clock positions and cant positions to test concealability/draw/comfort etc and see what works best for you.

[Beat Trash]

Mmmyeahhhhh...I saw the clips and remembered someone her saying they weren't a really good idea.

Ok, I looked at the jmck web site, wow do they have a lot of options. Maybe I need to call and discuss my requirements, or do ya'll think I could order one off the rack, as it were?

I mean, the PPS M2 is not real big. It would be my first evarrrr carry holster, so I will be self conscious about it.

Here is what I "think" I need, bearing in mind I don't know jack:

- Sturdy kydex build construction, ensuring trigger guard is covered
- Black
- Ride height such that a slide indexed firing grip is possible
- Belt loops or clips to allow taking off / putting on holster conveniently
- Smallest possible sweat guard
- Left side, 4 o'clock
- Straight cant *

Generally I will be wearing an untucked dri-fit T-shirt and cargo shorts. I will be buying a good 1" and 1/2" leather belt (e.g. Thebeltman).

* I see cants listed as 'straight' and 'FBI'. I've never been sure why it is called the 'FBI' cant. Do Federal Agents wear pistols at an angle? Do most .civ CCW wearers use a straight or FBI cant?

Is there one of the JMCK IWB holsters that matches up with the above for me for a PPS M2?

Sorry for holster advice request tangent. :)

The JMCK IWB version three, 15 degree cant, with a medium sweat guard, a 1.5" clip, and I would also spend the extra $5.00 and get the "extra Tuck" feature (pushes the top of the gun into the body just a tad more, aiding in concealment). I have this holster for a M&P Shield, which is a gun that is very close in size to the PPS M2 you just bought. It's the holster I use whenever I carry a Shield off duty. If I buy a PPS M2 (very tempted to do so...), I'll order the same holster for the PPS.

The thing to understand about cant is it should increase the farther around you get on your body. If 12 o'clock is your navel, and 3 o'clock is your right hip bone, ect, a zero degree cant works for AWIB in the 12-1 o'clock position. Right at or just in front of the hip joint, many like a 10 degree cant. Get past the 3 o'clock position and the 15 degree cant is preferred. Over the years, I have seen holsters made with the "FBI Cant" range anywhere from 10 degrees to 15 degrees. Saw one OWB pancake holster with a "FBI Cant" that was close to a 20 degree cant.

I have carried over my right kidney area for about the last 30 years. Call this 4 o'clock. At this position, a 15 degree cant works for most smaller guns. If it's a larger, full sized gun, I have better luck in this position with a 20 degree cant.

A good belt is as important as a good holster. They work as a team. Just pay attention to the sizing guide. I used a 1.5" leather belt from the beltman for a while. Excellent leather belt. But I have to admit that I basically retired my leather belt I bought from the beltman shortly after breaking it in.

At the advice of an internet friend, I tried a belt from aresgear, specifically their Aegis belt. I love this belt. And on hot and muggy days, it's not as effected by sweating as my leather belts are.

http://www.aresgear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=99_108&products_id=454

[RJ]

^^^ Solid copy, as they say. :cool:

Yup, I have a black Ares Aegis belt I really like for gun games. For every day wear, I would prefer to have a gun belt version of the chestnut brown leather belt I typically put on most days. A member here suggested looking at Saddleback Leather Tow belt; it looks like what I am fishing for.

Thanks on the holster. I will contact JMCK pronto and order up an IWB Version 3. Much appreciate the pointer.

[BJXDS]

Another vote for the JMCK
I really like JMCK, IWB/OWB. When I get another holster it will most likely be JMCK. One on the best clips I have seen on a holster was a strong steel spring clip with keeper on a GrandfatherOak kydex. I believe the dude who makes them now has several Federal charges. story for another day but... I very much wanted a spring steel clip style for the ease of repeatedly taking it on/off in less than ideal positions. DURABILITY and RELIABILITY were also very important.

I was concerned about the clip on JMCK so I contacted Tony, and he said they have never had an issue with them. I took him for his word, and have never had an issue.I have done everything imaginable with the holster on, except actually roll on the ground fighting someone, (Hopefully it NEVER happens)

In my mind I still can't believe the plastic/kydex clip is as good as a steel clip, but the same holds try for a plastic/polymer gun or mag vs an all steel one either.

Bottom line my IWB with clip has served me well.

God luck, I really don't want to know how much I have spent on holsters throughout the years, that are now in holster heaven.

[GJM]

Tony at JM has a PPS M2 for making holsters.

[JAD]

This illustrates why I use 15 degree rake even with 3:00 carry. I do have to break my wrist a little at count 1. http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160130/dcceebafc9e82ad4b60c2f1afac3766d.jpg

[RJ]

I will contact JMCK pronto and order up an IWB Version 3. Much appreciate the pointer.

I contacted Tony this morning, got an email back immediately. I have a Version 3 IWB in the order queue.

[Grey]

Going to have to follow Rich and pick up a M2, seems to hit everything I want. Thanks for being my beta tester :)

[SteveB]

When you get this holster, could you post details?[/url]

Holster arrived today; got the George AIWB, medium sweat guard model that is now my standard; typical excellent JMK quality. One nice touch is the neoprene wedge that velcros onto the holster body, tucking the pistol's grip into your body. The wedge is easily customizable; I find it helps more with larger pistols, and am not using it right now with the PPS. The JMK/PPS M2 combo carries flat with a small footprint on the belt; real happy with it.

5774

5775

[YVK]

The original PPS would not fire with its backstrap removed (or fallen off). Is M2 the same in this regard?

[deejai]

I read that they did away with that feature as well as interchangeable backstraps.

[GJM]

The original PPS would not fire with its backstrap removed (or fallen off). Is M2 the same in this regard?

Removed.

I heard the design criteria for the M2 was to mimic a Tangfoglio, but in a smaller package.

[taadski]

^^^ Solid copy, as they say. :cool:

Yup, I have a black Ares Aegis belt I really like for gun games. For every day wear, I would prefer to have a gun belt version of the chestnut brown leather belt I typically put on most days. A member here suggested looking at Saddleback Leather Tow belt; it looks like what I am fishing for.

Thanks on the holster. I will contact JMCK pronto and order up an IWB Version 3. Much appreciate the pointer.



Rich, If you're a fan of the Aegis buckle system (I am) but like the look/feel of leather, check out...

http://www.meangeneleather.com/shop/mgl-victory-aegis-black/

[YVK]

Removed.

I heard the design criteria for the M2 was to mimic a Tangfoglio, but in a smaller package.

They did a crappy job then. PPS is not nearly as shiny.

[GJM]

Possible sight option for the M2 is to send the slide to Tool Tech, and have a tritium front with orange ring installed, as described in Beretta thread.

[RJ]

On sale for $399 at gunbuyer:

http://www.gunbuyer.com/p-70721-walther-pps-m2-black-9mm-32.aspx

[Rustin]

An observation from dry firing the M2. I would much rather speed reload with the six round magazine, as with the seven, I have to be extremely careful not to get a big flap of palm between mag and the frame.

This is what concerns me with small pistols and why I like the aftermarket ingenuity that gravitates toward the popular shield and glock. There's a company making base plates for the shield that doesn't come in contact with your hands, making mags drop and reload more easily.

I was thinking of removing the plastic spacer sleeve on the 8 round pps mags to have enough extension to alleviate the pinching of a mag change.

[RJ]

I was thinking of removing the plastic spacer sleeve on the 8 round pps mags to have enough extension to alleviate the pinching of a mag change.

Just an FYI, the 8 round M2 mag, part no. 2807807, is not quite available for sale, yet. A Fort Smith rep indicated to me last week they were shipping to retailers, but I've not found them in stock anywhere.

[Chuck Whitlock]

This is what concerns me with small pistols and why I like the aftermarket ingenuity that gravitates toward the popular shield and glock. There's a company making base plates for the shield that doesn't come in contact with your hands, making mags drop and reload more easily.

I was thinking of removing the plastic spacer sleeve on the 8 round pps mags to have enough extension to alleviate the pinching of a mag change.

I always wondered why manufactures went with the grip sleeve instead of an extended floorplate, like the offerings from Kahr and 10-8:

http://www.kahr.com/Magazines/Kahr-8-Round-9mm-Magazine-with-Grip-Extension-K920G-K920G-PACKED.asp

http://www.10-8performance.com/s-w-m-p-45-base-pad-extended/

[RJ]

From today; 73-0X is pretty good for me.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160220/3018a077246d7e6a13e94d978b07303e.jpg

This was 2 hand unsupported at 25 yards with Blazer Brass 115 FMJ.

342 rounds through the pistol to date with 0 FTF/FTE, no malfunctions. It really does feel like a mini-me VP9, if HK made a single stack 9mm striker fire gun.

[peterb]

I just had a chance to handle an M2 side-by-side with a Shield. The Shield was more "comfortable", but the squarer edges and finger grooves on the M2 felt as if they might make it easier to control. I also had an easier time hitting the slide release on the M2.

Time to see if the range rents both......

[BJXDS]

I finally got my hands on one with the Trijicon HD Orange. I think I was expecting a baby PPQ, not quite. I started with some slow fire 3x5 and 2" circle from 7 yards, WTF, I was low left by a couple of inches. There is no way I was pulling shots....... or was there? The groups were good, just not where I was aiming. Then I moved on to the FAST target. Still to the left in the box. Then rapid fire, I was able to keep everything in the circle. I went back to the box, held right side line and hit center. So I will need to check the sights next time out. Also with the HD's I need to shoot dot, not top of sight.

Aside from my verifying the proper sight setup/hold..... The trigger was not bad, just not what I expected a little heavier, longer reset and felt a little rough, recoil was not bad, but more than VP9/PPQ TO BE EXPECTED. Now I know there are not any XDS fans here but the PPS recoil was sharper and the trigger overall did not feel as smooth. Honestly it did not make a difference in my performance just a feeling.

While definitely smaller an thinner than the Q the grip length with the 8 round was only about a 1/4 inch shorter. More range time is needed, but I think the PPS is good for what it is, but this just confirms for me, I really like the PPQ/G19/VP9 size much better for shooting.

I was shooting multiple guns today so I really need to dedicate a range session to just the PPS to give it a fair shake. I had a preconceived idea it would be a baby Q, and it AINT, BUT it aint bad either.

[GJM]

JM Universal for PPS M2 (and also one for a G26) arrived today. The surprise was the PPS didn't conceal appreciably better than the G26. Given the advantages of the 26 in shootability, capacity and accessories, it begs the question as to why a PPS?

[agksimon]

I just bought a PPS M2, 9mm the other day and took it to the range, to compare it to my Shield 9mm, which has a Burwell trigger job and breaks at less than 5lbs. Did a 25 yard pistol rest test and using American Eagle 147 grain ammo, the Shield gives a 5" group and the PPS M2 was about half that size. Extremely accurate for a gun of that size and nice trigger, just over 5lbs. It has the best ergonomics of any pistol I have used. It's a keeper.

[Cecil Burch]

JM Universal for PPS M2 (and also one for a G26) arrived today. The surprise was the PPS didn't conceal appreciably better than the G26. Given the advantages of the 26 in shootability, capacity and accessories, it begs the question as to why a PPS?


On you perhaps it does not makes sense. For both my daughter and I (fortunately not in the same way because we don't have the same build), a PPS conceals much, much better. Especially for her in her fashionable, mid-20's professional clothing choices, a 26 a colostomy bag. A PPS is not.

[GJM]

On you perhaps it does not makes sense. For both my daughter and I (fortunately not in the same way because we don't have the same build), a PPS conceals much, much better. Especially for her in her fashionable, mid-20's professional clothing choices, a 26 a colostomy bag. A PPS is not.

Same for my wife, who conceals a 43 way better than the 26. The 26 is her EDC, and a 42 or 43 is her light clothing choice.

However, in a AIWB holst with tuck, worn appendix, there is no appreciable difference in concealment between the PPS and G26 on my 6-1, 168 pound body. Behind the hip, I suspect the PPS would conceal easier.

[JHC]

Same for my wife, who conceals a 43 way better than the 26. The 26 is her EDC, and a 42 or 43 is her light clothing choice.

However, in a AIWB holst with tuck, worn appendix, there is no appreciable difference in concealment between the PPS and G26 on my 6-1, 168 pound body. Behind the hip, I suspect the PPS would conceal easier.

No kidding. A G26 in a Smart Carry ordered for the G42 and the 26 disappears in my disco dance clothes!

[Cecil Burch]

Same for my wife, who conceals a 43 way better than the 26. The 26 is her EDC, and a 42 or 43 is her light clothing choice.

However, in a AIWB holst with tuck, worn appendix, there is no appreciable difference in concealment between the PPS and G26 on my 6-1, 168 pound body. Behind the hip, I suspect the PPS would conceal easier.


Again, for YOU. I and my daughter both carry AIWB in a Keepers holster. And as I said, both of us have found an appreciable difference in concealment between a PPS and a 26 carried in that specific position. And when I wear a bellyband, the difference becomes even more noticeable.

[RJ]

Posting this after Tac Con '16 in Memphis.

Still post processing from this awesome conference, and as we are now en route Texas, will keep this brief.

I shot my PPS M2 at John Murphy's self defense range session Saturday 12-4, as well as in the match.

164 rounds of Speer Lawman 124 gr. ammo with zero FTF/FTE or malfunctions.

I used my new JM Custom Kydex 3:30 left hand iwb holster and shot the range session and match from concealment. The holster worked flawlessly, really felt confident with it even though it was literally my first time using it "in anger" as it were.

I felt confident enough with the gun and holster I kept it chambered and hot out the door of the Memphis FTU and out to dinner.

(I was shocked, shocked I tell you, no one in the place (Chili's Millington) noticed or cared I was armed. :cool:)

I feel very confident that the combination of my VP9 (which I used for Paul Sharp's Recoil Control session and Nyeti's LAPD Qual demo session) with the Walther PPS M2 really really works for me.

[GJM]

Again, for YOU. I and my daughter both carry AIWB in a Keepers holster. And as I said, both of us have found an appreciable difference in concealment between a PPS and a 26 carried in that specific position. And when I wear a bellyband, the difference becomes even more noticeable.

Interesting, and just goes to show how body and holster specific AIWB carry is. Which part of the Glock 26 prints more than the PPS on you?

[GJM]

I just took a picture of the PPS with 7 round magazine in the JM Universal, followed by the Glock 26 with standard ten round magazine in the JM Universal. Even though I would never use this garment to conceal, I covered with a clingy, IceBreaker Body fit t shirt, that shows each pistol well, in terms of what prints.

PPS M2:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/FullSizeRender%205_zps3qwhp8r7.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/FullSizeRender%205_zps3qwhp8r7.jpg.html)


Glock 26:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/FullSizeRender%206_zpsyoljouem.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/FullSizeRender%206_zpsyoljouem.jpg.html)

[Trooper224]

With either one it simply looks like you've got a cell phone on your belt.

[ffhounddog]

I just took a picture of the PPS with 7 round magazine in the JM Universal, followed by the Glock 26 with standard ten round magazine in the JM Universal. Even though I would never use this garment to conceal, I covered with a clingy, IceBreaker Body fit t shirt, that shows each pistol well, in terms of what prints.

PPS M2:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/FullSizeRender%205_zps3qwhp8r7.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/FullSizeRender%205_zps3qwhp8r7.jpg.html)


Glock 26:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/FullSizeRender%206_zpsyoljouem.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/FullSizeRender%206_zpsyoljouem.jpg.html)

Stop showing off. Not all of us can wear shorts even this time of the year. My legs are too white ;)

[Kram]

Bumping this up for any updates on the PPS M2. Has anyone had any issues with the gun? They seem to be selling out all over the place but there haven't been much reported. Hopefully they are as solid as the M1.

[RJ]

Bumping this up for any updates on the PPS M2. Has anyone had any issues with the gun? They seem to be selling out all over the place but there haven't been much reported. Hopefully they are as solid as the M1.

I have a round count thread going over at the Walther forum:

http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46218

We are at 8,000+ rounds logged with a wide range of ammo. Very very few malfunctions are being reported. I have 400 so far on mine with 0 issues. I like it a lot.

[agksimon]

Got my PPS M2 about a month ago. Tried a lot of ammo brands and weights and still find the American Eagle 147 grain FMJ to hold the tightest groups. Been averaging 2.5 to 3 inch groups, at 25 yards, off a pistol rest. Quite amazing for such a small gun. I did have Dawson Precision make me front fiber optic sight, the exact same height and width as the original white dot sight. Much faster on pickup. I also honed the face of the striker (a little lube too) to drop the trigger pull down to 5 pounds. Been finding magazines (got two 7's and two 8's), but it takes a lot of looking and leaving your name with the dealers.
Got a couple of hundred rounds down the pipe and not one malfunction. Love this gun, best I've ever had. No more inaccurate M&P's for me.

[Hot Sauce]

For those of you who often conceal this pistol, how are you carrying your reloads?

I wonder because I carry double stacks with a single reload AIWB canted on my non-dominant side. That amount of ammo strikes me as a good balance of concealment and ability to get through a short encounter with up to several people. If I were to carry a single stack, the total of ~15 rounds spread over two magazines strikes me as low. During an ECQC evo, we were not given reloads. So when I expended all my ammo dealing with two threats and one continued coming after me, I had to go hands on. Clearly, a sub-optimal situation I never want to experience outside of a learning environment.

The problem is, I don't have a good third place to put more stuff on my mid-section (pistol on one side of the stomach, first reload on the other). I suppose I could do a pocket mag carrier in the non-dominant side pants pocket. It is doable, but its sucks for consistency's sake because of the variations--pocket angle/size of pockets/size of pocket opening--on different pants. Sometime, you reach in for a mag and despite your best efforts what comes out is the mag and the pocket mag carrier together. That's why I transitioned away from those in the first place.

[RJ]

Don't currently carry a reload. Interested in the responses, though.

[Wondering Beard]

For those of you who often conceal this pistol, how are you carrying your reloads?

I wonder because I carry double stacks with a single reload AIWB canted on my non-dominant side. That amount of ammo strikes me as a good balance of concealment and ability to get through a short encounter with up to several people. If I were to carry a single stack, the total of ~15 rounds spread over two magazines strikes me as low. During an ECQC evo, we were not given reloads. So when I expended all my ammo dealing with two threats and one continued coming after me, I had to go hands on. Clearly, a sub-optimal situation I never want to experience outside of a learning environment.

The problem is, I don't have a good third place to put more stuff on my mid-section (pistol on one side of the stomach, first reload on the other). I suppose I could do a pocket mag carrier in the non-dominant side pants pocket. It is doable, but its sucks for consistency's sake because of the variations--pocket angle/size of pockets/size of pocket opening--on different pants. Sometime, you reach in for a mag and despite your best efforts what comes out is the mag and the pocket mag carrier together. That's why I transitioned away from those in the first place.

It's going to depend on your body type and the clothes you wear.

For example, if you wear untucked shirts or polos that aren't tight over your body, you could get away with an extra mag at about 3 o'clock (with those types of clothes I can get away with a double mag pouch at about 3 o'clock for my G19's mags).

You could just try, when wearing your regular gear, to place an empty mag in different places around your waistband and check both access and printing. You know yourself best but an extra single stack mag shouldn't be too difficult to conceal

[GJM]

A PPS mag in a JM AIWB pouch in front of the support side hip will mag the mag disappear.

[ssb]

I don't use an M2, but I do still use an original PPS on occasion.

The JMCK pouch is great so long as you aren't carrying a Clinch Pick/similar at the 10-11 o'clock position. When I started doing that, I unfortunately ran out of room (32" waist). I could either have the mag pouch in a comfortable spot and have the knife print badly, or have the knife well-concealed and have the mag pouch digging into my pelvis. I prioritize having the knife at hand over a quick reload so the mag pouch lost that round. I ended up giving in and mounting the magazine in a Blue Force Gear pistol mag pouch on a Raven Pocket Shield. I never got around to ordering an OWB mag pouch (and probably will not, given the role this pistol fills), but I imagine it would conceal easily at/around the hip.

[Hot Sauce]

A PPS mag in a JM AIWB pouch in front of the support side hip will mag the mag disappear.

Do you also carry two reloads? Also, anything the JM pouch does differently than other ones?



You could just try, when wearing your regular gear, to place an empty mag in different places around your waistband and check both access and printing. You know yourself best but an extra single stack mag shouldn't be too difficult to conceal

You're probably right. I should mention, to clarify in case it was unclear, that I do not own a PPS yet. I'm thinking about it, and anticipating issues, like dealing with a lack of capacity.



The JMCK pouch is great so long as you aren't carrying a Clinch Pick/similar at the 10-11 o'clock position. When I started doing that, I unfortunately ran out of room (32" waist). I could either have the mag pouch in a comfortable spot and have the knife print badly, or have the knife well-concealed and have the mag pouch digging into my pelvis.

I actually wondered if that would happen, but haven't gotten around to carrying a CP-style knife yet.

[Cool Breeze]

I finally was able to get my hands on one of these. I have mixed emotions. It felt good in my hand for sure, but I will say it is noticeably heavier than the glock 43 (which I own and had one side by side to compare). They looked the very similar in width. The glocks grip was shorter. What got me confused was the trigger. The trigger felt good to me on the pps m2, but had no reset. I mean, I could not feel anything. I am not sure if reset is important or not as I understand there are different schools of thought on the issue. I just never heard anyone say it and remember a lot of M&P owners complaining about it. On the version on tested, the reset was a lot less than even on the M&P. Its an interesting gun, but probably due to weight I would just keep the G43 or G26 if i wanted to carry a heavier gun.

[RJ]

^^^ Lack of reset might be a gun to gun thing? Can't say I recall seeing that discussed over at the brand-specific forum.

Not that I go looking for it, but the reset on mine is pretty noticeable. Much much more so than on my 2013 build M&P FS9.

Agree with you on the heft. I think Hickock45 weighed a PPS Classic the same as a G26, if I recall correctly.

[gqllc007]

In the summer time I will be carrying the GLock 43 due to smaller size and being lighter. In spring and fall I will carry the PPS M2. During winter it will be the G26. I am in NY Albany area.

[mrozowjj]

^^^ Lack of reset might be a gun to gun thing? Can't say I recall seeing that discussed over at the brand-specific forum.

Not that I go looking for it, but the reset on mine is pretty noticeable. Much much more so than on my 2013 build M&P FS9.

Agree with you on the heft. I think Hickock45 weighed a PPS Classic the same as a G26, if I recall correctly.

No idea if Walther or Glock weigh their guns with a magazine in them but the weights stated on the Glock website and Walther website say

16.19 oz Glock 43
19.00 oz M&P Shield
19.75 oz Glock 26
20.80 oz Walther PPS
20.99 oz Glock 19
21.10 oz Walther PPS M2
22.04 oz Glock 17

So from a weight stand point the Walthers don' t make a ton of sense but I still love my PPS M2 for a few reasons. One unlike the PP M1 it doesn't have that "feature" where the back strap removal disables the gun completely. It was nice for field stripping because you can take the gun appart to clean without pulling a trigger but it made me uneasy knowing if that plastic cracked the gun might not work.

Two I shoot it well. Do I shoot it better than a Glock 19? No but the difference is marginal and the Walther is a bit slimmer (again not really by a lot about 0.18 inches actually) but that combined with the rounder shape makes it easier to conceal, and my competition gun is a Walther PPQ M2 and while it's not a direct translation there's something to be said for keeping it in the family with your carry and competition guns.

And third and this is the big one for me I like that both PPS M1 and M2 have that cocked rod that pokes out the rear of the gun as the trigger is being pressed, that means I can cover the rear slide plate cover with my thumb while the gun is being holstered and if for some reason thr trigger is snagging on something I will know and can correct it before I send a round in my leg. Yes there is the gadget for the Glock but whether it was a consciencous design decision or not that makes it one of the only striker fired guns coming from the factory to prevent acidental circumcisions. I like that a lot.

[RJ]

^^^ The above is exactly why I bought a PPS M2.

Almost verbatim. :)

[RJ]

Question for the experts:

Cleaning my magazines today, I noticed a small divot dug into the top of the followers.

Pictured is the follower from the 7 rounder, but both have identical divots.

It looks about 2-3 mm wide and 3-4 mm long, central to the axis along which the cartridge would be stripped up and into the feed ramp.

Gun has 700+ rounds of Speer Lawman 124, BB 115 and Gold Dots. It has had zero malfunctions.

I've never heard of this before. My M&P and HK VP9 have thousands of rounds but no such divots.

Is this something to worry about or should I just get on with shooting it?

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160426/eff17e7f9ecb3a86b7abb608465ca74d.jpg

[Kennydale]

https://youtu.be/ixMxsOuBj-w
I really like this person's Video Blogs. I am not in the market for a SS9 (YET !) I carry a Glck G17(AIWB) and though i am 65, I do not have any issue with the weight of my Fullsize firearm. I think just off hand i'd like the Shield for capacity and Glock G43 for trigger. The Walther PPS M2 really intrigues me. I am hoping this year at the TX GUN FEST that Walther has them for demo.

[S Jenks]

Is this something to worry about or should I just get on with shooting it?

I have a 9mm PPS M3 with only about 300 rounds through it. Both of my mags have this on the followers. I don't know if this is a wear point or if they are molded with this in place.

Are magazines for sale yet? I can't find any.

[gtmtnbiker98]

Question for the experts:

Cleaning my magazines today, I noticed a small divot dug into the top of the followers.

Pictured is the follower from the 7 rounder, but both have identical divots.

It looks about 2-3 mm wide and 3-4 mm long, central to the axis along which the cartridge would be stripped up and into the feed ramp.

Gun has 700+ rounds of Speer Lawman 124, BB 115 and Gold Dots. It has had zero malfunctions.

I've never heard of this before. My M&P and HK VP9 have thousands of rounds but no such divots.

Is this something to worry about or should I just get on with shooting it?

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160426/eff17e7f9ecb3a86b7abb608465ca74d.jpgTotally normal.

[RJ]

I have a 9mm PPS M3 with only about 300 rounds through it. Both of my mags have this on the followers. I don't know if this is a wear point or if they are molded with this in place.

Are magazines for sale yet? I can't find any.

I've found a searchable key using the Walther part nos.:

6 round 2807785

7 round 2807793

8 round 2807807

So, for example, if you want to search for a 6 round magazine, enter:

"walther 2807785" into google. You will get search results for vendors (Lipses, Buds, etc.) that stock the PPS M2 6 round magazine (when they get them in stock.)

For a 7 round, searching "walther 2807793" will get you a list of the 7 round magazines.

Same for the 8 rounder: "walther 2807807".

I did notice in some cases, the vendors show images of the PPS Classic Magazines. I would guess they don't yet have stock shots of the PPS M2 magazine yet.

[RJ]

Might be worth a shot: I'm looking to pick up a couple PPS M2 8 round magazines in Northern Cali or Oregon.

By any chance, does anyone know of a well-stocked dealer I might call to see if they had Walther magazines? Ideal place would be in Portland OR.

Thanks for any leads!

Rich

[RJ]

Might be worth a shot: I'm looking to pick up a couple PPS M2 8 round magazines in Northern Cali or Oregon.



I ended up ordering 4 eight round magazines from these guys, so I'm good.

http://www.exilemachine.net/shop/

[RJ]

My order of four 8 round mags arrived today at 1130AM. I was pretty impressed with the service from these guys:

https://www.exilemachine.net/shop/

I placed the order Saturday morning. I exchanged a couple emails over the weekend with sales support, getting a competent reply within an hour each time. Sunday I recieved my tracking number, with shipping Monday. Monday morning, it was on its way. It arrived Tuesday, overnight, to me in Hurricane Utah, which I thought was pretty good.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160510/fb182815e756b3b85b615484c344e84f.jpg

[RJ]

Apex trigger coming, it seems.

https://tcodynamics.com/2016/05/21/walther-pps-m2-apex-trigger/

[VolGrad]

I'm pissed. Had a guy wanting to trade his m2 for my gen2 g22. I was all aboard but he flaked out last minute. Just stopped responding to text. I was excited to try one out.

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[Kyle Reese]

I'm picking up an M2 and might post up my M1 for sale.

[Kyle Reese]

Got an M2 en route to my friendly neighborhood FFL. Should be here on Friday. [emoji41]

[Greg]

Exile Machine is muy bueno!

[ScotchMan]

Really like the improvements to the PPS in general, wish they kept the paddle mag release but otherwise seems improved. However, a tried and true classic PPS along with holsters and 6 or so M2-incompatible magazines makes the M2 an unrealistic thing for me.

One thing I am interested in that I haven't seen mentioned is if the M2's trigger gets noticably better with time. My PPS evolved from a gritty, passable-for-a-subcompact trigger into one of the best striker triggers I've felt, and I have a PPQ. The smooth, rolling break on my PPS is something I wish all my guns could have.

[RJ]

I have zip for experience in general, but: I would say my initial impression of the trigger on mine were neutral. I have a bit over 700 rounds now, and it seems to me things are a bit smoother.

Hard to say, though, as it's been very gradual, obviously.

[RJ]

I went looking for an OWB holster for the M2 today; came up short.

Looks like BladeTech is not making for the M2 yet. Not sure about Safariland as I could not locate a 5197/5198 open top range holster (coulda missed it).

If anyone knows of a decent OWB straight cant tech lok type holster available for the PPS M2, please let me know.

(Application is USPSA).

Thanks!

[Chuck Whitlock]

http://www.safariland.com/holster-search?dwfrm_holsterfinder_gunid=275370&dwfrm_holsterfinder_lightid=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_addonid=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_guntype=pistol&dwfrm_holsterfinder_manufacturer=Walther&dwfrm_holsterfinder_model=PPS&dwfrm_holsterfinder_barrellength=3.27&dwfrm_holsterfinder_caliber=9x19mm+Parabellum&dwfrm_holsterfinder_haslight=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_lighttype=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_hasaddon=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_addontype=&prefn1=gunList&prefv1=275370&prefn2=lightListText&prefv2=none&prefn3=mountListText&prefv3=none

Rich,
The Safariland listing above is for the original PPS, but the pro fit holsters fit a range of guns in the same size.

http://www.safariland.com/products/holsters-and-gear/holsters/concealable-holsters/paddle/model-579-gls-pro-fit-holster-with-belt-clip-57900.html#dwfrm_holsterfinder_gunid=275370&dwfrm_holsterfinder_lightid=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_addonid=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_guntype=pistol&dwfrm_holsterfinder_manufacturer=Walther&dwfrm_holsterfinder_model=PPS&dwfrm_holsterfinder_barrellength=3.27&dwfrm_holsterfinder_caliber=9x19mm%2BParabellum&dwfrm_holsterfinder_haslight=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_lighttype=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_hasaddon=&dwfrm_holsterfinder_addontype=&prefn1=gunList&prefv1=275370&prefn2=lightListText&prefv2=none&prefn3=mountListText&prefv3=none&start=1

This one has a belt clip attachment.

[mastiffkb]

Check out Greenforcetactical.com they make one for the pps m2. Lots of local LEO use them for off duty.

http://www.greenforcetactical.com/custom-owb-holster/

Another option is http://pantherconcealment.com

You have to contact the owner via his web sight as he makes the holsters to order and he wants to actually wants to converse with the purchaser to find out the needs and wants and needs. He doesn't have the m2 listed but can make it.

[MGW]

I went looking for an OWB holster for the M2 today; came up short.

Looks like BladeTech is not making for the M2 yet. Not sure about Safariland as I could not locate a 5197/5198 open top range holster (coulda missed it).

If anyone knows of a decent OWB straight cant tech lok type holster available for the PPS M2, please let me know.

(Application is USPSA).

Thanks!

Not exactly a race holster but Custom Carry Concepts is listing their Tuff holster for it.

[Kram]

Got an M2 en route to my friendly neighborhood FFL. Should be here on Friday. [emoji41]

Do you feel the M2 is worth the upgrade over the M1? I really like and prefer the grip and mag release of the M2. Having plenty of mags, holsters, ect has stopped me from pulling the trigger on the M2 already. With the M2 coming down in price I may eventually buy one anyway.

[Kyle Reese]

Do you feel the M2 is worth the upgrade over the M1? I really like and prefer the grip and mag release of the M2. Having plenty of mags, holsters, ect has stopped me from pulling the trigger on the M2 already. With the M2 coming down in price I may eventually buy one anyway.

I snapped up a JMCK holster here on the EE for the M2, and so far I like the pistol a lot in dry fire. I'm hitting the range with it in the A.M, and will put 300 rounds of Gold Dot and Winchester NATO ball thru it. I'll let you know what I think after I break it in.

[TheNewbie]

Are the mags for the M2 as hard to load/disassemble as the M1?

I took an M1 mag apart and felt like I needed 7 arms and 9 Germans to put it back together. The tension was crazy, but maybe I was doing it wrong.

[RJ]

Are the mags for the M2 as hard to load/disassemble as the M1?

I took an M1 mag apart and felt like I needed 7 arms and 9 Germans to put it back together. The tension was crazy, but maybe I was doing it wrong.

Yeah, lol. The M2 7 and 8 rounders are tricky. Don't have an M1, but assuming they have a dust cover like on the M2, it's not easy.

I have 6 mags, and the last time I cleaned them, I think I ended up using a chopstick to hold the butt plate keeper in place, before sliding the butt plate on. I admit the first time I took the 7 rounder apart, it took me a while to get it back together.

[Prdator]

The wife has been shooting hers quite a bit now and has decided she likes it better than the gen1 PPS.

She's carrying it in our Errand holster and it works like a champ. She was running two head box hits at 7 yards in 1.9-2.1 seconds from concealment... Not bad for her. And she was able to keep all her hits in the head box at 30! Yards. So the newspaper is as accurate as the old one.

[RJ]

The wife has been shooting hers quite a bit now and has decided she likes it better than the gen1 PPS.

She's carrying it in our Errand holster and it works like a champ. She was running two head box hits at 7 yards in 1.9-2.1 seconds from concealment... Not bad for her. And she was able to keep all her hits in the head box at 30! Yards. So the newspaper is as accurate as the old one.

Cool beans. Monday is ladies day at the range; I plan to have a date. :cool:

I have some B-8s printed up, I plan to shoot the VP9 and PPS M2 back to back 10 rounds slow fire at 25 yards. I've got a suspicion that "for me" I'm as accurate with this little gun as with my game gun.

[Prdator]

The one we have is VERY accurate!!! but that goes for all the PPS's we have both the gen1 and 2.



Just realized that we have some PPS M2 Errand holsters in stock. Just FYI .

[FOG]

Just realized that we have some PPS M2 Errand holsters in stock. Just FYI .

Love my pps m2 and errand holster! Just wish I wasn't going to be out of town the same time you're having your next class. Maybe next time.



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[Prdator]

Love my pps m2 and errand holster! Just wish I wasn't going to be out of town the same time you're having your next class. Maybe next time.


Awesome !!!
Yeah I've had quite a few guys say the same. So I may have to do another AIWB skills class in OKC soon.
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[RJ]

I have some B-8s printed up, I plan to shoot the VP9 and PPS M2 back to back 10 rounds slow fire at 25 yards. I've got a suspicion that "for me" I'm as accurate with this little gun as with my game gun.

Shot a 66-0X with the PPS M2, for me, this is about as good as I am typically with my full size 9s:

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160712/d331db721f5177be3fac0d5f28d6df4d.jpg

[Kyle Reese]

Put 400 rounds thru mine last night, 300 rounds of Winchester M882 and 100 rounds of 147 grain HST. Was not a fan of the sights, and will install some Trijicon HD's ASAP. If I can duck out again today, I'll put another 300 rounds of HST / M882 thru it.

I was very impressed with its accuracy and reliability right out of the box, and do not regret this purchase.

[RJ]

Put 400 rounds thru mine last night, 300 rounds of Winchester M882 and 100 rounds of 147 grain HST. Was not a fan of the sights, and will install some Trijicon HD's ASAP. If I can duck out again today, I'll put another 300 rounds of HST / M882 thru it.

I was very impressed with its accuracy and reliability right out of the box, and do not regret this purchase.

TYR, did you ever put the Trijicon HDs on? Just wondering if it affected your POI at all? Or made the slide a bit taller for CCW?

923 rounds through my M2 so far, 0 malfunctions.

[Kyle Reese]

TYR, did you ever put the Trijicon HDs on? Just wondering if it affected your POI at all? Or made the slide a bit taller for CCW?

923 rounds through my M2 so far, 0 malfunctions.
Not yet. Soon. [emoji1]

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[RJ]

Not yet. Soon. [emoji1]

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Ok, cool. Be interested when you do.

I have them on my VP9 (the HDs) and I like the big yellow dot. Since HKs are apparently sight picture #3 (cover the dot) I've been holding there, and seem to be POI=POA.

On the M2, I use sight picture #2 (top of blade) and this, too, seems to result in center hits. Right now, I have the OEM white dot and blacked out OEM reads.

I guess I'd be happier if I knew the HDs tendency, in terms of effect on POI, before I spent another $125 or whatever. Ideally I could use the same sight picture on both my gamer gun and my CCW. That seems like a good thing to me.

[Kanati]

Sooooo.....are there any updates on what folks are using holster and sight wise?

I picked one up today and I'm impressed with it. Didn't have much time to shoot it, but did get a box of WWB ran thru it as well as a couple mags of regular pressure 124 grain Gold Dots; zero issues to report. Didn't measure any groups (was shooting an already partially shot target at a local redneck range), but it seemed to be more accurate in my hands than my G43, a good bit actually.

[RJ]

Sooooo.....are there any updates on what folks are using holster and sight wise?



I bought two holsters from Tony at www.jmcustomkydex.com.

[APS-PF]

I'm using a Dara appendix, it sits a bit too low for me and I have a jm new wing claw on order. I replaced my factory sights with trijicon classics and painted the front sight orange. POI is just on the top of the front sight with 147HST @15yds.

[FOG]

Keeper Errand for mine. Still running stock sights.

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[SteveB]

Sooooo.....are there any updates on what folks are using holster and sight wise?


JMK George and factory sights. Sharpied out the rear dots; sent the slide to ToolTech - they drilled out the front sight for a tritium lamp and an orange ring. Still impressed with how this thing shoots, but, after multiple side-by-side comparisons with my G26, I still prefer the Glock.

[RJ]

JMK George and factory sights. Sharpied out the rear dots; sent the slide to ToolTech - they drilled out the front sight for a tritium lamp and an orange ring. Still impressed with how this thing shoots, but, after multiple side-by-side comparisons with my G26, I still prefer the Glock.

Good idea on the front sight.

I ended up trading the PPS M2 in on a P30SK.

I had two concerns; with the button mag release, being a lefty, I inadvertently unlatched the magazine twice while carrying. Not cool.

The other was that for its weight, the mag capacity of 6/7/8 rounds seemed a bit low, relative to double stacks.

Mind you, I had zip for carry background so the 90 days I spent with it were a great learning experience. I shot 926 rounds with 0 malfunctions. It was always very comfortable to shoot, and very accurate.

[BJXDS]

The PS M2 is real nice, Triji HD's and JMCK all the way. IMHO, The subs( M2,G42/43,xds....) are smaller and lighter and may be more comfortable to carry??? but no real difference in concealability compared to say G19/PPQ.

I thinks sometimes "We" get fixated on making the gun disappear, NOT printing. With the right or should I say the wrong clothing Almost anything can be concealed very well. My point is that I would not be overly concerned with minor printing with your typical daily wear, most people will not notice and if they do, so what. I would be more concerned with a combination you can reasonably conceal, access and shoot to the standards that are acceptable to you. ie 1.5 sec from concealment to A Zone at 7 yards baseline. Another issue to consider is reloads, for me with a sub compared to standard they are considerably slower and botched more often than with a standard. Run some reload drills to shake that out. Bottom line is smaller guns take much more time /effort to shoot on par with its larger counterpart, for me.

The M2 is very nice and seems like the perfect CCW platform, but wear your normal clothes and stress test it to make sure you can perform with it they way you want to/may need to.

I am just throwing out some other issues for you to consider, in case you have not.

[Kanati]

Thanks for the feedback guys!!!

Did some dry fire drills last night with the M2 and found reloads are a lot smoother than with the G43.


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[LockedBreech]

The PS M2 is real nice, Triji HD's and JMCK all the way. IMHO, The subs( M2,G42/43,xds....) are smaller and lighter and may be more comfortable to carry??? but no real difference in concealability compared to say G19/PPQ.

I thinks sometimes "We" get fixated on making the gun disappear, NOT printing. With the right or should I say the wrong clothing Almost anything can be concealed very well. My point is that I would not be overly concerned with minor printing with your typical daily wear, most people will not notice and if they do, so what. I would be more concerned with a combination you can reasonably conceal, access and shoot to the standards that are acceptable to you. ie 1.5 sec from concealment to A Zone at 7 yards baseline. Another issue to consider is reloads, for me with a sub compared to standard they are considerably slower and botched more often than with a standard. Run some reload drills to shake that out. Bottom line is smaller guns take much more time /effort to shoot on par with its larger counterpart, for me.

The M2 is very nice and seems like the perfect CCW platform, but wear your normal clothes and stress test it to make sure you can perform with it they way you want to/may need to.

I am just throwing out some other issues for you to consider, in case you have not.

I carry my PPS M1 on a minimalist belt holster (outside waistband) and can conceal it easy as pie with any longer shirt.

I'd love to carry my G19 but all I have for it is a range-style paddle holster that conceals terribly. Still trying to find a comfortable holster for it. I have lost 25 pounds this year but still am a bit too fluffy to properly pull off IWB comfortably.

[ssb]

I bought one of these last weekend -- the feature set I want is there and the $100 rebate didn't hurt.

My main reasons for purchase were:
- Deep concealment/NPE use
- I don't shoot a Glock 43 well at all
- Sort-of-Gadget functionality
- Favorable experience with the original PPS
- Availability of an integrated Crimson Trace laser

Yesterday I spent an extended range session with the gun: 300 rounds of 124gr FMJ reloads followed by 200 rounds of 124gr+P GDHPs. The gun was lubricated beforehand with Liberty Lubricants CLP. I had several failures to lock the slide back which I attribute to my grip -- the slide release is further back than I'm used to and I have to re-acclimate myself to that placement (I'm primarily a Glock shooter). Apart from those, no failures were experienced: it went bang every time.

I think it compares favorably to the original PPS. I prefered the large backstrap on the original and I personally find the M2's grip a tad small for my hands, but it handles recoil quite well and doesn't want to squirm like the G43 or Shield do in my hands. The palm swell seems to help in that regard. The trigger feel is much improved, not a flat trigger but a wider trigger with a flat face. For me this helps mitigate the reduced trigger reach from the original. The break is fairly good on my sample: I hit a wall, a little bit of roll, the trigger breaks. Travel is reasonable -- not particularly short -- though I'd prefer a bit more takeup weight. The flat face really helps me finish the trigger press flat.

It handled the 124gr+P Gold Dots quite well: recoil is by no means unmanageable, and I was able to consistently turn in .3-.4s splits on a B8 at 7 yards -- right about where I want to be. Rapid hits to the high upper chest are easy. Going any faster with this pistol is harder for me, however, probably because of the reduced grip surface allowing less of me on the gun. I found it easy to hit 3x5 cards out to 15 yards with the stock sights. At 25 yards, I turned in an 80 and an 84 on two ten-shot untimed strings, whereas I'm usually a high 80s/low 90s shooter with a Glock 17 (skill issue exacerbated by vision problems). The Gold Dots seem to be regulated to the dot to around 10 yards, to the tip of the front sight out to 15 yards, and are probably hitting about 2-3" high at 25 yards. Thus far the only thing I've changed is to Sharpie out the rear dots. As to changes I'd like to make, I'm leaning towards the Truglo TFX tritiums right now (large white front + subdued serrated U-notch rear) as they provide a sight picture I like and they appear to be less stabby than the HDs (I really don't feel like ripping up my suits). I may also add a Crimson Trace green laser to it due to my positive experience with a J-Frame with Lasergrips, but it'll make my already limited holster choices even more limited.

Overall, my initial impressions are favorable. I believe the gun's shown sufficient reliability for me to start carrying it and, once holsters are figured out, I believe I'll start doing that. I'm experimenting with a Smartcarry for suited use but I'll need to figure out a good leather AIWB option.

[Chef]

I bought one of these last weekend -- the feature set I want is there and the $100 rebate didn't hurt.

My main reasons for purchase were:
- Deep concealment/NPE use
- I don't shoot a Glock 43 well at all
- Sort-of-Gadget functionality
- Favorable experience with the original PPS
- Availability of an integrated Crimson Trace laser

Yesterday I spent an extended range session with the gun: 300 rounds of 124gr FMJ reloads followed by 200 rounds of 124gr+P GDHPs. The gun was lubricated beforehand with Liberty Lubricants CLP. I had several failures to lock the slide back which I attribute to my grip -- the slide release is further back than I'm used to and I have to re-acclimate myself to that placement (I'm primarily a Glock shooter). Apart from those, no failures were experienced: it went bang every time.

I think it compares favorably to the original PPS. I prefered the large backstrap on the original and I personally find the M2's grip a tad small for my hands, but it handles recoil quite well and doesn't want to squirm like the G43 or Shield do in my hands. The palm swell seems to help in that regard. The trigger feel is much improved, not a flat trigger but a wider trigger with a flat face. For me this helps mitigate the reduced trigger reach from the original. The break is fairly good on my sample: I hit a wall, a little bit of roll, the trigger breaks. Travel is reasonable -- not particularly short -- though I'd prefer a bit more takeup weight. The flat face really helps me finish the trigger press flat.

It handled the 124gr+P Gold Dots quite well: recoil is by no means unmanageable, and I was able to consistently turn in .3-.4s splits on a B8 at 7 yards -- right about where I want to be. Rapid hits to the high upper chest are easy. Going any faster with this pistol is harder for me, however, probably because of the reduced grip surface allowing less of me on the gun. I found it easy to hit 3x5 cards out to 15 yards with the stock sights. At 25 yards, I turned in an 80 and an 84 on two ten-shot untimed strings, whereas I'm usually a high 80s/low 90s shooter with a Glock 17 (skill issue exacerbated by vision problems). The Gold Dots seem to be regulated to the dot to around 10 yards, to the tip of the front sight out to 15 yards, and are probably hitting about 2-3" high at 25 yards. Thus far the only thing I've changed is to Sharpie out the rear dots. As to changes I'd like to make, I'm leaning towards the Truglo TFX tritiums right now (large white front + subdued serrated U-notch rear) as they provide a sight picture I like and they appear to be less stabby than the HDs (I really don't feel like ripping up my suits). I may also add a Crimson Trace green laser to it due to my positive experience with a J-Frame with Lasergrips, but it'll make my already limited holster choices even more limited.

Overall, my initial impressions are favorable. I believe the gun's shown sufficient reliability for me to start carrying it and, once holsters are figured out, I believe I'll start doing that. I'm experimenting with a Smartcarry for suited use but I'll need to figure out a good leather AIWB option.Necro thread. What holster did you end up using. This is relative to my current situation.

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[Lon]

Instead of starting an new PPS thread I figured I’d just revive this thread. Lots a good info here. Just dry firing mine and playing around with reloads I like it much better that my G43. I decided to ditch the 43 for a couple reasons. Since I carry it as a back up gun in the side pocket of my uniform pants the mag release can be depressed just by brushing against or leaning against things (I carry it on my left side). About a dozen times this year I’ve pulled the gun out at the end of my shift and the mag has not been seated. No bueno there. Plus I don’t enjoy shooting the 43 at all. So I started looking around. I was originally just gonna go back to a wheel gun.

Then I started looking around and thought about getting an original version PPS since it’s got the paddle release which should resolve the issue I’m having with the 43. Then I saw the PPS M2 RMSc. The mag release is much lower profile than the 43 so I don’t think it’ll be an issue. Plus it’s got the RMS which I really was impressed with when I played around with it at the OTOA conference a couple weeks ago. Once I got my hands on it it was a pretty easy decision. For the money it was hard to beat. For a little more than the cost of a good red dot and the milling work to have it installed I got a nice single stack pistol as well.

One thing I don’t like is the factory sights. I want to switch them out but I’m concerned with how big good NS may sit when looking through the window of the RMS. Anyone with one of the RMSc versions changed out the sights yet?

[Trukinjp13]

Instead of starting an new PPS thread I figured I’d just revive this thread. Lots a good info here. Just dry firing mine and playing around with reloads I like it much better that my G43. I decided to ditch the 43 for a couple reasons. Since I carry it as a back up gun in the side pocket of my uniform pants the mag release can be depressed just by brushing against or leaning against things (I carry it on my left side). About a dozen times this year I’ve pulled the gun out at the end of my shift and the mag has not been seated. No bueno there. Plus I don’t enjoy shooting the 43 at all. So I started looking around. I was originally just gonna go back to a wheel gun.

Then I started looking around and thought about getting an original version PPS since it’s got the paddle release which should resolve the issue I’m having with the 43. Then I saw the PPS M2 RMSc. The mag release is much lower profile than the 43 so I don’t think it’ll be an issue. Plus it’s got the RMS which I really was impressed with when I played around with it at the OTOA conference a couple weeks ago. Once I got my hands on it it was a pretty easy decision. For the money it was hard to beat. For a little more than the cost of a good red dot and the milling work to have it installed I got a nice single stack pistol as well.

One thing I don’t like is the factory sights. I want to switch them out but I’m concerned with how big good NS may sit when looking through the window of the RMS. Anyone with one of the RMSc versions changed out the sights yet?

Someone started a thread for the RMSc down below. Might be a good place to check in.


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