Is it possible to go back?

[navyman8903]

Not being a snob here, a little back story. I'm an HK guy, no surprises there for those that know my from youtube and HKpro. I had a G19 and a few other non-HK guns. They all got the Axe except for the HK's. I plan to pick up a P226 Legion and a MK25, because I love and miss my P226, but that's another story. Anyway, I rented a Gen 4 17 today, and was impressed, but also not so much. I don't often shoot 115gr anything, as it's what I call a "Show off load" or a target load. I only brought 150 rounds preloaded in my Mags with me to the range, so I picked up some 115's to throw in the glock. I run 124 NATO or 147gr in ball, and 124+p or 147 BJHP's. The G17 shot the 115's just fine and it was pleasant, but the 124's were not a smooth ( took 5 from the VP9 mags I had loaded just to feel them out), I felt them like they were +p. Either they just don't deal with the recoil well or HK/full weight 226's/228/9's and 92 series guns have ruined me completely. I've only run 124 NATO/ SD loads through my VP9 and P30's. When I had my Gen 3 G19 I ran half and half 115's/124's....I don't remember it being that sharp.

I was entertaining getting a 17 and a 19 again to have on hand. Some of my good Navy friends want to go to classes and if it isn't a Sig or HK I don't have it. The Gen 4 does things I like with the grip, and things I don't like with the internals. But, I put every round where I wanted it for the most part. Not as tight as my VP9, but close enough I guess. I parted with my G19 not because I didn't shoot it well, but I didn't run it well. I frequently (over 70% of the time I'd estimate) had to do the glock karate chop to get the mags out during mag changes, and the slide is less than friendly when your hands are sweaty. I also had trouble with the idea of almost no one has a stock Glock.

My question to the group is two fold, has anyone who's gotten out of glock been able to go back? and is it even worth it? I can get them cheap (MIL LEO) and they'll be a decent throw away, friend, and class gun. Thoughts?

[YVK]

I find Glocks to be the easiest guns to go back to.

[navyman8903]

I find Glocks to be the easiest guns to go back to.

They are simple and easy to use for the most part.

[ldunnmobile]

Same here. I've went back 3 times. Now I'm there to stay.

[secondstoryguy]

Been back and forth once between HK and Glock. Going back to Glock was not really an issue.

[Trooper224]

You're over thinking it. Just get the Glock, it ain't cooties. :)

[ssb]

I went from Glock to HK LEM to a 1911 (very briefly) to SIG DA/SA to a Glock, Walther PPS, and a J-Frame. I think (hope) my current state is where I will remain. A pair of G19s are my casual wear guns (one for carry and one for practice/backup if the first fails). The PPS fills the role that the G43 could potentially have filled had it been available when I was looking at a NPE gun, and between its shootabily, my current logistical support, and its Gadget-like functionality I don't see myself getting rid of it. I'm also experimenting with the J-Frame as a pocket carry and BUG option.

I shot the HKs well enough but my performance at the time was not really a good measure of skill. The P226 was actually the first time I'd sat down and thoroughly committed to learning a system and shooting it well. I did some of my best shooting with that gun and put a little over 8,000 rounds through it learning the system, and carried the thing almost every single day. And then I picked up a buddy's G19 and outshot my MK25 on a FAST... from a Vanguard 2. I blinked, did it again. Draw felt a hair slower but the overall result was the same: faster first shot, less effort to get the second shot off, and I was significantly more comfortable at max speed with the Glock's trigger. I did Nyeti's LAPD SWAT qualification course from an old DOTW (I like that course of fire as a performance benchmark) and shot quite well with the 19; the performance gap widened in favor of the 19 on the 2B1H strings at 3, 5, and 7 yards. I'd spent all that time with the SIG and the only place where I felt the two were about equal was 25yd slowfire. The Glock seemed to hold the advantage everywhere else. A second range session confirmed that.

I chalk up the improvement in my shooting to spending that dedicated time with the SIG. But, everything else added up in the Glock's favor:
- I shoot the Glock better side-by-side
- I like that the guns basically instill no pride of ownership
- Parts and accessories are ubiquitous, and I feel that's an advantage given the current political climate (panic)
- The price is right
- Glocks are somewhat idiot-proof when it comes to working on them, and I am nothing if not an idiot

As far as the "Nobody's got a stock Glock" line, yeah that's mostly true. I really don't mind it. Spending six hours working on the grips of my two 19s and throwing good sights on the pistols was a small price to pay to get a pair of guns I like. The only exception to that is the ejection/BTF issue. It's not something I should have to spend money on to get fixed.

Is it worth it? Up to you. From your description it sounds like you want the Glock more as an other people gun, rather than going "back to" it as the primary gun you'll be shooting/carrying. Personally I don't keep guns around that I don't shoot. I can't see the harm in keeping one around for the purposes you've mentioned, but doing a full purchase of holsters, mags, mag pouches, spare parts, etc., probably not.

[HopetonBrown]

I frequently (over 70% of the time I'd estimate) had to do the glock karate chop to get the mags out during mag changes, and the slide is less than friendly when your hands are sweaty.

Ive noticed that often when people's mags don't drop free it's because the mag well isn't oriented vertically when they press the mag release. I don't really grab the slide that much since I use the slide release. Only administratively.

[JHC]

Many users here have left Glock and returned. Often for shootability reasons for them, in their experience. After shooting HK USP, P30, P226, 92FS, M&P for short periods, I never found them to handle better (or even as well) or deliver better accuracy so I never switched; ergo never went back per se.

Some here shoot them for high volumes and find them to track very well and very flat in recoil and can be shot at speed as well as any service pistol platform and can be shot for precision at distance as well as any service pistol platform; vast number of examples on various threads here. Same for reliable reloads.

It sounds like they don't suit you and you will not be satisfied with one, so why bother?

[NCmtnman]

I put around 7,000 rounds and countless dry fires through my P2000 .40 LEM and still could not match the performance and pure shoot-ability of my G19. It could have been a difference in caliber, but being able to put 5 rounds into the headbox on demand with my G19 was something I appreciated. The difference for me was knowing that I could make the shot vs. that of hoping I could. I appreciate the HK line for just about everything else over that of Glock but the fact is that I simply shoot a Glock better and without the amount of training devoted to the platform as well.

[LSP552]

Glock does the important things well, and they are fairly easy to move back to. SIGs and Glocks have battled for my soul over the last 20+ years. I have preferences, but in truth it's hard to go wrong with a Glock. If I had to pick just one pistol to walk the earth with, it would be a Glock 17.

[rob_s]

I've "left" Glocks twice. Once entirely to go to 1911s, after which I came back largely because it seemed silly to have $6k+ tied up in three guns rather than 12. The second time only partly as I bought a CZ for competition shooting, after which I bailed simply because I don't shoot often enough anymore to have $2k tied up in a competition-only gun.

If your only purpose for having the Glock(s) is as loaners, it should be pretty simple to get a stock gun, replace the sights, add a couple of mags, and buy some Blade Tech holster/mag pouch combo. Should be into all of that for well under $1k I'd think, even better if you get better pricing on the initial gun.

[DocSabo40]

I am back to Glock for a third time now, this last time from a VP9. I find that a G19 with about $150 of work done to it (sights, trigger, stippling) is pretty tough to beat. Glocks also tend to track the flattest during recoil, and have no sharp parts anywhere in the grip/frame area that dig into my hands during recoil.

[Gray222]

A buddy of mine has been shooting Glocks exclusively for the last 5ish years. He recently bought a VP9 and has been carrying/shooting. Once he figured out the trigger, OEM sights and mag release setup he's been putting some very impressive numbers in drills in terms of speed and accuracy.

Is it possible? Totally. Is it easy? Nope, you have to do the reps, that's all.

[gtmtnbiker98]

I've been Glock free since 2009. No plans of going back.

[SteveB]

I love my P2000's and P-07's. Having said that, if carrying a G19 AIWB didn't give me the willies, I'd probably never have switched.

[SLG]

I carry a stock glock every day. It seems to shoot just fine.

[NickA]

Can't really see a downside to having a Glock 9mm or two around, even if you don't go back to shooting them full time.

[psalms144.1]

Navy - I've gone back and forth from Glocks to just about everything on the market several times, and ALWAYS end up back with the G19. The VP9 hasn't hit my inventory yet, but it's the only thing I can think of that might permanently win me away from Glocks.

A little about me. I "grew up" on 1911s, then spent several years Active and early civilian employment in Sig-only agencies carrying M11s. But, I also owned one of the very first G19s to hit the streets in the Tacoma, WA area, so I've been around Glocks for decades, literally. During the Dark Ages (2010-12) I had five bad G19s in a row, the last three "hand picked" replacements for #2. I was also in a "high visibility posting" where Glock wanted very much to make me happy with them, and they couldn't send me a pistol that would run worth a poop. I switched to HKs (P30 then P2000 with an issued 45CT for deployments), and worked HARD with them to get my abilities up to match the Glock.

Here's what I found. In deliberate slow fire, the HKs SMOKED the G19. More accurate, "smoother" operating, you name it. Reloads with the paddle are much faster than any Glock reload I've ever had, and the magazines don't hang up in the well. Then, in mid 2013, I got another Gen4 G19, and took it for a spin, just for poop and grins. I was immediately and measurably "better" shooting it cold, than any performance I could give with the P2000 LEM on any timed drill. Period. The only drill where the P2000 could out-perform the G19 was in 3x5 card walk backs, and then only at 25 yards +.

The bottom line is I HATE Glocks - the way they feel in my hand, the way they point, the "cheapness" of the construction ('cuz, let's call a spade a spade, the Glock is designed from the ground up to be a CHEAP to mass produce pistol), the trigger, everything about it. But, despite all that, NOTHING I've tried "runs" better for me in measurable performance drills, and, when I do my part, the G19 isn't any less accurate than any other combat pistol out there.

Please note - I am NOT trying to convince you to get a Glock. If you out perform the Glock with your VP9, keep it and be happy. I'm just telling you what my experience has been.

Regards,

Kevin

[Surf]

I was a heavy Sig P226 / 229 and 1911 guy myself. While I have pretty much gone away from the DA/SA Sigs, I do very much like the P320. The metal frames do spoil you a bit in that the added weight / mass does soak up the recoil as opposed the the poly pistols. It is probably no secret to most who have interacted with me online or in person that I am a big Glock shooter and the 9mm 17 and 19 are common for me. While it isn't horrible, I don't really care for shooting my Glocks in .40 when I have the 9's. Yes I do feel a difference in factory 9mm weights / loads, but I don't shoot 115's and like you I usually shoot 9mm Nato, factory 124 ball for practice, or 124 HP defensive loads. So I guess that is just normal for my Glock 9mm experience.

From a long time ago I was big into hand fitting 1911's and smithing work in general, so hand fitting a Glock was just a common sense thing as far as I looked at it when I first got into Glock pistols and this was back in the earlier days when Glocksmithing was not nearly as mainstream as it is today. Don't get me wrong, I have and I shoot stock Glocks very well, but I do like a nice hand fitted Glock.

For certain reasons, I just recently dove headfirst into the P320. I do love that pistol and it dominated my shooting the last several months. While I never "left" the Glock, I have swung back to primarily shooting the Glock. The Sig P320 is no doubt in solid second for me just a tick behind the Glock. As for making the transition into having a Glock, as you mention the LE/Mil discount makes it almost a no brainer. If you end up being unhappy, you won't lose out on the pistol if you decide to sell.

[Wobblie]

I bought a Gen 4 Glock 17 after years of snobbishly avoiding Glock in favor of HKs, SIGs and 1911s. I shoot it better than any of those others.

[ralph]

I own 6 HK's.. What's my edc? a G19.. I have 2 Glocks a17, and a 19, I've also got 2 VP9's. For several years, I avoided Glocks because of a bad one I got (BTF) that to this day, I don't think Glock could've fixed, It was that bad. Last spring, I stumbled onto a deal for a Gen4,G17 police trade-in, that had seen little actual use, price was reasonable. I had been shooting some monthly IDPA matches with my VP9,and was doing ok, The following month I shot the G17, There was a noticeable difference in the speed, accuracy.(NO BTF!!) Without a doubt I shoot the Glocks faster than the VP9's. The Glocks just shoot flatter for me, than the HK's do. My 17 is stock except for the sights, My 19 is almost stock, I had to install a Apex extractor,(The G19 is a Grey framed one made last year, so, yes the BTF problems are still present in the G19's, The Apex extractor cured my G19) and I installed a smooth G17 trigger/trigger bar, and of course changed the sights. I like'em both as they are.. Pretty much stock. I don't really plan on switching to anything else, although I'll admit I'm really liking my Inox Beretta Vertec, it probably ranks a close second for me. As Surf said on the last page, If you can get a Glock at a LE/Mil discount, why not? If you don't like it, getting rid of it should be no problem, and you shouldn't lose any money. All you'll be out is a little time.

[11B10]

I was a heavy Sig P226 / 229 and 1911 guy myself. While I have pretty much gone away from the DA/SA Sigs, I do very much like the P320. The metal frames do spoil you a bit in that the added weight / mass does soak up the recoil as opposed the the poly pistols. It is probably no secret to most who have interacted with me online or in person that I am a big Glock shooter and the 9mm 17 and 19 are common for me. While it isn't horrible, I don't really care for shooting my Glocks in .40 when I have the 9's. Yes I do feel a difference in factory 9mm weights / loads, but I don't shoot 115's and like you I usually shoot 9mm Nato, factory 124 ball for practice, or 124 HP defensive loads. So I guess that is just normal for my Glock 9mm experience.

From a long time ago I was big into hand fitting 1911's and smithing work in general, so hand fitting a Glock was just a common sense thing as far as I looked at it when I first got into Glock pistols and this was back in the earlier days when Glocksmithing was not nearly as mainstream as it is today. Don't get me wrong, I have and I shoot stock Glocks very well, but I do like a nice hand fitted Glock.

For certain reasons, I just recently dove headfirst into the P320. I do love that pistol and it dominated my shooting the last several months. While I never "left" the Glock, I have swung back to primarily shooting the Glock. The Sig P320 is no doubt in solid second for me just a tick behind the Glock. As for making the transition into having a Glock, as you mention the LE/Mil discount makes it almost a no brainer. If you end up being unhappy, you won't lose out on the pistol if you decide to sell.



Sir - about two months ago, I bought a P320C/.45 to replace my G30S. The only thing I have changed, indeed, the only thing I want to change, was to put TFX PROS on it (it had contrasts on it), while there was much more done to my 30S. It's very early, but the way I shoot this Sig and the way it feels, I cannot imagine going back to Glock. Please post anything further you find on the 320. Thanks.

[navyman8903]

Thanks for all of the replies, and nice to see some familiar names here too. I'll have to think on it, and I will say I run/shoot my HK's faster than the glocks. I think the G19 I had was only faster a few times when shooting fast strings, but slower to get back up into the fight for me. The HK's are easily the best fit for me, trailing in a tied 2nd position are the P226 and 92 series. I still recommend the G19 and G17 to people if they're on a tight budget/can get a LEO discount. I can still run one okay if I'm in a pinch. But I change mags so fast with the HK mag release, and they just fit me. Shooting is second nature with them.

I definitely will NOT be getting out of HK, more along the lines of considering Adding a G17 and a G19 to the safe to have some throw around guns. Guns I can let friends borrow for classes they take here and/or have something to run if they want it. If given the chance, and no stones thrown here, I'll take the VP9 over a G19 pretty much at every given opportunity. I like Glock okay I guess, I don't hate the G17 and G19, if my entire horde got stolen tomorrow, I'd probably buy a G19 to hold me over in the mean time. Definitely just a thought, but I'm heavy into HK's with no sign of stopping at all, they're not going anywhere. Just thinking if it is wise to add a few Glocks back to the stock.


Side note: If I did get back into them, I would also have to outfit them with Trij HD's, mag releases, slide releases, grip plugs, and associated support items like I do my other guns. When I get into something I need to have holsters, mags (no less than 10), and stuff like that. It's just something I do.

[ralph]

Thanks for all of the replies, and nice to see some familiar names here too. I'll have to think on it, and I will say I run/shoot my HK's faster than the glocks. I think the G19 I had was only faster a few times when shooting fast strings, but slower to get back up into the fight for me. The HK's are easily the best fit for me, trailing in a tied 2nd position are the P226 and 92 series. I still recommend the G19 and G17 to people if they're on a tight budget/can get a LEO discount. I can still run one okay if I'm in a pinch. But I change mags so fast with the HK mag release, and they just fit me. Shooting is second nature with them.

I definitely will NOT be getting out of HK, more along the lines of considering Adding a G17 and a G19 to the safe to have some throw around guns. Guns I can let friends borrow for classes they take here and/or have something to run if they want it. If given the chance, and no stones thrown here, I'll take the VP9 over a G19 pretty much at every given opportunity. I like Glock okay I guess, I don't hate the G17 and G19, if my entire horde got stolen tomorrow, I'd probably buy a G19 to hold me over in the mean time. Definitely just a thought, but I'm heavy into HK's with no sign of stopping at all, they're not going anywhere. Just thinking if it is wise to add a few Glocks back to the stock.


Side note: If I did get back into them, I would also have to outfit them with Trij HD's, mag releases, slide releases, grip plugs, and associated support items like I do my other guns. When I get into something I need to have holsters, mags (no less than 10), and stuff like that. It's just something I do.

Actually, The Gen 4 mag release is great as it is, size wise, it's just right. Other than sights, and a grip plug, (forgot about that), extra mags,that should be all you need. I used to think all that extra stuff was needed too,(mag, slide releases) but after running mine basically stock, I'm of the opinion now, that none of that stuff is really needed.. As far as mags go, I'll admit after buying mags for some of my HK's (45T, 45CT, VP9) it's nice to be able to buy factory mags for around $20 a pop, Beretta mags are about as cheap. If you do decide to get a Glock or two, other than sights and a grip plug, extra mags, holster,(and if needed, an Apex extractor) try running them stock for awhile, You might be surprised..