Russian ninjas

[Trooper224]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfTgJA_hGIA&feature=youtu.be

Check out the crazy move at 1:33

[Hot Sauce]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfTgJA_hGIA&feature=youtu.be

Check out the crazy move at 1:33

WOw. That was idiotic.

However, that bumpy car ride simulator looks kind of awesome and I want one.

[LSP552]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfTgJA_hGIA&feature=youtu.be

Check out the crazy move at 1:33

Basic Neo.....nothing to see.:D

[YVK]

Baller. I wanna sign up for an RPG marksmanship class.

[JSGlock34]

Sadly, we've seen that move performed before...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP-c_SsAGoA

[Chance]

Check out the crazy move at 1:33

Death blossom. The deadliest technique of all.

ETA: It's worth noting that when Vickers went to film Alpha Group, I didn't get the impression they were screwing around.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rI01qKAqYts

[Malamute]

Death blossom. The deadliest technique of all.

ETA: It's worth noting that when Vickers went to film Alpha Group, I didn't get the impression they were screwing around.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rI01qKAqYts

Wait, is he doing the Brownie Patented Self Muzzling Maneuver?

[Tamara]

Wait, is he doing the Brownie Patented Self Muzzling Maneuver?

Gun safety is decadent Capitalist invention.

[Luke]

Was that a ND around 3:29 or was that a tactical warning sign? And what pistols are those?

[Trooper224]

Was that a ND around 3:29 or was that a tactical warning sign? And what pistols are those?

Looked like the comrade almost Tex Grebnered himself at 3:49.

[Chance]

Was that a ND around 3:29 or was that a tactical warning sign? And what pistols are those?

That was Russian for, "Pardon me comrade, but if you were to step back, I would be most appreciative." And those are Arsenal Strike Ones.

[Luke]

That was Russian for, "Pardon me comrade, but if you were to step back, I would be most appreciative." And those are Arsenal Strike Ones.

After reading my comment I thought to myself that most of those rounds fired would be a negligent discharge in my mind lol.


I thought that's what those were. I'm gonna go resurrect the thread on the strike one :cool:

[Peally]

The Russians are what happens when you add modern technology and no common sense.

[psalms144.1]

The Russians are what happens when you add modern technology and no common sense.and canteens filled with Vodka

[Default.mp3]

The Russians are what happens when you add modern technology and no common sense.Perhaps, but I still wonder exactly the skill levels of Alpha and Vympel. While they may not be up to par with the American SMUs, I don't think it's necessarily a stretch to think that they're still one of the top SOF units in the world.

Beyond that, I wonder what unit was in the video. Also, they were doing a Helluva lot of full-auto, which my understanding is pretty much a non-starter by Western TTPs for CQB usage. And there's always the question of, what was the purpose of the video? Like what some have postulated with the Vickers one, it may very well have been a mix of fact and misinformation.

[BehindBlueI's]

Perhaps, but I still wonder exactly the skill levels of Alpha and Vympel. While they may not be up to par with the American SMUs, I don't think it's necessarily a stretch to think that they're still one of the top SOF units in the world.

Beyond that, I wonder what unit was in the video. Also, they were doing a Helluva lot of full-auto, which my understanding is pretty much a non-starter by Western TTPs for CQB usage. And there's always the question of, what was the purpose of the video? Like what some have postulated with the Vickers one, it may very well have been a mix of fact and misinformation.

If I were a psyops weinie, I'd make my SF look totally badass in propaganda for internal consumption and like total hacks for foreign consumption. "Couldn't have been those guys, there are no clown shoe tracks..."

[Surf]

The first video could be considered standard for Spetznaz and the 2nd video of is of Alpha group. The pistols are Strike One's and yes he intentionally discharged the weapon into the ground. Consider it a warning shot to perhaps those in a non friendly crowd who are not quite as of yet determined to be hostile to the point where they are shootable. Russian forces train with a bit different mindset and ROE. Not saying that I adhere to their methodology as a whole, but you can be assured that the Alpha guys are top notch shooters.

[SLG]

I've shot with both groups. Nice guys.

I may not agree with everything in the video, but I don't see all the bad that you guys do. I think they did a lot of stuff well. As for the not so great stuff? They have a very different outlook, mission set, and level of comfort/tolerance for use of force issues then we do. Regardless, I assure you they are some tough dudes.

[Chance]

Also, they were doing a Helluva lot of full-auto, which my understanding is pretty much a non-starter by Western TTPs for CQB usage.

I recall Hackathorn mentioning some of the Israelis he trained were more focused on volume of fire than strict accuracy. He didn't mention what group that was specifically. But like Surf and SLG already mentioned, different context, different solutions.

[Hauptmann]

I had a chance to train with a former Russian special forces guy several years ago. He had some very unorthodox techniques, but when it came down to putting rounds on target quickly and accurately under stress he was very skilled.

[Chance]

I had a chance to train with a former Russian special forces guy several years ago. He had some very unorthodox techniques, but when it came down to putting rounds on target quickly and accurately under stress he was very skilled.

Are you talking about Sonny Puzikas? If not, how did you come upon the guy?

[Hauptmann]

Are you talking about Sonny Puzikas? If not, how did you come upon the guy?

I can't remember his name(hard to pronounce let alone spell). He had immigrated to the USA in the late 1990s, and was working for the DHS at FLETC. Not sure where he is now days.

[Trooper224]

The first video could be considered standard for Spetznaz and the 2nd video of is of Alpha group. The pistols are Strike One's and yes he intentionally discharged the weapon into the ground. Consider it a warning shot to perhaps those in a non friendly crowd who are not quite as of yet determined to be hostile to the point where they are shootable. Russian forces train with a bit different mindset and ROE. Not saying that I adhere to their methodology as a whole, but you can be assured that the Alpha guys are top notch shooters.

My initial post wasn't so much a criticism as it was pointing out something which seems highly unusual. Some of their methods seem a bit off the wall to us, but they do seem to be in control of their movements. I'm sure there's a reason behind everything they're doing. I won't say I'd agree with those reasons, but nothing seems to be half-cocked. The shot into the ground? Well, okay. Not my monkey or my circus. I'd love to hear more about their viewpoints though.

[Chance]

I'd love to hear more about their viewpoints though.

The origin of the death blossom was discussed in the comments section (http://soldiersystems.net/2012/08/09/new-sonny-puzikas-video-from-panteao-productions/)of Soldier Systems after Panteao released their Sonny Puzikas video (which they took off the market after he shot his AI). The short version is that a soldier in extremely dire circumstances used his rifle to lay down suppressing fire in one direction, while using his pistol for aimed fire at closer range. I don't know if that was something he learned beforehand, or invented on the spot.

I'm curious about the origins of shooting into the ground as well. If it's something to dissuade unruly bystanders without having to hurt anyone, it kind of makes sense to me.

[Wondering Beard]

This is the first time I heard of the "death blossom". I thought it was some kind of fancy movie kung fu technique but I was wrong (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Death+Blossom)

[Mr_White]

This is the first time I heard of the "death blossom". I thought it was some kind of fancy movie kung fu technique but I was wrong (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Death+Blossom)

I learned the term when I was about six or seven years old from the movie The Last Starfighter.

[DacoRoman]

My instinct is to laugh at all of that Systema based ground balerina acrobatics and rolling around especially when it is paired with shooting.. It is just so bizzarre to me, from a martial arts and shooting point of view. But ultimately I try to remain Agnostic on it, cause who the hell knows. It may be more than just dramatic dorky and cheesy Russian bullshido, but hot damn it is hard to be open minded when watching so much seemingly wasted and non sensical movement.

[John Hearne]

It is just so bizzarre to me, from a martial arts and shooting point of view.

I think it serves as evidence that the system itself is not the determinant of success but effort put in is. If you do the work (and fight the non-trained) enough to make it hardwired, you'll probably be OK.

This is of course a separate discussion for which system offer the greatest efficiency for the results it offers.

[Hauptmann]

I do wonder though if there is something to their techniques. The Ruskies don't seem to be as handicapped by concerns of collateral damage as western powers are. Most of our tactics revolve around prevention of collateral damage, and preservation of the lives of innocents. The Ruskies don't seem to give a flying f*** as long as the enemy is destroyed. WWII German squad tactics centered around the SAW, with infantry as support. The Ruskies copied this technique in WWII and found it to work well given the time period.

[jellydonut]

Perhaps, but I still wonder exactly the skill levels of Alpha and Vympel. While they may not be up to par with the American SMUs, I don't think it's necessarily a stretch to think that they're still one of the top SOF units in the world.

Beyond that, I wonder what unit was in the video. Also, they were doing a Helluva lot of full-auto, which my understanding is pretty much a non-starter by Western TTPs for CQB usage. And there's always the question of, what was the purpose of the video? Like what some have postulated with the Vickers one, it may very well have been a mix of fact and misinformation.

You can say whatever you want about how they look on a range, but chances are these dudes have been to a hell of a lot of two-way ranges and know what they are doing.

[Hot Sauce]

I'm curious about the origins of shooting into the ground as well. If it's something to dissuade unruly bystanders without having to hurt anyone, it kind of makes sense to me.

Unless it ricochets, in which case you may well hurt someone.