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HCM
10-02-2015, 01:05 PM
So for the past 20 years, the NYPD has authorized three primary duty guns, the Glock 19, the S&W 5946 and the SIG P226 DAO. Prior S&W and Ruger .38 revolvers were grandfathered as well.

I've heard NYPD is now either:

A) Adding the 17 as an authorized fourth option, or...

B) Making the 17 THE sole duty gun for all new recruits and grandfathering in the 19/5946/226 and remaining revolvers.

Im guessing 17s would be a Gen 4s? And I'm also guessing they will retain the NY plus trigger?

The P226 DAO has never been very popular but I'm wondering if S&W is no longer going to produce or support the 5946 and if that was a factor?

I'm also wondering if the decision for the 17 vs the 19 was driven by reliability concerns? As I've posted before, my agency currently authorizes the 17 and 26 as personally owned duty gun options. I was told the 19 is excluded for us based on reliability issues seen in previously issued Gen 3 19s and during testing of Gen 4 9mms.

What says the P-F hive mind ?

Kyle Reese
10-02-2015, 01:14 PM
Ditch the stupid NY trigger, adopt the 17 Gen 4 across the board and call it good.

nycnoob
10-02-2015, 01:41 PM
Bit of a tanget: Does anyone know the story of the NY trigger? Why is it so different from the regular trigger?
Glock did not just make the tension heavier but change the direction the spring pulls and changed it to a leaf
spring. The whole change is much bigger than just switching to a heavier version of the standard trigger.
If you read the original safe trigger patent, they certainly expected to be changing trigger weights. The
original trigger was designed to be very adjustable.

HCM
10-02-2015, 02:26 PM
Bit of a tanget: Does anyone know the story of the NY trigger? Why is it so different from the regular trigger?
Glock did not just make the tension heavier but change the direction the spring pulls and changed it to a leaf
spring. The whole change is much bigger than just switching to a heavier version of the standard trigger.
If you read the original safe trigger patent, they certainly expected to be changing trigger weights. The
original trigger was designed to be very adjustable.

The original coil spring is a nominal 5.5 lbs, Glock then offered an 8 lb coil spring to further LE sales. The original NY Trigger (NY-1), the olive leaf spring, was developed at the request of the NY State Police for their Glock 17's. It also gives an 8 lb pull but the pull weight is consistent through the full range length of the pull like a revolver trigger vs the normal Glock trigger which has a light take up followed by reaching the full weight at a short "wall" at the end of the trigger pull. NYPD uses the NY-2, the orange leaf spring which gives a long 12 lb pull.

JBP55
10-02-2015, 05:41 PM
Are you certain the NYPD uses the NY-2 rather than the NY-1?

SLG
10-02-2015, 06:24 PM
Are you certain the NYPD uses the NY-2 rather than the NY-1?

I am.

Lyonsgrid
10-02-2015, 07:25 PM
I had (2) former NYPD G19's. Both came with the original black leaf trigger spring. They don't have a coil in them. Always interested to learn more about them.

HCM
10-02-2015, 07:33 PM
Are you certain the NYPD uses the NY-2 rather than the NY-1?

Yes, NYPD Uses the Orange NY-2. They were using them as of 2000 when I went to Glock Armorer school at rodmans neck. I think they had the black ones before that. There was a black and a white which were discontinued in the 1990s.

The NY State Police use the NY -1 or at least they did back when they had Glock 17s. I think they have 37s now.

HCM
10-02-2015, 07:42 PM
So now I'm hearing option C - the gen 4 Glock 17 will be the third option replacing the 5946.

I'm guessing S&W has stopped producing them, even on a limited basis ?

TC215
10-02-2015, 07:44 PM
From a couple NYPD guys on another forum:


10,000 round test is what I have been told with the department's duty rounds ( currently gold dot 124 g +p) for service weapons. The idea is so the recruit can go his entire career without having the gun fail on him. Nypd cops are thought to be lazy and abusive toward their firearms( as many are) . I do not know if it applies to off duty guns. The Glock 17 will be approved according to the 20k instructors( moonlighting range instructors temp assigned to the " new deescalation" type training ). The smith is being phased out by smith and Wesson . The new recruit smiths were made in a different factory than the older ones. The Glock 17 approval is pending Glock supplying 15 round magazines for the gun instead of the 17 round so all the cops are on the same page.


As I was retiring the job was testing the next generation Glock (with the angled extractor that had the chambered round indicator nub). During my last summer qualification all shooters on the line finished up and then were given the prototypes and fifty rounds to fire. Malfunctions and the prototype serial number were noted on each shooter's score sheet. RO said the goals was 10,000 rounds per EACH prototype and I saw 25 prototypes on the line that day. I was told there were many more prototypes in testing than that. That's a hell of a lot of ammo and testing.

Thus, both rookies and seasoned officers were shooting the gun for testing purposes Rodman's neck is an outdoor facility so you are shooting in all climates all year long.

In my opinion if a pistol survives all that the NYPD throws at it it's good to go.

As to a 15 round model 17 it's ludicrous to me, but the JOB has always required that all service weapons have the same magazine capacity. That's from the puzzle palace.

SLG
10-02-2015, 07:54 PM
That 15 rds requirement for the 17 is the kind of stuff that has gotten the NYPD's firearms program in trouble before, but hey, if it wasn't invented at Rodman's Neck, it don't count for beans.

HCM
10-02-2015, 07:54 PM
Lazy and abusive towards their firearms are not traits exclusive to the NYPD but is often accurate.

HCM
10-02-2015, 08:02 PM
Our COF is designed around 12 round mags - we just have our Glock 17 shooters load 12, but I'm not trying to qualify 1,000 officers per week like NYPD either.

LSP552
10-02-2015, 08:32 PM
I heard some pretty bizarre firearms related stuff in my 35 year police career, but limiting the G17 to a 15 round mag is certainly near the top.

SLG
10-02-2015, 09:12 PM
I heard some pretty bizarre firearms related stuff in my 35 year police career, but limiting the G17 to a 15 round mag is certainly near the top.

When NYPD switched to G19's in the early 90's, they limited the mags to 10 rds.

GJM
10-02-2015, 09:18 PM
When NYPD switched to G19's in the early 90's, they limited the mags to 10 rds.

Were they ten round magazines filled to capacity, or 15 round capacity magazines with ten rounds loaded?

GRV
10-02-2015, 09:18 PM
Talking about the uniformity of magazine capacity and such: The whole "NY-#" naming scheme is very interesting too. I didn't know much about it beyond the Glock springs, but then I got to reading some official NYPD text on it somewhere. It gave the impression that the NYPD thinks that all their guns---the Glock, the Sig, the S&W, and maybe even all the authorized off-duty guns---have the same trigger. And that's what they now call "the NY-2 trigger". It was kinda mind numbing reading that.

I find it strange that they allow such drastically different gun choices, but then get so hung up about trying to make sure the triggers are the same...only to totally misunderstand how many elements make up a trigger and how futile of an effort it is to have both a Sig and a Glock with the same trigger. If they care so much about uniformity, they should just issue everyone the same gun and be done with it.

SLG
10-02-2015, 09:19 PM
Were they ten round magazines filled to capacity, or 15 round capacity magazines with ten rounds loaded?

I don't remember anymore, sorry.

SLG
10-02-2015, 09:20 PM
Talking about the uniformity of magazine capacity and such: The whole "NY-#" naming scheme is very interesting too. I didn't know much about it beyond the Glock springs, but then I got to reading some official NYPD text on it somewhere. It gave the impression that the NYPD thinks that all their guns---the Glock, the Sig, the S&W, and maybe even all the authorized off-duty guns---have the same trigger. And that's what they now call "the NY-2 trigger". It was kinda mind numbing reading that.

I find it strange that they allow such drastically different gun choices, but then get so hung up about trying to make sure the triggers are the same...only to totally misunderstand how many elements make up a trigger and how futile of an effort it is to have both a Sig and a Glock with the same trigger. If they care so much about uniformity, they should just issue everyone the same gun and be done with it.

There are some very special people involved in weapons/tactics/training/procurement in NY.

LSP972
10-02-2015, 09:32 PM
I think they had the black ones before that. There was a black and a white which were discontinued in the 1990s.



The white one is the "original" NY trigger spring. The black one is even more stiff. I have a few examples of both, that came in a box of parts Glock sent to us in 1994. From talking with both NYSP and NYPD people who were here for Katrina, I was told that the New York trigger was developed at the request of NYPD. According to those guys, at that time NYSP used the standard coil trigger spring.

No way for me to check… because the NYSP guys showed up sans firearms. I shit you not. So we issued them Sigs and duty leather for same. I asked one of them why in the hell didn't they bring their pistols??? He said their brass wasn't sure we would allow them to carry; so they sent them anyway, unarmed.

Simply unbelievable… but true.

.

Kyle Reese
10-02-2015, 09:43 PM
No way for me to check… because the NYSP guys showed up sans firearms. I shit you not. So we issued them Sigs and duty leather for same. I asked one of them why in the hell didn't they bring their pistols??? He said their brass wasn't sure we would allow them to carry; so they sent them anyway, unarmed.

Simply unbelievable… but true.

.

Holy shit.

John Hearne
10-02-2015, 09:44 PM
I heard some pretty bizarre firearms related stuff in my 35 year police career, but limiting the G17 to a 15 round mag is certainly near the top.

The debacle with P99 and the NJSP that Farnam detailed in his quips is even more amazing. IIRC, the Colonel ordered the 16 round magazine to be reduced to 15.

HCM
10-02-2015, 10:26 PM
When NYPD switched to G19's in the early 90's, they limited the mags to 10 rds.

Yup. it took a new Mayor and a new Police Commisioner to change it - some guy named Giuliani.

HCM
10-02-2015, 10:28 PM
The white one is the "original" NY trigger spring. The black one is even more stiff. I have a few examples of both, that came in a box of parts Glock sent to us in 1994. From talking with both NYSP and NYPD people who were here for Katrina, I was told that the New York trigger was developed at the request of NYPD. According to those guys, at that time NYSP used the standard coil trigger spring.

No way for me to check… because the NYSP guys showed up sans firearms. I shit you not. So we issued them Sigs and duty leather for same. I asked one of them why in the hell didn't they bring their pistols??? He said their brass wasn't sure we would allow them to carry; so they sent them anyway, unarmed.

Simply unbelievable… but true.

.

Oh... I believe it.

HCM
10-02-2015, 10:36 PM
The debacle with P99 and the NJSP that Farnam detailed in his quips is even more amazing. IIRC, the Colonel ordered the 16 round magazine to be reduced to 15.

Couple things on this one. I think they were actually transitioning from HK P-7 M8s to the SW-99s not the actual Walthers, which is why they were quickly replaced with SIG P-228s.

Regarding the magazine thing - there was an actual reason behind this. I'm not sure if it is still in effect but at that time the New Jersey state Attorney General's office had issued a legal opinion stating that state and local officers could only possess magazines greater than the state imposed 15 round limit while on duty. So if you were a New Jersey police officer issued say a Glock 17, you would be required to leave the gun at work or switch to 10 round magazines for off-duty carry.

psalms144.1
10-06-2015, 09:59 AM
When the ridiculous NY SAFE act was passed (after hours in an "Emergency Session" called by the Governor, and allegedly only people known to be in support were invited), I was in the middle of a trial at the Southern District of NY. Speaking with the contract security officers there, who work for the US Marshal's, all of whom are retired NYPD officers, they were directed by their "boss" (contractor) to download their G19 magazines to 7 rounds.

I have several retired NY LEOs that have 10-round magazines that they are required to download to 7 rounds while carrying under HR 218...

I'll check through the NYPD connections to get the skinny on the G17s, though.

Hambo
10-07-2015, 06:21 AM
When the ridiculous NY SAFE act was passed (after hours in an "Emergency Session" called by the Governor, and allegedly only people known to be in support were invited), I was in the middle of a trial at the Southern District of NY. Speaking with the contract security officers there, who work for the US Marshal's, all of whom are retired NYPD officers, they were directed by their "boss" (contractor) to download their G19 magazines to 7 rounds.

I have several retired NY LEOs that have 10-round magazines that they are required to download to 7 rounds while carrying under HR 218...

I'll check through the NYPD connections to get the skinny on the G17s, though.

I've been to one world's fair, a picnic, and a rodeo and that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

Chuck Haggard
10-07-2015, 10:20 AM
In NJ, unless one is an LEO for an agency in NJ and on duty, off duty cops and out of state cops can not have magazines exceeding 15 rounds, period. Cops wanting to carry their G17 home have to swap to ten round mags before leaving work. Back when the G17 was more commonly carried this led to a lot of guys carrying G19s off duty, not exactly a horrible choice.

psalms144.1
10-07-2015, 08:41 PM
In NJ, unless one is an LEO for an agency in NJ and on duty, off duty cops and out of state cops can not have magazines exceeding 15 rounds, period. Cops wanting to carry their G17 home have to swap to ten round mags before leaving work. Back when the G17 was more commonly carried this led to a lot of guys carrying G19s off duty, not exactly a horrible choice.And don't get me started on off-duty no-JHP ammunition in New Joisey. I actually had folks ask me for .40 S&W FMJ ammunition for "off duty" carry. I pointed out to them in our policy where we're reasonable expected to be armed at all times, so we're TECHNICALLY never carrying a firearm "off duty."

Hopefully this will never become an issue. Sometimes NYistan sounds almost reasonable...

JR1572
10-08-2015, 01:29 PM
The white one is the "original" NY trigger spring. The black one is even more stiff. I have a few examples of both, that came in a box of parts Glock sent to us in 1994. From talking with both NYSP and NYPD people who were here for Katrina, I was told that the New York trigger was developed at the request of NYPD. According to those guys, at that time NYSP used the standard coil trigger spring.

No way for me to check… because the NYSP guys showed up sans firearms. I shit you not. So we issued them Sigs and duty leather for same. I asked one of them why in the hell didn't they bring their pistols??? He said their brass wasn't sure we would allow them to carry; so they sent them anyway, unarmed.

Simply unbelievable… but true.

.

The NYSP were a class act. I wasn't happy when they left. I remember watching them load their units onto trailers and head back north.

JR1572

LSP972
10-08-2015, 01:37 PM
The NYSP were a class act. I wasn't happy when they left. I remember watching them load their units onto trailers and head back north.

JR1572

That was the "second wave". The first bunch came un-armed, via commercial air, and rented cars here. We put them to work in the command post in Baton Rouge.

.

Gadfly
10-08-2015, 01:39 PM
their brass wasn't sure we would allow them to carry; so they sent them anyway, unarmed.

Simply unbelievable… but true.

.

That is a fancy way of saying if you had gone from LA to NY, their management probably would not have allowed you to carry your duty pistol...

NYPD wont let LEO's carry guns at the 9/11 memorial. Somehow, we are trustworthy roaming the streets, going up the Empire State building and such. But one we set foot in the 9/11 memorial, we lose all control and gun sense... It boggles the mind.

JR1572
10-08-2015, 01:43 PM
That was the "second wave". The first bunch came un-armed, via commercial air, and rented cars here. We put them to work in the command post in Baton Rouge.

.

My district station was destroyed on Moss Street and we got relocated to the Seminary on Chef Highway (US 90) going towards The East. The NYSP guys were active in our district, and so were the LSP.

I remember watching those units get loaded onto that truck and started to think that maybe things were going to get back to "normal." Ten years later that city is still a mess.

JR1572

LSP972
10-08-2015, 04:31 PM
" Ten years later that city is still a mess.

JR1572

Indeed. But you got out, to a better place. Congrats.

.

JR1572
10-08-2015, 04:49 PM
Indeed. But you got out, to a better place. Congrats.

.

I did.

Thanks.

JR1572

LSP972
10-08-2015, 04:53 PM
That is a fancy way of saying if you had gone from LA to NY, their management probably would not have allowed you to carry your duty pistol...

NYPD wont let LEO's carry guns at the 9/11 memorial. Somehow, we are trustworthy roaming the streets, going up the Empire State building and such. But one we set foot in the 9/11 memorial, we lose all control and gun sense... It boggles the mind.

Yeah, I've heard a ton of horror stories about how many of the cops in the northeast never heard of professional courtesy. The only time I've been to New York was passing through on my way to the S&W plant in Springfield, MA. I was driving a marked unit, and got stopped numerous times along the way by suspicious road cops. Hey, I didn't blame them, and it all worked out well. I didn't lose anything in that part of the country, though, and will never go there again willingly. I know, not all the coppers up there are dicks. But it only takes one to ruin your day.

But you know what? A lot of them come down here for Mardi Gras, get tanked and get their ass in a bind, and the first thing they do is play the brotherhood card.

Times have changed. Fortunately, I have no desire to do any more traveling, except out west (Kalifornia SPECIFICALLY excluded). I'll take my chances in that direction…;)

.

JR1572
10-08-2015, 07:07 PM
But you know what? A lot of them come down here for Mardi Gras, get tanked and get their ass in a bind, and the first thing they do is play the brotherhood card.


.

Very true. Seen it happen more than once in the French Quarter.

JR1572

cathellsk
11-03-2015, 11:09 PM
Any more info on the G17s being authorized?

HCM
11-03-2015, 11:30 PM
The Glock 17 Gen 4 is replacing the S&W 5946 as one of three duty weapon choices for NYPD officers, the others being the Glock 19 and the SIG P-226 DAO. Best info is it will have the same 12 pound NY plus trigger as their 19's. Apparently NYPD is also requiring 15 round magazines for uniformity / range / admin reasons.

heyscooter
11-03-2015, 11:31 PM
That is a fancy way of saying if you had gone from LA to NY, their management probably would not have allowed you to carry your duty pistol...

NYPD wont let LEO's carry guns at the 9/11 memorial. Somehow, we are trustworthy roaming the streets, going up the Empire State building and such. But one we set foot in the 9/11 memorial, we lose all control and gun sense... It boggles the mind.

NYPD doesn't run the 9/11 memorial. PANYNJ does, to include PAPD.

BigDaddy
11-04-2015, 01:47 PM
The NYPD is very deep into the brotherhood

jor-el
10-29-2016, 03:51 PM
I almost considered sticking around an extra month to pick up that Glock 17 instead of the SW 5946 I carried for over 20 years, but decided to tough it out.
Didn't want to deal with Caroli, nor for that matter Hurley.

I notice HCM said he worked at Rodman's in the past. Perhaps he remembers this former X-man.

HCM
10-29-2016, 07:00 PM
I almost considered sticking around an extra month to pick up that Glock 17 instead of the SW 5946 I carried for over 20 years, but decided to tough it out.
Didn't want to deal with Caroli, nor for that matter Hurley.

I notice HCM said he worked at Rodman's in the past. Perhaps he remembers this former X-man.

To Clarify, I did not work there. I attended Glock factory armorer school there while working for a federal agency in NYC.

On another note, are they going forward with the 15 round limited magazines for the Glock 17's?

Sigfan26
10-29-2016, 07:04 PM
To Clarify, I did not work there. I attended Glock factory armorer school there while working for a federal agency in NYC.

On another note, are they going forward with the 15 round limited magazines for the Glock 17's?

I can tell you that Lipsey's has a SKU for a 15 round Glock 17 mag.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

HCM
10-29-2016, 07:13 PM
I can tell you that Lipsey's has a SKU for a 15 round Glock 17 mag.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Interesting.

I believe Smith and Wesson has occasionally offered 15 round M&P magazines for the Colorado and New Jersey markets.

Kyle Reese
10-29-2016, 07:18 PM
Interesting.

I believe Smith in Weston has occasionally offered 15 round M&P magazines for the Colorado and New Jersey markets.

Yup. SKU#107427514

jor-el
10-29-2016, 09:14 PM
I believe the solution is to feed only 15 rounds into the 17 round magazine and forbid cops on pain of death or the rubber gun squad from adding any more.

HCM; and here I was hoping to catch up with old friends. Which agency, may I ask? Southern District, I assume?

Nephrology
10-29-2016, 09:19 PM
I can tell you that Lipsey's has a SKU for a 15 round Glock 17 mag.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For realz? This Coloradan would love to know where they can be ordered...

Sigfan26
10-29-2016, 09:37 PM
For realz? This Coloradan would love to know where they can be ordered...

No clue. They have a SKU, though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Kyle Reese
10-29-2016, 09:41 PM
Greg Cote LLC has these (http://gregcotellc.com/cart/smith-wesson-magazines-c-108/sw-mp9-9mm-15-rd-by-actmag-nj-co-compliant-mpb915-p-1391.html?zenid=b1ad3cf8c98aa2a7041492e4e960e066) 15 rounders in stock.

Detmongo
10-29-2016, 09:45 PM
yes they are 15rd mags got my gun inspected on monday just have to qual with it before i can carry it.
i can carry it

jor-el
10-29-2016, 09:52 PM
I apologize, but can you elaborate? What gun, what mags, and you're from Long Island?

Should I bring up one of the GO-15s that a third grader got me into that tarnished my opinion of gold shields to this day?

TGS
10-29-2016, 11:36 PM
yes they are 15rd mags got my gun inspected on monday just have to qual with it before i can carry it.
i can carry it

I'm also curious. Long Island....you work for Suffolk County PD, or just live there?

HCM
10-29-2016, 11:44 PM
I'm also curious. Long Island....you work for Suffolk County PD, or just live there?

What about Nassau? There are several city and town PDs in Nassau and the eastern half of Suffolk county.

Or maybe posting your agency is not the best thing for everybody.

psalms144.1
10-30-2016, 11:03 AM
Suffolk County PD used to issue G19s, transitioned to G23s a couple of years back. Nassau County, AFAIK, is carrying .40 S&W Sigs. There are tons of town and "village" PDs as well, know way of knowing what they carry. I can tell you that the original NY "Safe" Act has been amended so that none of the restrictions on firearms or magazine capacity apply to current "Peace Officers" in NYS, and/or persons covered under HR 218. A friend of mine (retired NYPD) recently got his HR 218 card updated and it now specifically states he can carry "high capacity" magazines.

GRV
10-30-2016, 11:06 AM
Suffolk County PD used to issue G19s, transitioned to G23s a couple of years back. Nassau County, AFAIK, is carrying .40 S&W Sigs. There are tons of town and "village" PDs as well, know way of knowing what they carry. I can tell you that the original NY "Safe" Act has been amended so that none of the restrictions on firearms or magazine capacity apply to current "Peace Officers" in NYS, and/or persons covered under HR 218. A friend of mine (retired NYPD) recently got his HR 218 card updated and it now specifically states he can carry "high capacity" magazines.

Does that include non-residents carrying into NY on HR218?

SLG
10-30-2016, 11:18 AM
I'll just say that anything Detmongo says about the issue at hand should be taken as gospel. Any other issue relating to guns as well.

psalms144.1
10-30-2016, 11:19 AM
Does that include non-residents carrying into NY on HR218?Maaaayyybee. I think a lot would depend on circumstances, and what documentation you have with you. I'll admit that "professional courtesy" has different meanings in different jurisdictions, but, generally, I haven't been hassled beyond what I would consider normal NY asshole behavior on the two occasions I've interacted with local officers up here. Of course, I'm a Fed, and both issues were simple traffic-related events (including being pulled over for excessively dark tint in my G-car - really? Fine, send the ticket to the GSA - they own, and tinted, the car). As always, act like an adult (no drinking to excess, no reckless driving, no fighting), and be respectful, and you're likely to be fine.

Having said that, there are exceptions. As pointed out before, you CANNOT take a firearm into the WTC Memorial, even on official business without a HUGE amount of butt pain. And, remember, NY in general is about as anti-gun a culture as you could ever hope to find, even most of the LEOs up here don't carry off duty, and consider anyone who does a "nut job."

rojocorsa
10-30-2016, 12:44 PM
Is this a good place to ask why the police in NY have to have these heavy, revolver like trigger pulls in the first place? I'm not sure I understand that logic.

jor-el
10-30-2016, 07:27 PM
Is this a good place to ask why the police in NY have to have these heavy, revolver like trigger pulls in the first place? I'm not sure I understand that logic.
Quite a few officers have had negligent discharges over the years, and as a CYA move blame the gun for having anything less than a 100 pound trigger pull. Department policy has favored increasing trigger pull weight to Herculean levels to address the issue. Accuracy with such arms suffers.

jor-el
10-30-2016, 07:34 PM
Maaaayyybee. I think a lot would depend on circumstances, and what documentation you have with you. I'll admit that "professional courtesy" has different meanings in different jurisdictions, but, generally, I haven't been hassled beyond what I would consider normal NY asshole behavior on the two occasions I've interacted with local officers up here. Of course, I'm a Fed, and both issues were simple traffic-related events (including being pulled over for excessively dark tint in my G-car - really? Fine, send the ticket to the GSA - they own, and tinted, the car). As always, act like an adult (no drinking to excess, no reckless driving, no fighting), and be respectful, and you're likely to be fine.

Having said that, there are exceptions. As pointed out before, you CANNOT take a firearm into the WTC Memorial, even on official business without a HUGE amount of butt pain. And, remember, NY in general is about as anti-gun a culture as you could ever hope to find, even most of the LEOs up here don't carry off duty, and consider anyone who does a "nut job."
That was before the ambushes by BLM as well as the many instances of off-duty shenanigans involving drugs or prostitution.
Me, I carried, and carry to this day. I was also not dumb enough to solicit or booze it up after hours.

Det1397
10-30-2016, 07:56 PM
Suffolk County PD used to issue G19s, transitioned to G23s a couple of years back. Nassau County, AFAIK, is carrying .40 S&W Sigs. There are tons of town and "village" PDs as well, know way of knowing what they carry.

psalms is right on about Suffolk and the GLOCKs... From my personal experience, the NY trigger was designed by GLOCK at the suggestion of SCPD armorers (not NYSP), who wanted a more consistent revolver-like feel to the G19 trigger. At that time, GLOCK was willing to practically do anything to get contracts... SCPD was the one first "large department" to issue the GLOCK (19/26) and all were fitted with the original black leaf spring NY trigger. The NYPD NY-2 trigger was designed specifically from a liability standpoint. The original leaf spring NYPD triggers were also black, but were stamped with a +.

Nephrology
10-30-2016, 09:40 PM
i would be thrilled if these 15 round mags make it to general retail. I have a healthy stock of 17rd pre-ban G17 mags but I'd jump at the chance to buy functional 15rd G17 mags.

rojocorsa
10-31-2016, 01:58 AM
i would be thrilled if these 15 round mags make it to general retail. I have a healthy stock of 17rd pre-ban G17 mags but I'd jump at the chance to buy functional 15rd G17 mags.


I saw some on either Brownells or PSA today; sold out. But they're available.

Nephrology
10-31-2016, 05:00 AM
I saw some on either Brownells or PSA today; sold out. But they're available.

Can you send me a link?

Beat Trash
10-31-2016, 08:16 AM
The Glock 17, 15 rd magazine at Lipsey's. I haven't called about stock or ordering them as I can legally possess the 17 rd version where I live.

https://www.lipseys.com/itemdetail.aspx?itemno=GLMF17015

taadski
10-31-2016, 11:18 AM
Can you send me a link?


Same from Kote, sold out, but looks like they'll be stocking them also.


http://gregcotellc.com/cart/glock-factory-magazines-c-94/glock-17-9mm-factory-15-rd-co-and-nj-compliant-glock-339501-p-1714.html

Detmongo
10-31-2016, 04:17 PM
Hey guys it is an NYPD authorized G17 with 15rd mags. I have the gun 1 week already have 900rds thru it with no issues.

SLG
10-31-2016, 08:32 PM
Hey guys it is an NYPD authorized G17 with 15rd mags. I have the gun 1 week already have 900rds thru it with no issues.

Glad to hear you've switched to an adult sized gun;-)

I'm very curious to see how these 15 round mags hold up long term over large numbers of guns.

cathellsk
10-31-2016, 09:08 PM
Hey guys it is an NYPD authorized G17 with 15rd mags. I have the gun 1 week already have 900rds thru it with no issues.

I guess you guys still run the NY2 trigger spring? What about sights? Factory GLOCK, Trijicon? One last question, Gen 3 or 4?
I always enjoy your posts on M4Carbine btw.

DocGKR
10-31-2016, 09:41 PM
And what was wrong with the normal standard capacity 17 rd G17 mags?

Sigfan26
10-31-2016, 09:54 PM
And what was wrong with the normal standard capacity 17 rd G17 mags?

All the other guns would feel less adequate since they only hold 15.


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HCM
10-31-2016, 11:30 PM
And what was wrong with the normal standard capacity 17 rd G17 mags?

It's an institutional issue.

All the other NYPD duty guns hold 15 rounds.

Lowest Common Denominator is a thing with 40,000 cops Shooting 2x per year. They are qualifying 1,000 officers per week.

Most of them never shot a gun before the police academy. Most shoot 95 rounds every 6 months. If you shoot on your own time or carry off duty regularly you are a "buff" or a "Tackleberry".

Nephrology
11-01-2016, 07:20 AM
Same from Kote, sold out, but looks like they'll be stocking them also.


http://gregcotellc.com/cart/glock-factory-magazines-c-94/glock-17-9mm-factory-15-rd-co-and-nj-compliant-glock-339501-p-1714.html

You are my hero. will bookmark that page. thanks!!

JonInWA
11-01-2016, 12:54 PM
As an experiment, I've been running my Gen 3 G21 with a NY2 for several months. Contrary to much internet innuendo, you do not need to be a professional weightlifter to execute a decent trigger pull with it. It does provide somewhat revolver-like pull characteristics (but without the long triggerpull distance, and with a single-stage pull, followed with a short, crisp reset). For a variety of reasons, I've found the large-framed G21 to be more difficult to index with-part of it is the grip frame size (mine is the "big butt" non-SF), part of it is how my trigger falls ergonomically (linked to the frame size). Essentially, I'm using the NY2 as an orthopedic crutch of sorts to force me to concentrate on the fundamentals. But the heavier triggerpull induced by the NY2 does not in and of itself seem to present any significant impediments to the equation.

It'll be an interesting experiment (to me, at least). I may also compare and contrast results with a NY1. Other possibly pertinent details are that mine is being run with a "dot" connector and a set of Warren/Sevigny Carry sights, black-on-black, and with a Glock extended slide release. There are no grip enhancements utilized, in the interest in minimizing grip bulk as much as possible with a stock frame. I am also running it with a Pierce grip plug.

Best, Jon

Randy Harris
11-01-2016, 01:16 PM
We carry them at my day job (carry meaning sell not carry as in "carry" on our person).

Here's the link. Unfortunately there is no word on when they'll be available......https://www.natchezss.com/g17-9mm-15rd-mag-w-block.html

Detmongo
11-01-2016, 02:31 PM
Hey guys sorry the gun is a gen4 17 with NY 2 trigger spring. the 15 rd mags are mandated by the city council (please don't ask) ran all 900rds thru those 15 rd mags with no issues. The ammo is mix of service 124 gr GD+p plus a mix of what ever I can get my hands on. My gun has Glock factory night sights, the y work for now might replace them with Warren tact. at a later date. Hope this helps guys

GRV
11-01-2016, 10:44 PM
As an experiment, I've been running my Gen 3 G21 with a NY2 for several months. Contrary to much internet innuendo, you do not need to be a professional weightlifter to execute a decent trigger pull with it. It does provide somewhat revolver-like pull characteristics (but without the long triggerpull distance, and with a single-stage pull, followed with a short, crisp reset). For a variety of reasons, I've found the large-framed G21 to be more difficult to index with-part of it is the grip frame size (mine is the "big butt" non-SF), part of it is how my trigger falls ergonomically (linked to the frame size). Essentially, I'm using the NY2 as an orthopedic crutch of sorts to force me to concentrate on the fundamentals. But the heavier triggerpull induced by the NY2 does not in and of itself seem to present any significant impediments to the equation.

It'll be an interesting experiment (to me, at least). I may also compare and contrast results with a NY1. Other possibly pertinent details are that mine is being run with a "dot" connector and a set of Warren/Sevigny Carry sights, black-on-black, and with a Glock extended slide release. There are no grip enhancements utilized, in the interest in minimizing grip bulk as much as possible with a stock frame. I am also running it with a Pierce grip plug.

Best, Jon

I've been running the same experiment for similar reasons on my Gen4 G17 for a while. I'm sensing a new PF fad... #orangeinside ;)

After just a few weeks, the NY2 started feeling "normal". My abilities, inabilities, and mistakes now largely feel the same as they used to with the stock trigger, with the exception of seat-of-my-pants Bill Drill split times, which are probably still slower. I've been running it for a while now, and I wouldn't hesitate to run any sort of qual for score, compete against any equal or less skilled shooter, etc. It had a learning curve of a few weeks, but, probably thanks to frequent dryfire during that warmup time, it very quickly stopped feeling like it was hampering my abilities. I also swear the trigger feels lighter than it started. Certainly way lighter than the reputed "12 lbs" (I don't buy it). In short, I now roll my eyes at any exaggerated complaints and criticism of the NY2, and I'm glad I took the time to form my own opinion on it. Not because I'm any good, not by a long shot, but because even I could regain my usual mediocrity with it so quickly.

I'm going to keep running it for at least a few more months. I certainly believe a more skilled shooter would see significant ability differences in it for, say, USPSA. However, I think any decent shooter who spends a few weeks dryfiring and livefiring with it could clean any real LE qual with it. The same old indian/arrow line seems to hold true. My bet is that anyone who is failing quals or suffering from abysmal hit ratios in real encounters with it just isn't practicing enough for any gun or trigger, but I realize I'm out of lane on that.

Now I just need some of these unobtanium 15 rd magazines, then I can have the Official NYPD G17 setup :rolleyes:

cathellsk
11-02-2016, 01:08 AM
Hey guys sorry the gun is a gen4 17 with NY 2 trigger spring. the 15 rd mags are mandated by the city council (please don't ask) ran all 900rds thru those 15 rd mags with no issues. The ammo is mix of service 124 gr GD+p plus a mix of what ever I can get my hands on. My gun has Glock factory night sights, the y work for now might replace them with Warren tact. at a later date. Hope this helps guys

Thanks for the info.
Did the job ever authorize GEN4 19s & 26s? And what's the status of the 43 joining the Shield & XD-S as an offduty?

Detmongo
11-02-2016, 11:03 AM
the gen4 26 is authorized. not the 19 yet. the 43 is still being tested.

GRV
11-02-2016, 01:25 PM
the gen4 26 is authorized. not the 19 yet. the 43 is still being tested.

Are you able to share anything about what's holding the 19 back?

IIRC, this pattern is true of some fed agencies too.

Detmongo
11-02-2016, 02:31 PM
no it's not being tested. we are happy with gen 3 19

BigDaddy
11-02-2016, 04:26 PM
Detmongo, what is the most common duty gun in the NYPD now? G19,5946,226 ? What about off duty? If you know.Thanks

Sigfan26
11-02-2016, 07:07 PM
RSR had the 15 round G17 mags in stock today.


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Nephrology
11-02-2016, 07:29 PM
RSR had the 15 round G17 mags in stock today.


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How does one order from them?

edit: found some here! http://www.milehighshooting.com/glock-17-34-15-round-9mm-magazine-glmf17015/

Ordered 4 for T&E. If they are good hopefully I'll be able to get my hands on more, though with the coming election that may be a little tight... I'll keep 2 in reserve for carry and test the other 2.

Sigfan26
11-02-2016, 07:32 PM
How does one order from them?

They're dealer only. But, they are one of the largest dealers in the country. Almost every FFL uses them


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Nephrology
11-03-2016, 09:39 AM
How does one order from them?

edit: found some here! http://www.milehighshooting.com/glock-17-34-15-round-9mm-magazine-glmf17015/

Ordered 4 for T&E. If they are good hopefully I'll be able to get my hands on more, though with the coming election that may be a little tight... I'll keep 2 in reserve for carry and test the other 2.

Just modified the order to make it a nice round 5 mags. Definitely excited to get my hands on these. I have a G4G17 that is just 150 rounds away from passing the 2k round challenge - assuming these mags are GTG I'll probably throw tritium sights on it and make this my winter carry pistol. The slightly longer grip is really helpful when wearing gloves...

Detmongo
11-03-2016, 10:26 AM
Bigdaddy I wouldsay the G19 is the most popular as far as the service guns go, it seems more guys are switching over to the 19 from the other 2. As far as the off duties go G26 is by far the most popular. The S&W shield seems to be making serious inroads with guys wanting a flatter gun to conceal for either offduty or as a backup.

BigDaddy
11-04-2016, 06:36 PM
Thanks Mongo

Nephrology
11-05-2016, 05:20 AM
Detmongo, are these the same mags that you are issued? referring to mag on the left.

http://i.imgur.com/EYPJocu.jpg

Detmongo
11-05-2016, 07:53 PM
yes sir that's them

cathellsk
11-29-2016, 01:21 AM
Saw this article today… http://nypost.com/2016/11/28/nypd-vets-upset-rookies-get-better-guns/

Detmongo, how is the new 17 doing? How's the NY2 trigger in a Gen4 compared to a Gen3?

Detmongo
12-05-2016, 04:37 PM
I can't speak on the other gen4's on the street, but on my gun it is a very smooth clean break. it is a very shootable trigger , while I would love to run an 8lb. trigger this one will work .

Detmongo
12-05-2016, 04:38 PM
it's not bad at all it's smooth and it breaks very cleanly. At least the one I'm running in my gun.

TheNewbie
12-05-2016, 04:55 PM
Detmongo,

Do you feel the trigger actually increases safety for poor trigger discipline?

Can you guys carry j-frames off duty still?

Detmongo
12-06-2016, 01:02 PM
I can still carry a j frame. No the job went with the heavier triggers to reduce AD's.

GRV
12-06-2016, 02:59 PM
Do you find the new trigger better or more shootable than the old Gen3 NY2?

Detmongo
12-06-2016, 03:59 PM
Do you find the new trigger better or more shootable than the old Gen3 NY2?

I do but that's my service weapon so I can't speak on the others.

WobblyPossum
12-08-2016, 07:38 AM
Saw this article today… http://nypost.com/2016/11/28/nypd-vets-upset-rookies-get-better-guns/

Detmongo, how is the new 17 doing? How's the NY2 trigger in a Gen4 compared to a Gen3?

"Another cop said, 'Why would you select a firearm that can hold 17 rounds, but then only allow 15 to be carried? It defies common sense. Officers may need those rounds if they find themselves in an active-shooter situation like Dallas or Orlando.'"

Oh, the irony.


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