Pistol-mounted weapon light activation

[LOKNLOD]

How do you manipulate the switches on your pistol light of choice? Long weak-hand thumb rolled forward? Flick it with trigger finger? Give up and buy a DG switch or similar?

[MD7305]

I use a TLR-1 and I shoot thumbs forward. My weak hand thumb operates the left switch, I usually pressure down on the switch for momentary operation. I prefer the SF X-series switch but alas the issued TLR1 is mandatory.

[1slow]

DG.........

[Eli]

My EDC wears an Inforce APL. I manipulate the switch (firing hand side) with the index finger of my weak hand.

[Drang]

Surefre X400 w/DG Switch on my Colt Rail Gun.

[Jay Cunningham]

I don't use a WML on my carry gun - which is a Glock 19.

But I do have a handgun dedicated for home defense, and it's a Glock 34 with an x300U and a DG switch.

[breakingtime91]

I don't use a WML on my carry gun - which is a Glock 19.

But I do have a handgun dedicated for home defense, and it's a Glock 34 with an x300U and a DG switch.

Jay, you thinking about grabbing a xc1 for your 19?

[DMF13]

I use a TLR-1 and I shoot thumbs forward. My weak hand thumb operates the left switch, I usually pressure down on the switch for momentary operation. I prefer the SF X-series switch but alas the issued TLR1 is mandatory.Interesting. I also use my weak hand thumb. We are issued an X300, but I prefer the switch on the TLR-1. Thankfully, we are allowed to switch lights as long as we shoot the low light qual with the new light before carrying it, and that's what I did. I use the TLR-1 just like you described, with the thumb giving downward pressure for a momentary on.

We are issued the DG switch with the X300, and it's optional. I tried it, but found I was activating the light unintentionally at times I definitely did not want the light on. Usually on the draw stroke. What we've seen is those with long fingers tend to just use their thumbs and leave the DG switch off, and those with small hands prefer the DG switch for obvious reasons. The middle ground of "medium" sized hands, is pretty evenly divided.

[HopetonBrown]

X300 Ultra, support hand thumb. Anyone who'd consider using their trigger finger scare me.

[Jay Cunningham]

Jay, you thinking about grabbing a xc1 for your 19?

I'd certainly like to check one out.

[Wheeler]

Different strokes for different folks. I can only do one thing at a time. Since all my training had me illuminating and identifying, then illuminating and engaging, I use my trigger finger. That way I don't have an ND or UD.

[Chuck Haggard]

On lights without something like a DG switch I use my trigger finger to run the switch, have done so for decades.

Because it's a handgun, not a handSgun, and the vast majority of the time that I have really needed a light on my pistol has been when I don't have two hands to run things.

I don't find ADing the light on the draw with the DG switch to be an issue, if I am preemptively drawing the gun, saw to go start a building search, I think about what I am doing and don't hit the switch, if I am making an emergency draw then the light going on or not really doesn't matter in the least.

[LOKNLOD]

I don't use a WML on my carry gun - which is a Glock 19.

But I do have a handgun dedicated for home defense, and it's a Glock 34 with an x300U and a DG switch.

That's about where I have landed. No carry Wml, but 34 with a TLR1 and their version of a DG as the house gun.

I think the DG setup is also more dummy-proof and one-hand friendly for my wife who could find herself using it as well.


Chuck,
When switching with your trigger finger, do you lose the light as you move to the trigger if you decide to fire, or are you leaving it clicked on, or what?

[JHC]

When it comes to shooting one may shoot with momentary activation or with constant on.

I'm not clear if each point of view is considered to have legit arguments and proponents or if the "switched on" folks all swing one way.

IIRC Hack was pretty adamant about momentary.

[Chuck Haggard]

That's about where I have landed. No carry Wml, but 34 with a TLR1 and their version of a DG as the house gun.

I think the DG setup is also more dummy-proof and one-hand friendly for my wife who could find herself using it as well.


Chuck,
When switching with your trigger finger, do you lose the light as you move to the trigger if you decide to fire, or are you leaving it clicked on, or what?

If I am using the momentary then yes, If I have it clicked on then obviously no. Kind of depends on what I am doing, and something like a SWAT activity secondary/confined space search is something most people don't have to deal with very often.

I don't have lights on any of my CCW guns because I simply see no need for it. I used lights on my SWAT and duty pistols as far back as the '90s though when SureFire started making their first gen legacy lights for pistols.

[Up1911Fan]

X300U with a DG switch.

[Erick Gelhaus]

Because it's a handgun, not a handSgun, and the vast majority of the time that I have really needed a light on my pistol has been when I don't have two hands to run things.

I don't find ADing the light on the draw with the DG switch to be an issue, if I am preemptively drawing the gun, saw to go start a building search, I think about what I am doing and don't hit the switch, if I am making an emergency draw then the light going on or not really doesn't matter in the least.

DG switch here ... What Chuck said, along with the following additions ...

I have short thumbs & fingers, so the rocker switch was never going to be a viable option. Can't reach the switch and now I've a finger swinging at things in line with the trigger. It's kittened to try that under the best circus for me.

As for the draw, I break it into Want the pistol in my hand or Need the pistol in my hand. If I Want, I can relax the middle finger enough so that it does not risk activating the light; if I Need then, absent one rare situation a current service member described, I'm not concerned about the middle finger activating the light.

However, if I could take over managing SF's switch line, the DG would go away tomorrow and it'd be back to the SL version without looking back. And that's after sixteen years of using pistol mounted lights at work with the velcro'd on & cabled tape switch, the SL and now the DG.

[Eli]

Because it's a handgun, not a handSgun, and the vast majority of the time that I have really needed a light on my pistol has been when I don't have two hands to run things.

My trigger finger is just barely long enough to reach the switch...."barely" enough that I don't trust myself to not miss the switch on the APL and get my finger inside the trigger guard. If I'm having to go one handed my trigger finger stays alongside the frame like normal and my middle finger activates the light to constant on.

[Gray222]

I agree with Chuck, as ive ran a tlr1s on my duty g17 then a duty g21 and ive only ever ran it single handed when I needed it in a bind. Big fan of the tlr1s...did a review -> http://www.vdmsr.com/2013/11/streamlight-tlr-1s-led-rail-mounted.html

Ive always found there was either a reason fkr me to have it constant on or for me to blip once or twice and then turn constant on. I used my trigger finger in a "pointing" the light motion to not ND under stress.

[SLG]

There are no good ways to use pistol mounted lights. There are no good lights and there are no good switches. You have to find something that works for you, in your circumstances. Or not, as having a weapons mounted pistol light is highly overrated for most people, most of the time.

Having said that, I have always used an SF light at work, going on 15 years or so. I played with a different one before that, but quickly ditched it. I've been issued TLR xyz's, and some have worked ok and some have not. The more basic they are, the better they work. I have been using an Inforce for the last year or so. Don't completely trust it, but it has some features that set it apart from the others. Also some drawbacks. Time will tell.

I prefer not to use any kind of tape switch whenever possible. If that's not possible, then use it, just don't expect it to last. I prefer to use my support thumb when shooting with both hands, but use my trigger finger when I only have one on the gun. At that point, I mostly just leave the light on. I have yet to meet the guy who can run a light and a gun, as well as he can run just a gun, especially one handed.

[Chuck Haggard]

Nearly every time I say that having a WML on your CCW piece is in no way necessary people start going into burn the witch mode.

Dunning-Kruger is a vast and wide human condition.

[Gray222]

Nearly every time I say that having a WML on your CCW piece is in no way necessary people start going into burn the witch mode.

Dunning-Kruger is a vast and wide human condition.

...then you tell them you don't necessarily need tritium either...

[Drang]

Nearly every time I say that having a WML on your CCW piece is in no way necessary people start going into burn the witch mode.
For CCW I see no /n/e/e/d/ practical use for a weapon-mounted light. More stuff to mess with, a much larger package to try and conceal.
If I was carrying a pistol in a duty capacity I'd feel different. I regard the rail Gun w/light as home defense, which would be "duty."

EDIT to change from "need" to "practical use." Better description. Among other things, hopefully I'll never even "need" the CCW piece...

[Wheeler]

For CCW I see no /n/e/e/d/ practical use for a weapon-mounted light. More stuff to mess with, a much larger package to try and conceal.
If I was carrying a pistol in a duty capacity I'd feel different. I regard the rail Gun w/light as home defense, which would be "duty."

EDIT to change from "need" to "practical use." Better description. Among other things, hopefully I'll never even "need" the CCW piece...


Need is relative and is determined by perception in many cases. Far too many folks make the distinction by buying pieces of gear vs training with what they got.

[BobLoblaw]

Support hand thumb. X300. I would use a DG if one existed for the VP9.


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[Default.mp3]

Support hand thumb. X300. I would use a DG if one existed for the VP9.


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Try a DG-20:
http://i.imgbox.com/y5zDTysl.jpg (http://imgbox.com/y5zDTysl)
Or a DG-13:
http://i.imgbox.com/2fZTqs2B.jpg (http://imgbox.com/2fZTqs2B)
http://i.imgbox.com/GyWHysCG.jpg (http://imgbox.com/GyWHysCG)

I use a DG-11 on my P30LS, for use with the X400U-GN. I wear size small Outdoor Research gloves, and size medium nitrile gloves (though I can use smalls without too much issue; the mediums definitely have some slight slack). Without a DG switch, I'd probably have to use my support hand thumb, as my trigger finger would not be able to actuate the light, as they are too short to do so reliably. One of the alternate techniques that William Petty showed was rolling the index finger of the support hand into the paddle, forcing it up, during the draw stroke; workable, but I don't see much advantage compared to using the support hand thumb.

[Drang]

Need is relative and is determined by perception in many cases. Far too many folks make the distinction by buying pieces of gear vs training with what they got.

And that's why I decided I used the wrong word.

[BobLoblaw]

Try a DG-20:
http://i.imgbox.com/y5zDTysl.jpg (http://imgbox.com/y5zDTysl)
Or a DG-13:
http://i.imgbox.com/2fZTqs2B.jpg (http://imgbox.com/2fZTqs2B)
http://i.imgbox.com/GyWHysCG.jpg (http://imgbox.com/GyWHysCG)

I use a DG-11 on my P30LS, for use with the X400U-GN. I wear size small Outdoor Research gloves, and size medium nitrile gloves (though I can use smalls without too much issue; the mediums definitely have some slight slack). Without a DG switch, I'd probably have to use my support hand thumb, as my trigger finger would not be able to actuate the light, as they are too short to do so reliably. One of the alternate techniques that William Petty showed was rolling the index finger of the support hand into the paddle, forcing it up, during the draw stroke; workable, but I don't see much advantage compared to using the support hand thumb.

Thank you!


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[UNK]

Can you explain why you feel that way.

X300 Ultra, support hand thumb. Anyone who'd consider using their trigger finger scare me.

[HopetonBrown]

Can you explain why you feel that way.

I think the trigger finger should be for pulling the trigger only. If 1 handed I'll use a hand held. But I'm just an average schmuck with a couple low light classes under his belt, not a professional door kicker.

[UNK]

thx for the input

I think the trigger finger should be for pulling the trigger only. If 1 handed I'll use a hand held. But I'm just an average schmuck with a couple low light classes under his belt, not a professional door kicker.

[HopetonBrown]

thx for the input

Not that anyone should care, but I'm going to clarify. If you have two hands available to you, then I think you should use your support hand thumb, not trigger finger. If you only have 1 hand available to you, then you gotta do what you gotta do. For hand held, I like the neck index and "Julie" method.

[Wheeler]

And that's why I decided I used the wrong word.

I wasn't busting your chops, I was agreeing with you.

[Chuck Haggard]

I think the trigger finger should be for pulling the trigger only. If 1 handed I'll use a hand held. But I'm just an average schmuck with a couple low light classes under his belt, not a professional door kicker.

Respectfully, if you had two hands and you would keep them on the gun, but if you can only one hand available to run the gun you'd then have a light in the other hand?

Not sure you've analyzed that post very well before hitting the go button. If you had the other hand free to run the held held light it would be available to run the light on the gun. If it's opening a closet door, running a shield, hanging on to an attic ladder, etc. then that hand is in fact not available to run any light of any kind.

[Coyotesfan97]

M
Respectfully, if you had two hands and you would keep them on the gun, but if you can only one hand available to run the gun you'd then have a light in the other hand?

Not sure you've analyzed that post very well before hitting the go button. If you had the other hand free to run the held held light it would be available to run the light on the gun. If it's opening a closet door, running a shield, hanging on to an attic ladder, etc. then that hand is in fact not available to run any light of any kind.

Or if you have a leash attached to your left wrist with a large dog pulling at the end of it.

[Wheeler]

Not that anyone should care, but I'm going to clarify. If you have two hands available to you, then I think you should use your support hand thumb, not trigger finger. If you only have 1 hand available to you, then you gotta do what you gotta do. For hand held, I like the neck index and "Julie" method.

We're back to the Different Strokes For Different Folks. As a lefty I've learned to do a lot of things with my trigger finger that most right handed folks would never conceive. Things like mag releases, closing the cylinder on a revolver, decockers, slide release latches, etc. It's not really that much of a stretch to include engaging the ON/OFF switch on a WML. I suppose it all boils down to a matter of perception.

Chuck brought up some valid points as well, even though you and I aren't members of Door Kickers Anonymous there are still times that we might need to use our support hand for something besides holding onto the gun and flipping on a WML. Doors come to mind first and foremost. If we're in a defensive situation with other folks (family members, friends, etc.) we might want to physically touch them while maintaining light discipline but still have the option of turning the WML on while not breaking physical contact. We might need to pick something up while egressing an area, phone, keys, diaper bag, anniversary present.

I know nothing about the low/no light classes you took. When I took mine I tried to apply my normal activites to the lessons learned in the classes rather than viewing the drills as indicative of my lifestyle and movements.

[LOKNLOD]

Good conversation. I think a huge majority of folks buy a light, slap it on, and never give much thought to how they'd use it (kind of like the rest of the gun, I suppose).

[HopetonBrown]

Respectfully, if you had two hands and you would keep them on the gun, but if you can only one hand available to run the gun you'd then have a light in the other hand?

Not sure you've analyzed that post very well before hitting the go button. If you had the other hand free to run the held held light it would be available to run the light on the gun. If it's opening a closet door, running a shield, hanging on to an attic ladder, etc. then that hand is in fact not available to run any light of any kind.

No, I didn't analyze very well. I got a notification on my phone that my post had been quoted while I was doing something else. I had already been quoted and figured nobody cares what I wrote anyway.