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GJM
09-11-2015, 07:17 PM
I have a Benelli M2 Tactical -- the model with a 18.5 inch barrel and ghost ring sights.

When I shoot this shotgun with slugs, Brenneke and Winchester, after a few shots, the slugs move and start impacting right of POA.

I have heard about issues with Benelli shotguns, that are fixed I believe, by putting the receiver in a jig, and straightening the action. Anyone familiar with this, and does it sound like the symptoms I am experiencing are consistent with this? My other main Benelli M2 does not do this.

SLG
09-11-2015, 09:19 PM
I think you're limp wristing it.

Chris Rhines
09-11-2015, 09:20 PM
I have heard about issues with Benelli shotguns, that are fixed I believe, by putting the receiver in a jig, and straightening the action. Anyone familiar with this, and does it sound like the symptoms I am experiencing are consistent with this?

No. Straightening the barrel (I've never heard of straightening the receiver on an M2, and very much doubt if anyone is doing it,) is done if the POI with slugs is significantly off the POA. What you are describing sounds more like something creeping under recoil, or possibly heat buildup.

Does the impact shift resolve itself if you let the gun cool down?

GJM
09-11-2015, 09:42 PM
Here is the Enos thread on truing the receiver/mag tube:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=181917&hl=%20benelli%20%20jig&page=1

In this instance, it does seem heat related. I need to do more testing. Shot 25 Brenneke and Winchester slugs today.

Dagga Boy
09-12-2015, 08:35 AM
Do you have a magazine clamp on it?

GJM
09-12-2015, 09:22 AM
Do you have a magazine clamp on it?

Nope

SLG
09-12-2015, 09:29 AM
Have you called Benelli?

GJM
09-12-2015, 09:45 AM
Have you called Benelli?

Nope, still gathering data.

I originally got this particular shotgun at the same time as the Beretta. Noticed the POI problem then, and not with the Beretta. Between that and how good the Beretta felt shooting slugs, I just put this Benelli aside. Never noticed the problem with my M2 with the 18 and 14 barrels. That started as their 3 Gun model, and I understand that the shop that does that work uses that jig to align action and mag tube.

GJM
09-12-2015, 01:39 PM
Just in from shooting.

First, I shot my 18 inch M2 (not the problem child) with AO sights (small dot front/V rear) at 25 yards, kneeling, five Brenneke Classic Magnum slugs. Here is the result:

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsund1bhg0.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsund1bhg0.jpg.html)

Next, I grabbed my M2 Tactical (problem child), same position, five of the same lot slugs, same distance. Slugs one and two went into the same group. Slug three quite right, slug four right side of the group, and slug five quite right. Nothing felt weird with the trigger presses.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps42xkhde4.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps42xkhde4.jpg.html)

SLG
09-12-2015, 03:12 PM
Is it really always the same pattern, or is it possible that gun is just less accurate?

Unobtanium
09-12-2015, 03:34 PM
I have a Benelli M2 Tactical -- the model with a 18.5 inch barrel and ghost ring sights.

When I shoot this shotgun with slugs, Brenneke and Winchester, after a few shots, the slugs move and start impacting right of POA.

I have heard about issues with Benelli shotguns, that are fixed I believe, by putting the receiver in a jig, and straightening the action. Anyone familiar with this, and does it sound like the symptoms I am experiencing are consistent with this? My other main Benelli M2 does not do this.
Shotguns are not like rifles. The bullet/slug is still in the bore for about the first 1/2" of recoil. If your body is torquing with the recoil, it's going to print right. You need to lean into it and/or use the push-pull technique. This is why you don't sight a slug-gun in on the bench. It will not shoot that way in the field.

That said, some shotguns are erratic with some slugs, and have weird personalities. I had an M4 that would group Remington Fosters into a fist at 50 yards, no stress. Then I tried the Federal DP True Ball slugs, and it was terrible. Pie-plate. Then I tried DDUPLEX slugs, and it would stack 2-3, and then I'd have a wild flier. Shotguns have personality. Try a different brand of slug before blaming the gun.

GJM
09-12-2015, 03:52 PM
Little bit of supplemental information.

I haven't shot off a bench in years. All shooting was kneeling, using push/pull. I used another 18 inch Benelli, fitted with the same length Comfortech stock, shooting the same distance and method, as a control.

Results were consistent. My good Benelli shoots everything I have tried consistently. The problem Benelli has been consistently problematic with two types of Brenneke full power slugs and Winchester Foster slugs. The problem Benelli seems to be exhibiting behavior that the Enos thread addresses, with the fix being to adjust the receiver/mag tube alignment. Interestingly, I believe my control Benelli had that adjustment as part of becoming a 3 Gun model.

I definitely agree with you that individual shotguns have their own personality, and I have observed that with 870 shotguns as well.

Ultimately, this Benelli is useless to me if it won't shoot Brenneke slugs, as it is a bear gun.

Unobtanium
09-12-2015, 05:59 PM
Little bit of supplemental information.

I haven't shot off a bench in years. All shooting was kneeling, using push/pull. I used another 18 inch Benelli, fitted with the same length Comfortech stock, shooting the same distance and method, as a control.

Results were consistent. My good Benelli shoots everything I have tried consistently. The problem Benelli has been consistently problematic with two types of Brenneke full power slugs and Winchester Foster slugs. The problem Benelli seems to be exhibiting behavior that the Enos thread addresses, with the fix being to adjust the receiver/mag tube alignment. Interestingly, I believe my control Benelli had that adjustment as part of becoming a 3 Gun model.

I definitely agree with you that individual shotguns have their own personality, and I have observed that with 870 shotguns as well.

Ultimately, this Benelli is useless to me if it won't shoot Brenneke slugs, as it is a bear gun.

Sounds like your bases are covered. At this point, I might consider selling it. Just my .02

GJM
09-12-2015, 08:59 PM
This is why I will never give up my lever guns. Just in from shooting my 16.25 barrel .45-70 with Garrett 420+P ammo. This is six shots from three positions -- two kneeling at 50, two sitting at 75 and two sitting at 100. All six from three positions into 3.25 inches, and the four center ones into 1.5 inch. No drama.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg1_zpsx7yevypm.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg1_zpsx7yevypm.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg2_zpsulvzdpic.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg2_zpsulvzdpic.jpg.html)

And I am confident the Garrett load will penetrate anything with four legs, from any angle.

Unobtanium
09-12-2015, 09:27 PM
This is why I will never give up my lever guns. Just in from shooting my 16.25 barrel .45-70 with Garrett 420+P ammo. This is six shots from three positions -- two kneeling at 50, two sitting at 75 and two sitting at 100. All six from three positions into 3.25 inches, and the four center ones into 1.5 inch. No drama.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg1_zpsx7yevypm.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg1_zpsx7yevypm.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg2_zpsulvzdpic.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg2_zpsulvzdpic.jpg.html)

And I am confident the Garrett load will penetrate anything with four legs, from any angle.

http://www.divideyvenceras.es/galeria/memes/challenge-accepted-meme.jpg
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140412215825/starwars/images/8/80/MP-ATAT.png

Seriously though, good shootin!

SLG
09-12-2015, 09:39 PM
Too funny.

GJM
09-14-2015, 02:12 PM
So this morning, I went out in the rain and did some more testing.

First, I put the 14 inch barrel on the "good" control M2 and shot it at 25. It behaved properly.

Then I took the 18 inch barrel with AO sights, that was on the good/control Benelli, and mounted it on the problem M2. To do that, I had to remove the OEM ghost ring rear sight off the receiver. I shot five Winchester Foster and five Brenneke slugs at 25 yards, and did not notice the POI shift as was happening previously. This makes me think it is likely a problem with the original barrel off the M2 tactical.

Finally, I shot my Benelli M2 20 with Brenneke slugs. In case there was any question, it is a delight to shoot compared to the 12 gauge with Brenneke slugs.

GJM
09-14-2015, 03:19 PM
Are you able to put the "bad" barrel on the "good" M2?

I can but it has the tall front sight that comes with the ghost ring equipped Tactical, and now no rear sight, since the "good" M2 doesn't have holes to mount the ghost ring. We have another 14 with ghost rings due any day, and it would be easy to mount the suspect barrel on it.

SLG
09-14-2015, 05:51 PM
I would just get a good .44 and call it a day.:-)

Unobtanium
09-18-2015, 08:10 AM
I would just get a good .44 and call it a day.:-)

I wish Ruger still made that little semi-auto carbine in .44

Hambo
09-18-2015, 11:03 AM
Two questions:

Have you had anyone else shoot the problem M2?

Have you tested it with shot to see if your patterns are creeping to the right?

GJM
09-18-2015, 11:15 AM
Two questions:

Have you had anyone else shoot the problem M2?

Have you tested it with shot to see if your patterns are creeping to the right?

I am out at our remote cabin, with just my wife and dog, and I can't convince either them to shoot it with Brenneke slugs. Given that the problem doesn't exist with my "good" Benelli, or the "bad" Benelli, when I installed another barrel, I am fairly confident the problem relates to that barrel/receiver combination. I did bring out a rail and T1, so I can shoot the bad barrel again and take the ghost ring out of the equation.

I have been meaning to post a picture of my good Benelli with the short barrel. Very handy.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg1_zps2am0r6sb.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg1_zps2am0r6sb.jpg.html)

UNK
09-18-2015, 12:50 PM
When you get back do you have access to a lathe? It would be a simple matter to put an indicator on it and see if it is slightly bent. Heat could amplify the problem. Or maybe roll it on the right side on a relatively flat surface like a kitchen table and see if you can detect a slight bow.

Hambo
09-18-2015, 06:30 PM
I've got OCD when it comes to gun problems, so I would definitely be waiting to test the bad barrel on a known good receiver. I'd also run buck or birdshot through just because I would have to know that it throws everything, not just slugs. Not that it matters, I'd just have to know.

P.E. Kelley
09-18-2015, 07:30 PM
A couple of things.

First the "straightening" is related to the magazine tube. The Guru of the Benelli my friend Kurt Miller built and sold a few jigs to gunsmiths to solve the problem.
However, that is for guns that shoot well off POA all the time. You may have a heat related issue. Try this..tighten your mag tube nut and then back it off 3 or 4 clicks.
Repeat your shooting test. Let us know.

coldcase1984
09-18-2015, 10:31 PM
Who makes the base for the Aimpoint on the Marlin, GJM?

Alsowonder if there' s a thread on your m2-20 bear poppers? Think I saw a picture of one awhile back but my search is like a caveman working an abacus...

There's a 26-in. m2-20 at a local pawnshop and am intrigued by making it a dove popper and game schwacker for my daughter and her still itty bitty son.

GJM
09-18-2015, 10:37 PM
Jim Brockman gave me that small piece of rail to screw onto the receiver of the Marlin and take the T1.

I can't remember what thread the M2 20 got covered in, but I set one up last summer. We cut the barrel to 18.5 and it holds 7+1. Pretty soft shooting with Brenneke slugs.

GJM
09-18-2015, 10:44 PM
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/imagejpg5_zpsed9b9b14.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/imagejpg5_zpsed9b9b14.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/imagejpg2_zps5e891844.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/imagejpg2_zps5e891844.jpg.html)

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/imagejpg1_zpsa7ff78d4.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/imagejpg1_zpsa7ff78d4.jpg.html)

coldcase1984
09-18-2015, 11:08 PM
Did you thread it for chokes or just go Cylinder?

GJM
09-18-2015, 11:14 PM
Cylinder. Slug launcher for us.

GJM
09-19-2015, 07:36 PM
A couple of things.

First the "straightening" is related to the magazine tube. The Guru of the Benelli my friend Kurt Miller built and sold a few jigs to gunsmiths to solve the problem.
However, that is for guns that shoot well off POA all the time. You may have a heat related issue. Try this..tighten your mag tube nut and then back it off 3 or 4 clicks.
Repeat your shooting test. Let us know.

I haven't had a chance to mess with the "bad" Benelli further, although I note it has the OEM extended tube on it. Think I will order the Nordic extension, which I prefer, and then experiment.

I did have a chance to shoot the Benelli M1 Super 90 that lives by the front door of our cabin, loaded with Brenneke slugs. It is the model with open rifle sights. This particular shotgun has sentimental value as it was in the blind with me when I hunted lion. Followed up a lion shot with a .375 with the shotgun in my hands, but it wasn't necessary as the one shot of .375 Trophy Bonded did its thing. I sold the sister shotgun to mine to BOM.

Shot it at 25 yards with Brenneke slugs. Looks like I might need to shave the front sight a smidge.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/image.jpg1_zpsbl5toopm.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/image.jpg1_zpsbl5toopm.jpg.html)

Dagga Boy
09-20-2015, 01:59 PM
My old Benelli M1 with the same sights and brenneke's would do that at 50. As much as we think new is often better and all the ghost rings, etc...in reality those old HK marked M1's with the rifle sights and no accessories on them shot like a house on fire. Sometimes simple works.....