Spotting scope

[nycnoob]

I just signed up for a 600Yard rifle class.
I have to buy a bunch of equipment, but I am most concerned about the spotting scope.
What scope should I buy? any recommendations? I do not want to pay too much for it
because even if I enjoy shooting at 600 Yards I doubt I will have the opportunity to
do it very frequently.

[LittleLebowski]

Do yourself a favor and contact Scott at Liberty Optics (http://www.libertyoptics.com). Call him first, then try email. Tell him Shep sent you. You will be amazed at how much information he will help you with and his prices are some of the best plus he might have a return or second.

I gain nothing by recommending Scott. I just like dealing with him.

[SeriousStudent]

I have also been very pleased with my dealings with Liberty Optics. Service and price are both excellent, and I have purchased three rifle scopes from him.

I have no financial or personal relationship with the firm.

[dgg9]

I just signed up for a 600Yard rifle class.
I have to buy a bunch of equipment, but I am most concerned about the spotting scope.
What scope should I buy? any recommendations? I do not want to pay too much for it.

I'm not an optics expert but you will be hard pressed seeing discrete holes on paper at 600 yds. Mirage alone is significant. I went shopping recently for spotting scopes. That's one area where you absolutely have to pay for quality. I think you'd need a $1k Kowa minimum, though you could pay much more.

Personally I'll just use spatter targets for anything past 100 yds.

[MEH]

Biggest question is what is your budget?

Honestly if it's just for a class, see if you can borrow a scope/stand combo from a local high power shooter. Scopes are just for seeing the spotters at 600 yards and reading the mirage. The good scopes can exceed a thousand dollars (Kowa is the standard). More economical are the Konus and Zhumell scopes.

A decent stand will cost a couple hundred dollars.

[Snapshot]

Agreed re: cost of good scopes and also the usage.

We did a course back to 600 meters using the scopes on our rifles to check our hits, but these were marked with orange spotter discs by the opposite section of the course working in the butts. The instructor had a Kowa 80mm that he used to check the spotters and mirage, but could not see bullet holes at that distance.

For scopes I have had good results with the Pentax 80m and 65mm with the premium eyepieces.

Search "better view desired" for lots of reading on optics.

[Savage Hands]

The new Nightforce TS-80 deserves a hard look, it's great for the money. Just checked it out today.

[Pup town]

I do not want to pay too much for it
because even if I enjoy shooting at 600 Yards I doubt I will have the opportunity to
do it very frequently.



The new Nightforce TS-80 deserves a hard look, it's great for the money. Just checked it out today.


In before someone points out the price, and in before someone else counters with "Buy once, cry once."

------------------------------

Seriously, if you can't borrow something, the Konus 20-60x80mm is exactly what you need. You'll need a better tripod, though.

[SLG]

I can't tell you what to buy/borrow for the class, but I can say that I'm very happy with my Nightforce spotter:-) We got it for game watching, as well as LR shooting. We have a couple other spotters that are well used in professional circles. Neither comes close to the NF in any way except being more portable.

[GLB]

I have been using the Leupold MK 4 Spotting scope for a long time. The one I have now has the TMR reticle. The MK4s are good solid spotters and can be found used for a descent price. Also you will need a good tripod.

[LittleLebowski]

Call Liberty Optics.

[Savage Hands]

I'm biased with my affiliations, but that new Nightforce which targeted Vortex Optics SS in the same price range can head out the door today for $1,547 shipped to most of the country.

[CGA]

Let us know if you settle on anything. I'm interested in scopes as well.

[1slow]

Best I have ever used (as of about 10 years ago) Optolyth floride 100 mm diameter lens 25-60X if memory serves. On a bright day at 500 yards we could see the crosshatch lines on a sight in target.
Huge, heavy, expensive. More of a team scope than a field scope.

[Luke]

Best I have ever used (as of about 10 years ago) Optolyth floride 100 mm diameter lens 25-60X if memory serves. On a bright day at 500 yards we could see the crosshatch lines on a sight in target.
Huge, heavy, expensive. More of a team scope than a field scope.

I googled this, found that model for $2500. $2500 is a lot of money, and I have a crazy cheap junk spotter, but $2500 in the world of good spotters is on the lower end. And if you say it works that good it's a really good deal. Over on sniperhide (awesome LR forum) it's the norm to see $8500 spotting scopes, and at the big extended long range shoots there's a bunch of $12K spotters. So I say $2500 is a good deal of
It's crazy good. Seems like glass is always the most exapensive part.

[nycnoob]

I spoke briefly with Scott at Liberty Optics. We will continue on Monday, it was late on Friday evening
and I have no idea what I am looking for so the conversation was a bit wandery though he is very helpful.
I will update next week when I buy something.


I did find the original text for the course, this has one difference from the class sign up page. The equipment
list for the class contains links to preferred equipment. This is very helpful for just understanding the specs for
the equipment needed, though it does not help for the spotting scope.

http://stevereicherttraining.com/precision-rifle/

[wrmettler]

nycnoob,

Your problem is that if you buy an expensive scope, you might use it once or twice, get dissatisfied for some reason or another, and end up losing money on the initial purchase.
The cheaper the purchase, I think the greater the chance for losing money.

Go to jarheadtop.com. This is Jim Owen's website. He sells Kowa spotting scopes, and has some older scopes. Unfortunately, he doesn't list prices. But, call and find out.
A Kowa scope is a very good scope.
Also, how are you going to use the scope? Will you need a scope stand or are you going to use a tripod?
Something to think about.

I've purchased from Liberty Optics before and Scott is a very nice guy. He has my highest recommendation.
I should have followed his recommendation, but I thought I knew better. Pretty much wrong on that one.

[nycnoob]

I am going to revive this old thread because I found an article that nicely summarized what I have learned about spotting scopes:


http://www.opticsplanet.com/howto/how-to-choose-a-spotting-scope-for-target-shooting-spotting-scope-yardage.html

For the lazy I will include the first two headings though the article continues on:



Up to 100 Yards

Out to 100 yards, you don't need a target shooting spotting scope with a large objective, a lot of magnification or premium grade optics to get the job done. 18-36x or so will be plenty of magnification to see bullet holes at 100 yards and even a good 50mm objective will have enough resolution to see 22 bullet holes. A 60mm, objective, though, will give you more margin for error and still be portable as well as affordable. If you are scoring targets for air rifle or rim fire competition, be sure to check "close focus" or "minimum focus" under a spotting scope's specs. Not all target shooting scopes will focus as close as 33 feet (10m).


Over 100 Yards

Bushnell 15-45x60mm Legend Ultra HD Spotting Scope with ED Prime Glass
Beyond 100 yards, we need to be more selective and here is where optical quality starts to become an issue. Why? As distance increases, we need more magnification to see the target. Obvious. What many shooters don't realize, however, is that as magnification goes up in a spotting scope, the optical demands on the optical system also go up and rather quickly, at that. Most scopes look good at 20x, but as you zoom up in magnification, image quality goes down in all but the very finest (and most expensive) spotting scopes. If you want an image as sharp at 60x as it is at 20x, you will need to pay the price. Otherwise, expect some drop-off in image quality as magnification goes up and expect this drop-off to occur more quickly on a cheap scope. Just because a cheap scope offers the same magnification as the expensive scope doesn't count for much. A blurred image at 30x is only going to get worse at 60x.

Unfortunately, you can't put a number on optical quality. Two scopes can have identical specs, but be totally different in the distances they can handle. It's optical quality at work - how precisely the lenses are ground, the type and quality of the glass used, the lens coatings and the alignment of the optical system to name just a few. It's not just the objective, either. It's the prism system, the way the inside of the scope is baffled to reduce stray light and it is also the eyepiece - the most overlooked part of the system. Premium grade eyepieces cost a small fortune and for good reason. A spotting scope is only as good as its weakest link.

The good news is that most 60mm objective spotting scopes to 80mm objective spotting scopes at $200 and up have enough optical quality to handle 200 yard scoring, assuming reasonable observing conditions. This distance is as much as most shooters need for sighting in and/or to check load performance.


In summary, after 200 yards the demands on the scope increase rapidly and the expense of the scope does as well.
The article spells out the detail, clearly I did not have any idea what I was asking about in my first post.

[nycnoob]

I still have not decided on a scope.

It is hard for me to justify paying $2,000 for a product I have not used before.I would rather start on the low end.
I am not going to that long range shooting class (canceled) and will have little opportunity to shoot beyond 200 yards.
I need a sturdy scope I can drag to the range and I will not get too upset if it gets beatup with use.

Internet reading seems to point to $300 minimum as many are dissatisfied with cheaper scopes though some people do use them. So my new plan is to go talk to the people at http://www.bhphotovideo.com/ they are local so I can talk to the sales people take it home with me
and I can return it if I do not like it. I have next week off so I think I will buy SOMETHING and then drive out to the range and shoot it that day.

I am realizing I will need a complete setup. Some scopes do not include eyepiece or tripod and I will also need to get
a hard case as I tend to pack heavy for range trips. B&H is one stop shopping for all the pieces (bought my pelican cases there)
and they are knowledgeable about the optics as well.