Aftermath?

[GardoneVT]

In light of a tragic incident involving an ordinary business owner killed in a likely revenge attack triggered when he defended himself from a business robbery; I pose this question here .

What should a citizen/LE member do after finding out the guy/girl they shot in self defense is connected to a local ,influential gang / family clan of neer-do-wells?

Take showers with full body armor? Start carrying AR pistols w/reloads under jackets Die Hard style ?

Do nothing besides maintain an ordinary CCW load out?

Contact LE/government agencies and request admission into Witsec?

Move to West Timbuktu and hope for the best?

Mods ,I apologize in advance if this is the wrong area. Given that this is a problem all of us may face someday, I'm interested in what the logically best response to such a problem would be.

[BehindBlueI's]

I have been under credible threat twice, once for bounty (not personal, just due to position) and once for revenge due to an offender's death. The standard advise is increased awareness of surroundings, vary your routes and routines, and "see something/say something" to get uniformed officers there quick to check something out if it doesn't seem right. For about a month I slept with an AR next to the bed in an open Pelican case and during the day closed it and pushed it under the bed. I insisted my wife carry around the house, which is something I do anyway regardless of threat level. I varied my route to work. If it had been an option, I would have sent my family to out of state relatives for awhile. It is very easy when it's not you to say "don't worry, they seldom follow through on these threats". It's quite another when you are the target.

Witness protection is usually not an option for local LE. We don't have the manpower or the resources. You can get extra patrols, you *might* get covert cameras and resources along those lines. Do not expect a bodyguard service or a new identity, though. I don't know what the Feds can and can't do, but we certainly can't.

A lot depends on your own resources, your options to hire security or recruit friends with the relevant skills (such as the vet in our city who smoked a burglar and when he got threats some of his former platoon-mates rolled into town for a bit), combined with the level of credible threat you face. While I'm not 100% in agreement with Gavin De Becker, "The Gift of Fear" is not a bad place to start.

[41magfan]

The main thing is to not make yourself an easy target, regardless of any known threat. In addition to conducting active surveillance on the business, I read somewhere that the gang may have used social media to locate, track and pattern their movements.

I've always believed that anyone really serious about their personal security should live a low profile existence and then ramp things up a few notches in circumstances like this. It might also pay to have alternate living arrangements for some period of time following an incident where retaliation is likely. My activities during the hours of darkness would be VERY deliberate.

If you've never conducted active surveillance on someone, you can't truly appreciate how easy it is to target someone successfully without being detected. All you can do is make yourself a hard target and don't be lackadaisical about anything when you're in an unsecure environment.

Most criminals are lazy - that's why they're criminals. Making things difficult for them goes a long way towards thwarting their plans, which usually aren't very ambitious and generally devoid of contingency.

[LSP552]

I'd add be careful about becoming a target of opportunity while out and about. Lots of folks who wouldn't break into your house at night and kill you, might very well beat you to death if they ran into you in an unplanned target of opportunity setting.

[UNK]

What a crazy and scary topic. I would think start with the basics if they are not already done. Well lit house perimeter. Security including cameras. Fortified points of entrance. Get a dog. Carry a lot of ammo.' Long gun in the car and shotguns stored in multiple locations throughout the house. Turn one room into a safe room. I had never heard this until just the other day while researching safes. This person kept his safe in the master bedroom to serve as cover. In particular he mentioned shooting from behind an open safe door. One guy who used to blog a lot bought shotguns cheaply in pawn shops and kept them on hooks above and inside of closet doors throughout the house.
It will be interesting to see what the experts have to say.
Great Thread!

[Chuck Haggard]

Now you know why when I had one AR and one shotgun, and my duty pistols (broke young copper working extra to keep up with bills, newly married, baby bills, etc.......) my plan was to use the shotgun as my home defense gun, because if I blasted a burglar that was a gangbanger and then later had issues, the AR wasn't the gun in the evidence locker.


Ref how this might go for people; Lance Thomas (https://www.google.com/search?q=lance+thomas&oq=lance+thomas&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.2873j0j8&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8#q=lance+thomas+gunfight)

[Beat Trash]

Good advice given by all so far. I would add that in the situation posed by the OP, I would suggest that all social media accounts such as face book, twitter, etc for all members of the household in question be looked at. Any pictures of family members, any way of using social media sites that can lead individuals to the address of the "target" or identifying the family members should be restricted or closed. While the store owner in question may not post pictures on Facebook, his teenage daughter might.

[Malamute]

Good advice given by all so far. I would add that in the situation posed by the OP, I would suggest that all social media accounts such as face book, twitter, etc for all members of the household in question be looked at. Any pictures of family members, any way of using social media sites that can lead individuals to the address of the "target" or identifying the family members should be restricted or closed. While the store owner in question may not post pictures on Facebook, his teenage daughter might.

In a worst case situation, friends of anyone of interest could potentially be in danger or a weak point in location security.

Its always really baffled me why so many people want to throw all sorts of personal information out on the web.

[Hambo]

First, delete FaceBook and any other social media accounts. Second, immediate relocation. The preferred method of gang retribution here is not to break in and kill someone. They roll up in numbers and shoot into the residence with AR/AK fire. If they are remotely intelligent they'd hit us in the first volley. Third, permanent relocation. For my wife to have any safety at work she would need to change employers. Fortunately that's not hard for her, and we might as well move somewhere else and leave as little trail as we can on the way.

[45dotACP]

Man...sure am glad my job is uh...portable.

I think it would make sense to liken it to hunting, because you are being hunted. An animal that leaves few tracks, doesn't follow the habits and patterns of the rest of the deer, doubles back on its trail to look for hunters, and always circles around before going anywhere can typically catch the scent of the hunter. He also has a pretty good sense of when to GTFO if something doesn't feel right. The sound of a hunter taking an arrow out of quiver may not be enough to spook a younger buck, but then the younger buck is typically ends up in the freezer...

Leave few tracks (manage social media), alter patterns, double back on your trail from time to time, and circle around a bit before going somewhere...you might just find that something doesn't smell right. If it still feels wrong, I'd GTFO...out of state or wherever. You may not think it's dangerous enough to leave your job...hell your job might not be terrible portable, but....

It sure beats ending up in the freezer.

[41magfan]

I offer this in the spirit of "know thy enemy" and it's not meant to derail the thread. But, I thought it may be beneficial as a point of enlightenment to those who don't have any first hand experience in dealing with thugs. Understanding their mindset (or lack thereof) can be a useful arrow in your quiver.

The gang member CURETON mentioned in the affidavit was in jail for the initial robbery and apparently served as the mastermind behind the revenge killings.

http://ftpcontent4.worldnow.com/wbtv/Cureton%20Affidavit.pdf

[Wondering Beard]

That was illuminating, thank you.

[Chuck Haggard]

Thanks for posting that 41mag

[Peally]

Take note that it was 5 months until the revenge killing for the DGU. The victim was armed both times, even at home, and was still killed along with his wife after a weapons malfunction.