LCR 9mm

[JodyH]

Just picked up a Ruger LCR 9mm... because I want one, that's why.
I really like snubbies for pocket carry because the hammerless versions come out of a pocket slicker than any auto due to the rounded humped frame and grip profile.
When I'm driving most of the day a snubby in the pocket is my go to.
Another reason is I have a much larger stock of 9mm FMJ and JHP than I do .38, and the 9mm is usually much cheaper with better availability as well.

I haven't done anything except coon finger the LCR so far, I'll be headed to the range this afternoon.
The trigger is very nice for a factory snubby. I like the trigger better than my S&W 442 w/Apex kit. While the trigger weight and travel are similar, the LCR is much more linear and consistent and doesn't have any hiccups or hitches in it's git a long. The reset is also better than the Apex 442 which just doesn't have quite enough rebound spring IMO.

Size wise the LCR is slightly larger all the way around and a few ounces heavier than the 442, but nothing that makes any difference in my pockets.
The LCR fits into and comes out of my Nemesis pocket holster great. I have a El Paso Saddlery leather pocket holster coming because leather doesn't get as hot and sweaty against my thigh as the rubberized nylon pocket holsters do.
I have some Hogue Piranha G10 Bantam grips coming to trim down the grip profile and slick up the draw some since the rubber grips are a bit large and tend to snag on my pocket lining.

I'm headed to the range with a large assortment of FMJ and JHP to see what shoots closest to POA and if I have any bullet pull issues.
I'll throw out some shooting impressions and info this evening.

[Chuck Haggard]

Interested in hearing more.

[Brian T]

I'd like to know how it goes shooting 147gr ammo, if you have any that is.

[JodyH]

Back from the initial range session with mixed results.

It's 2015, how hard can it be to regulate sights to the most common round for the caliber? How hard is it to get in the same zip code with the most common rounds for the caliber?
I put 135, 124 and 115 grain standard and +P 9mm rounds into nice small groups... 6" below POA at 10 yards.
At 25Y, aiming at the head box resulted in mid to upper A zone body hits on a USPSA target (about a foot low at 25Y).
Windage was dead on, so that's good.
My 442 on the other hand shoots standard pressure 130gr. Winchester JHP's 4"-6" low 25Y and about 1" low at 10Y.
At least the LCR's impacting low, I can always file down the front sight to bring the POI up if there aren't any other front sight options.
Accuracy was very good, 5 rounds into 2" at 10Y was the norm. I'm happy with that out of a brand new snubby.

Extraction was fine with no binding and the moon clips load and unload easily.
All good there.

I did have one round of 115gr Geco fmj that didn't go off on the first hit. The primer dimple looked a little light to me and it's something I'll keep an eye on.
All the other assorted rounds went off no problem.

Bullet pull.
Every ammo tested showed some degree of bullet pull on the 5th round.
It ranged from 1/32" to 1/16", the bullets were still tight enough that I couldn't pull them out with my fingers (even with some wiggling).
Bullet pull does happen, but so far it isn't a show stopper.

The plan for now is to give Ruger a call and see if they have a shorter front sight or if they have another option for raising the POI 12" at 25Y.
I'm also going to get some notoriously hard primered ammo like Wolf and see how hard the hammer hits. If I get a lot of light strikes I'll have Ruger take a look at it.
Right now the LCR 9mm is a work in progress and I'll still be pocketing my 442 until things take a turn for the better.

[UNK]

Out of curiosity Jody, What did the firing pin indent on the factory fired case look like?

[JodyH]

Out of curiosity Jody, What did the firing pin indent on the factory fired case look like?
Heck if I know, I threw it and the lock away before I even left the store.

[Totem Polar]

I'll admit that I was hoping for a better report on the POA/POI front, but not holding my breath. Please feel encouraged to keep us posted as you endeavor to sort that out.

[JodyH]

I took a medium and then a fine cut file and knocked 0.050" off the front sight blade then hit it with a Birchwood Casey "Super Black" touch up pen.
Now with 115gr. standard pressure rounds I'm only 1" low at 10Y.
I'm headed out later when I have more free time to walk it back to 25Y with my 124gr. standard pressure Speer GDHP's to see what the POA/POI is.
I don't mind 2" or 3" low at 25Y out of a snubby, the 0.050" should get me well within that.
If I can find some 147gr. HST that should get me dead on hopefully.

[jh9]

Hilariously, my .38 LCR was ~8-10" high at 7y with 158gr bullets (standard weight .38). A 6'o'clock hold with 125gr gold dots was right on. I'd imagine 110gr bullets would have been poi/poa.

Even more hilariously, my 1984 colt agent is almost identical. I would have thought that one was well and truly regulated for 158gr bullets, given its age.

[JodyH]

Much better range session today.
My preferred POA/POI is the top dead center of the front sight at 25Y.
Standard 115gr. Geco FMJ was dead on a 10Y and still dead on at 25Y.
Standard pressure 124gr. Speer GDHP's were 1" high at 10Y and 2"-3" high at 25Y.
It looks like shaving 0.050" off the front sight was just what it needed. Now I just need to put some fluorescent orange paint on the front blade and it'll be perfect.
Later I may square off the shooter side of the front sight a bit for a sharper/brighter sight picture but it's good for now.

No light primer hits, all the brass showed solid, deep firing pin impacts.

The Geco FMJ rounds show very little to no bullet pull, which is good for practice ammo.
I'm still looking for some HST or Ranger 147gr. JHP to try out, but for now the standard pressure 124gr. Gold Dots are fine.

I'm feeling better about the LCR.
After another couple hundred trouble free rounds I'll probably start tossing it in my pocket regularly.

9mm is considerably more "frisky" out of a J frame than .38 +P.
I'm going to have to work on getting a much better grip out of the pocket than I'm used to with the 442.
You can't get sloppy on the grip with 9mm or .357 if you want fast followup shots out of these little revolvers.

[Frank R]

http://www.frontiernet.net/~akim/

Don't know if you've tried them, but the Mika Pocket Holster has worked well for me with my LCR.

[jc000]

Thanks for the write-up, please keep 'em coming.

I'd sort of moved away from the idea of picking one of these up, but with the warmer weather picking up it's been on my mind.

[Hambo]

Hmmm. Sights can be changed, but bullet pull is disconcerting.

[JodyH]

Bullet pull is the nature of the beast with auto rounds in a lightweight revolver. The 9mm evolved to be supported in a magazine, not free in a open ended cylinder. They aren't crimped like revolver rounds usually are.

[GJM]

Jody, thanks for your info in this thread.

When the dust settles, do you think the advantages of the 9mm cartridge outweigh the negatives of its use in a revolver?

[JodyH]

Depends on ammo availability in your area. Around here .38 is nearly impossible to find and I don't shoot enough of it to justify shipping expense unless it's tacked on to a big 9mm order. Thought I'd try and cut down the logistics a bit.
Now that I found a fmj that has no bullet pull and a jhp with very little pull I'm liking it. The moon clips are an advantage over speed loaders too.
I'd prefer .38 if it was available on a regular basis. I'd choose 9mm over .357 because of price/round and the magnum is just plain violent out of a snub.

[Hambo]

Bullet pull is the nature of the beast with auto rounds in a lightweight revolver. The 9mm evolved to be supported in a magazine, not free in a open ended cylinder. They aren't crimped like revolver rounds usually are.

I understand the difference in crimp. When 300gr .44 bullets came out I immediately started loading them, and locked up a SA revolver when one jumped the crimp. This may or may not be an issue in the LCR (I'm guessing the cylinder is .357 length), but that's my concern.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

San Antonio has tons of standard cheap range 38 SPL at the big box stores. Just info, if one is in the area. Probably the same in El Paso.

[Chuck Haggard]

I note that the Critical Defense and Duty 9mm loads are listed as being crimped. Might be worth a look.

[LSP972]

I note that the Critical Defense and Duty 9mm loads are listed as being crimped. Might be worth a look.

Probably still gonna jump some. By necessity, rimless cartridges use a taper crimp instead of a roll crimp.

I recall this being a bit of an issue with the half-dozen or so S&W 940s that showed up at in-service for several years. The "duty" rounds (1st gen 147gr Hydra-Shoks) did it just as bad as the training ball. IIRC, Blazer aluminum ball was the worst.

.

[Jared]

Jody,

You aren't helping my checking account at all with this.

How much "worse" is the recoil from this LCR9 vs a J-frame with, say 148 gr wadcutters? How does it compare to some of the micro 9mm semi-auto's?

[JodyH]

The standard pressure 124 Speer Gold Dot 9mm recoil is equivalent to 130gr. +P Winchester Ranger .38's.
To me the revolver has more recoil than a Kahr PM9 shooting the same ammo, despite the fact they have identical loaded weights.
The action of the slide spreads the recoil out over a longer duration making it seem lighter.

[GunRacer]

The standard pressure 124 Speer Gold Dot 9mm recoil is equivalent to 130gr. +P Winchester Ranger .38's.
To me the revolver has more recoil than a Kahr PM9 shooting the same ammo, despite the fact they have identical loaded weights.
The action of the slide spreads the recoil out over a longer duration making it seem lighter.

This has been my experience as well. The recoil is sharper than a Kahr PM9 with the same ammo. Overall, though, I am still pleased with my 9mm LCR and carry it daily. I carry it in a PCS "No-see-um", which is boned on the inside and flat on the outside. Mine has a forward cant for front pocket carry in khakis. I definitely recommend getting the factory boot grip as it is much more concealable. It's also smooth, so it doesn't grab your pocket.

I'd say the 9mm LCR is a good buy. It was a better choice for me than a M642/442 because of the ammo situation.

[Chuck Haggard]

Probably still gonna jump some. By necessity, rimless cartridges use a taper crimp instead of a roll crimp.

.

Those are some of the very few 9mm rounds using a bullet with a cannelure, hence me thinking they might, maybe, work a bit better.

[LSP972]

Those are some of the very few 9mm rounds using a bullet with a cannelure, hence me thinking they might, maybe, work a bit better.

Well, think about that for a minute. Cannelures, if rolled into the case AFTER the bullet is seated, do indeed help "hold" the bullet in place until ignition.

OTOH, a bullet with a cannelure is still just a bullet; one that requires case tension to hold it.

Cannelured bullets are the New Grail (as opposed to bonded cores) for keeping bullets intact while passing through barriers. Its the 'secret' to the HST's superior performance... Federal got it right on that one.

.

[Chuck Haggard]

Well, think about that for a minute. Cannelures, if rolled into the case AFTER the bullet is seated, do indeed help "hold" the bullet in place until ignition.

OTOH, a bullet with a cannelure is still just a bullet; one that requires case tension to hold it.

Cannelured bullets are the New Grail (as opposed to bonded cores) for keeping bullets intact while passing through barriers. Its the 'secret' to the HST's superior performance... Federal got it right on that one.

.

Yeah, people have discovered "CorLokt" all over again.

[ScotchMan]

Jody, any additional insights on the LCR? I have been somewhat interested in one for a while, and this thread revitalized that interest. Basically, my thoughts mirror your first post. I end up with a J-frame often enough that having it shoot the same bullits as my primary guns is very attractive.

Has it replaced your 442 yet? Why or why not? How are the moon clips? I have heard they are difficult to work with, may not hold up well, etc.

I'm also curious about the terminal ballistics of the LCR in 9mm. This may be outside the scope of this thread. Barrel length shouldn't be a huge issue; you figure 3" in a gun like the CM9 or P938, which includes the chamber so we'll subtract 1.1" for the OAL of a 9mm cartridge, and you're right around the 1.875" of the LCR. But that is already on the very low end of 9mm velocities, and then you add the cylinder gap. I imagine that might be beyond the velocity envelope that most JHPs were designed for.

I have a lot of faith in my 135gr Short Barrel Gold Dots, but I have never seen the 9mm Short Barrel Gold Dot that I have read exists. I'm not entirely convinced that if I stuff some 147gr Gold Dots or Critical Duties in there (my normal load), that I'm going to get what I'm looking for. Might be interesting to shoot a few different common service rounds into gelatin/water/newspaper/ultra-realistic zombie simulator/etc and see what happens.

[JodyH]

I carried my 442 over spring break, but that's because I still don't have enough rounds downrange with the LCR to 100% trust it yet.
In my experience moon clips are fine as long as your careful loading and unloading them and don't step on them.
Everything I've read shows the LCR giving higher velocities than the Kahr PM with the same ammo.

[ScotchMan]

Thanks. Keep us updated. That's interesting about the velocity..

[jc000]

What's "bullet pull"?

[1slow]

Bullet Pull: bullet comes forward like it is coming out of the case. Very light revolvers in service calibers tend to act like inertia bullet pullers.

[Dave J]

What's "bullet pull"?

Forward movement of the bullet(s) in the unfired cylinders, caused by the inertia of the bullet overcoming the crimp/neck tension under recoil. Usually seen in lightweight revolvers with hot loads.

[Gary1911A1]

I'm purchasing a LCR from a family member who needs the money for bills. I've never even shot a LCR so this should be interesting. Here is a link to a book some will find helpful.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/1581605714/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=2XGLULLDY4HA1&coliid=IX02HZ3XB5TSO

[jc000]

Thanks 1slow / Dave J.

[JodyH]

Fired off another 100 rounds today.
50 RWS Geco FMJ
50 Speer 115 GDHP
No problems, very little bullet pull (1/32" or so on the GDHP's).

There is a small screw on the underside of the cylinder release button that must be backed out and blue Lock-Tite added to it then screwed back in.
After the last range session mine was backing itself out and in another cylinder or two would have disappeared.
I did not remove it completely (because I don't really know what it's holding together) but I did expose a lot of threads and added the Lock-Tite.
Today it remained tight.
On the forums this is a known issues and the recommended fix.

I also added some "Glow-On" fluorescent pink glow in the dark paint over a while Testors base coat to the front sight, then added a protective layer of clear nail polish.
The hot pink really shows up in the daylight and when moving into shadows from the sunlight or after charging with a light the pink glows really brightly.
Good ghetto "evening sights".


http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p82/JodyHuggins/20150409_200642-1_zpssqu7mkwp.jpg http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p82/JodyHuggins/20150409_200716-1_zpsankq2qkd.jpg

[JodyH]

I added the same Glow-On (http://glow-on.com/) paint to my 442 and it rocks on it as well.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

http://glow-on.com/how-it-works.html

Their picture of the eye is incorrect, they have the optic nerve as the center of vision. That's the blind spot. That would be bad to be the center of vision. It is off to the side of the fovea.

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

Jody,

If/when you feel comfortable enough to carry the LCR, are you planning on carrying a reload? If so, how? I haven't really seen any options for carrying moon clips other than a belt pouch or an open-topped OWB set-up.

[MGW]

I had a 442 pro that was cut for moonclips. I played around with reloads and just went back to speed strips. Speedloader are mostly uncomfortable to pocket carry and don't carry easily anywhere else.

As far as the LCR goes, I would load it with a moonclip and carry speed strips. The likelihood of having time to reload once is really low. Being able to reload twice probably won't happen ever.

That's what autos are for [emoji1]

[NEPAKevin]

Not Jody, and I do not have any hands on experience with them, but Del Fatti leather makes a couple of carriers for j-frame sized moon clips.
Pocket (http://www.delfatti.com/PMC%20Page.html)
Belt (http://www.delfatti.com/photos/photos/246.jpg)

[tmoore912]

Grant Cunningham has Crossbread Holster making a speedloader holder (http://www.crossbreedholsters.com/HotcakesStore/ProductViewer/tabid/113/slug/Speedloader-Case/Default.aspx) for him.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmxSYVHKRFQ

[TexasShooter]

I want to try the 9mm. I love my LCR357.

[LSP972]

I love my LCR357.

Well, one learns something new every day; I never realized you had masochistic tendencies.;)

And I indeed should have made time for you to shoot my HK45C in Texas. We need more Dark-Siders around here...:cool:

.

[WoodLark]

I carry a moon clip reload in a 35mm film canister in my weak side front pocket. Works great; I can just flip it open with my thumb.

[JodyH]

One thing I've noticed with the LCR, you can short stroke the trigger reset fairly easily at speed.
There's a false reset "hiccup" in the trigger that'll leave you stranded between chambers if you're not careful.
I haven't taken it apart yet or researched to see if there's a stronger rebound spring available.

[Whiskey_Bravo]

I played with an LCR 357 today in a local shop. This was my first time handling a LCR and the false reset was noticeable as Jody H mentioned. I am super revolver newb, do the J Frames have a similar issue?

[LSP972]

Nope.

.

[JR1572]

JodyH, how is the 9mm LCR holding up?

JR1572

[breakingtime91]

^^^^^^ya, thinking of getting a light weight revolver again. Not really interested in 38 special anymore because of the price and rarity around me. How is the 9mm lcr holding up?

[JodyH]

That false reset, cylinder skip was a deal breaker for me.
I keep the LCR around for playing with at the range but will only carry S&W J's.
The LCR does shoot fine and has held up... but that damn trigger.

[SteveB]

Not Jody, and I do not have any hands on experience with them, but Del Fatti leather makes a couple of carriers for j-frame sized moon clips.
Pocket (http://www.delfatti.com/PMC%20Page.html)
Belt (http://www.delfatti.com/photos/photos/246.jpg)

I have used these for years; they are excellent.

4726

[GJM]

I shot my new Ruger LCR 9mm this afternoon. Used the Bill Rogers grips he designed, and liked them. Bill said the LCR 9 is POA/POI at 25 yards with 147 grain ammo, and he was right. 115 PMC hit low, but the 147 Atlanta Arms I tried, was POA/POI at 25 yards, making hits on an eight inch steel at 25 yards predictable. The LCR 9 felt significantly softer shooting and easier to shoot at 25 than I experience with a Smith J frame and 38 ammo.

[98z28]

Softer shooting than a j-frame with 38's? Very interesting. I've never shot a 9mm revolver, but I've always heard they are challenging because 9mm is quite hot coming out of a little wheel gun. I might have to try out a LCR.

I shot my new Ruger LCR 9mm this afternoon. Used the Bill Rogers grips he designed, and liked them. Bill said the LCR 9 is POA/POI at 25 yards with 147 grain ammo, and he was right. 115 PMC hit low, but the 147 Atlanta Arms I tried, was POA/POI at 25 yards, making hits on an eight inch steel at 25 yards predictable. The LCR 9 felt significantly softer shooting and easier to shoot at 25 than I experience with a Smith J frame and 38 ammo.

[GJM]

Softer shooting than a j-frame with 38's? Very interesting. I've never shot a 9mm revolver, but I've always heard they are challenging because 9mm is quite hot coming out of a little wheel gun. I might have to try out a LCR.

I shot PMC 115 and Atlanta Arms 147. Both loads were significantly softer shooting than my S&W 340. I want to try HST 147 in the LCR next.

[Eastex]

I've only seen them in pictures, but do you think the Rogers grips would work for pocket carry? With the standard grips the LCR was pushing the limits size wise for me anyway.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[GJM]

I've only seen them in pictures, but do you think the Rogers grips would work for pocket carry? With the standard grips the LCR was pushing the limits size wise for me anyway.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

They are thinner than the OEM grips. As they are hard plastic not rubber, they slide better in a pocket. They do seem a tad longer, though. Guess it depends on your pockets.

[Eastex]

Thanks, I thought they looked thinner.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[GJM]

Here is a link to the grips, moon clip holder and pocket holster Bill Rogers uses with the LCR:


https://holsterops.com/search?q=LCR


Sent from my iPhone

[Kirk]

Ordered.

Just picked mine up yesterday before reading this thread. Random, bUT very helpful

[GJM]

Where are folks getting their moon clips?

[LtDave]

Softer shooting than a j-frame with 38's? Very interesting. I've never shot a 9mm revolver, but I've always heard they are challenging because 9mm is quite hot coming out of a little wheel gun. I might have to try out a LCR.

Wow. I have a 940 Smith and find it pretty unfun to shoot compared to even a Model 37 with +P.

[Dave Williams]

Maybe it's the Rogers grips?

[GJM]

I have some HST 147 ammo inbound, and will see what that feels like in it.

[SLG]

Wow. I have a 940 Smith and find it pretty unfun to shoot compared to even a Model 37 with +P.

That's basically what I told GJM, and he thought the 9 was better. Made me curious.

I generally dislike any auto cartridge in a revolver though. The recoil impulse is just different, even if it is light.

[314159]

I really like how smooth the LCR trigger feels. However, I would cheerfully give up a few pounds of pull weight to get a stronger trigger return. I seem to recall Jerry Miculek saying a strong trigger return was pretty important...

So, does anyone offer a stronger trigger return spring for the LCR, or work on them internally to improve the reset?

[jeep45238]

Necro-post here....

Has anybody put a fiber or night sight on their 9mm? All the options I'm finding are for .38/.357 and state that the POA/POI will be off dramatically.

I did find last night that the factory moonclips are pretty delicate - dropped one loaded and it bent pretty bad, will only hold 4 rounds now. I've regulated the Rugers to range only now since they're so easy to unload, and the Speedbeez are a bit more sturdy while being much cheaper.

The Speedbeez clips are solid, and are still easy to load and come with a demooner for stubborn cases (packs of 10/20/50 on amazon https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00VKQUOUY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 )

[rathos]

My buddy put the xs sight on it. Wasn't too bad out to 15 yards, we hadn't shot it further than that.


Necro-post here....

Has anybody put a fiber or night sight on their 9mm? All the options I'm finding are for .38/.357 and state that the POA/POI will be off dramatically.

I did find last night that the factory moonclips are pretty delicate - dropped one loaded and it bent pretty bad, will only hold 4 rounds now. I've regulated the Rugers to range only now since they're so easy to unload, and the Speedbeez are a bit more sturdy while being much cheaper.

The Speedbeez clips are solid, and are still easy to load and come with a demooner for stubborn cases (packs of 10/20/50 on amazon https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00VKQUOUY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 )