Girsan Regard Yavuz Compact - Beretta 92 Clone

[Clobbersaurus]

I've been lusting after a Beretta Centurion for a while now. They are as rare as an honest politician up here, so I decided to pick up a Girsan Regard Yavuz "Compact" to play with. Girsan is a Turkish company that makes a variety of firearms, including Beretta clones. Apparently their Beretta 92 clones are made on older Beretta machines and tooling. Not sure of the whole history there, but they also supply pistols to the Turkish military.

Here's the stuff it comes with:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03720_zps24361c41.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03720_zps24361c41.jpg.html)

Quality seems quite good, considering you can pick them up brand new for $450 CAN. Machining looks as good as my Beretta.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/148ef756-3979-4711-9a85-ceea1db0da63_zpsa6ab7717.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/148ef756-3979-4711-9a85-ceea1db0da63_zpsa6ab7717.jpg.html)

These are "F" model clones, note the differences in the slides. Top slide is the Beretta, and yes it's dirty.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/03b7de77-120b-4f62-8b26-5acee65345bb_zps62891d9b.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/03b7de77-120b-4f62-8b26-5acee65345bb_zps62891d9b.jpg.html)

Note the older style locking block. Beretta on the left.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/9a8d8655-7089-46dd-a778-ef2008a42e1c_zps178f9248.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/9a8d8655-7089-46dd-a778-ef2008a42e1c_zps178f9248.jpg.html)

The inside of the Girsan was dirty from test rounds (I guess). The barrel and slide rails had some dried up yellow lube that doesn't easily come off. The gun was bone dry, but I fixed that with some G96. Girsan barrel on the bottom. Note the yellow filth.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03727_zps8bc11760.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03727_zps8bc11760.jpg.html)

Girsan recoil spring and guide rod on the bottom. Unlike new Beretta's, the Girsan's internal parts are all steel. Looking at YOU Beretta. Note how short the Girsan recoil spring is. Not sure what to think of that, but I'll just shoot it and see what happens.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03726_zpsad0e584b.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03726_zpsad0e584b.jpg.html)

The finger grooves on the Girsan don't bother me. The Girsan grips are slippery though and VZ grips don't quite fit. The grip screw holes are slightly out of spec on the Girsan. Making the VZ grips fit should be fairly easy, the holes are just a few mm out.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03733_zpsf985671e.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03733_zpsf985671e.jpg.html)

The Girsan sights are horrid. Girsan on the right. I fixed them as best I could with some paint...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03736_zpsb8e510ff.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03736_zpsb8e510ff.jpg.html)

The Beretta Centurion length guns are not that compact. I guess they are compact for a Beretta...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03738_zpsb02d9011.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03738_zpsb02d9011.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/84ce4fc1-ca07-485a-b169-b6a26de04036_zpse765488f.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/84ce4fc1-ca07-485a-b169-b6a26de04036_zpse765488f.jpg.html)

The mags that came with the gun are Mec-Gar, and look exactly the same as my Beretta Mec-Gar mags. I replaced the mainspring with a D spring, and did Wilson's "virtual" trigger job. The Girsan's trigger pull may be slightly better than my Elite now. Hard to tell, but it's more than acceptable.

2000 round challenge starts now.

[5pins]

This should be interesting. Looking forward to the results.

[JV_]

The finger grooves were an odd addition.

[Clobbersaurus]

The finger grooves were an odd addition.

Yeah, I though so too. I don't really feel them when I grip the gun though.

[Comedian]

How was the trigger before you put the D spring in? Smooth, heavy?

[Clobbersaurus]

How was the trigger before you put the D spring in? Smooth, heavy?

It wasn't bad at all. Smooth and consistent, not overly heavy.

[Clobbersaurus]

Encountered problem #1.

Did about 15 minutes of dry fire tonight and noticed the extractor pin had popped up slightly in the slide. The pin hole wasn't staked. I could easily push it back down with my thumb. I'll lightly stake it and keep an eye on it.

[45dotACP]

Interesting....I'd like to see how it goes, but that doesn't sound like an ideal start :(

[BigT]

The finger grooves were an odd addition.

My guess is that it reduces necessary machining. I've seen so 80 odd % Vektor SP1 frames and they had similar grooves on them. Just a guess as I said.

[Clobbersaurus]

I staked the extractor pin tonight. I did another 15 minutes of dry fire and had no further issues.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03747_zps558ad18d.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03747_zps558ad18d.jpg.html)

[Clobbersaurus]

I put 170 rounds through the gun today. 150 rounds AE 124g and 20 rounds 125g cast handloads.

0 problems. The grips are slippery and the front sight paint wore off. The sights tracked well and it shot very smoothly. So far, so good.

Here were the first ten rounds out of the gun, 25 yards freestyle unsupported:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03750_zps5e9c2924.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03750_zps5e9c2924.jpg.html)

[farscott]

Very interesting clone. It looks like it uses the original 92F design, not the 92FS, based on the pictures showing the rear of the slide and slide internals. That, combined with the original locking block design and all steel parts, does suggest the gun is based on the older Beretta tooling or on reverse-engineering of a 92F.

For the cost, it looks like a great pistol. Unfortunately, it appears that they will no longer be imported into the USA, possibly due to infringing upon Beretta's IP.

[Clobbersaurus]

I know nothing of Beretta's agreement with Girsan. I really wanted a Beretta Centurion, and couldn't find one. Money wasn't a factor, it was availability.

If Beretta came out with a brand new Centurion length 92G with front and rear grip serations and removable front sight....I'd donate my Girsan to some needy shooter and forget I ever purchased it...

[ReverendMeat]

What's the appeal of the Centurion? I've never shot or handled one.

[Trooper224]

What's the appeal of the Centurion? I've never shot or handled one.

It's the Colt Commander of Beretta Land.

[Clobbersaurus]

What's the appeal of the Centurion? I've never shot or handled one.

The slide length is shorter. :)

My other Beretta is an Elite II, which has the heavier Brigadier slide. I wanted to see how well the Centurion length Beretta shot with the shorter, lighter slide.

[Clobbersaurus]

I put a pair of VZ grips I had lying around on the Girsan tonight. I had to do some fitting to get the grips to work, but they offer better texture than the slippery stock grips. It boggles the mind why VZ would not texture the upper part of the grip. It's just weird. I also installed some grip tape. I had good success with grip tape wrapped under the grips on a 1911, so hopefully they stay put. It felt OK in dry fire tonight.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03752_zpsxgbkhaoa.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03752_zpsxgbkhaoa.jpg.html)

I repainted the front sight as the "black with orange dot" that I painted was not durable and the sight picture wasn't great. I like the front sight below much better and the orange Tremclad is much more durable than the black paint I had on it before. I shoot the dot with my Beretta's, so we'll see how I do at 25 yards tomorrow. The only thing that bugs me about a orange front sight is the lack of definition on the sides of the sight as it sits in the rear notch.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03753_zps7u5hfvoo.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03753_zps7u5hfvoo.jpg.html)

[Clobbersaurus]

A few weeks ago I installed a 13lb mainspring in the Girsan. It lightened the trigger considerably.

I was able to put another 200 rounds through it today, shooting AE 124g. The 13lb mainspring worked very well with no hint of light primer strikes. I have thousands of trigger presses, hundreds of reloads and presentations from the holster with the Girsan. I'm 570 rounds into the 2000 round challenge with no issues to report.

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03765_zpsjx6lxrwd.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03765_zpsjx6lxrwd.jpg.html)

[Clobbersaurus]

Update:

At around the 1000 round mark I started having intermittent failures to feed and inconsistent ejection. Wanting to finish the test, I cleaned the mags (which were quite filled with sand a grit) and tried it again on the next range session. I again had numerous issues, so I called the 2000 round test a fail at 1260 rounds. It's just too brutal to suffer through the malfunctions. One can only drill malfunctions so much.:mad:


I finally got around to cleaning the Girsan. It was filthy dirty and dry as a bone. I mean, there wasn't a hint of lubrication on the pistol. I had soaked it generously in G96 before the test but my daily dry fire and handling of the gun, coupled with the 1260 rounds resulted in no lube to be found anywhere...

Here are some pics:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03816_zpsbnvo1jue.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03816_zpsbnvo1jue.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03818_zpsywvoqpnw.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03818_zpsywvoqpnw.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03827_zpsqhhtkgrr.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03827_zpsqhhtkgrr.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03824_zpstfjedcnp.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03824_zpstfjedcnp.jpg.html)

The rails have some wear marks, which I don't have on my Beretta, and the Beretta has many more rounds through it:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03822_zpsbbt6gykj.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03822_zpsbbt6gykj.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03821_zpsw5inqewi.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03821_zpsw5inqewi.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03820_zpsoyemu2qf.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03820_zpsoyemu2qf.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03819_zpsn3w0bzga.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03819_zpsn3w0bzga.jpg.html)

After it's dirty dirty photo shoot, I soaked in in G96 for 24 hours and cleaned it. I didn't remove the extractor and clean it because 1200 rounds should not be enough to dirty the extractor sufficiently to cause the erratic problems I was having. I lubed the heck out of it and then shot it on a pistol course I attended last weekend. I put 300 rounds through it on the first day without any problems whatsoever.

Conclusion: I think the Girsan is a reasonably solid pistol for the price. I like the size of the gun. It likes to be wet. I think my aggressive dry fire schedule, coupled with the lack of cleaning, caused the gun to become too dry and that caused the problems. Perhaps a better lube, like fire clean or a synthetic motor oil would work better. I tend to believe that despite the filth, if I had simply lubed the gun every thousand rounds or so, it would still be chugging along. The gun shot well with the 13lb MS with a variety of ammo and really helped clean up the trigger. If Girsan lost the finger humps, did some front and back strap checkering, made it a G model with a replaceable front sight...they would have one hell of a carry/competition gun. (BERETTA?? GIRSAN?? C'mon guys get this done already!!).

[Clay]

Thanks for the update. I'd say this gun may need to be lubricated more often, or lubricated with a grease that is appropriate for the temps you are in. Certainly a lot of wear is visible.

[Clobbersaurus]

Thanks for the update. I'd say this gun may need to be lubricated more often, or lubricated with a grease that is appropriate for the temps you are in. Certainly a lot of wear is visible.

Yeah, I may try fire clean at some point, though the city I live in enjoys fairly mild year round temperatures. Think Seattle, but with less rain.

[NuJudge]

I will be really interested in what round count you get on the locking block. I have heard some people say they attribute longer locking block life at least in part to better lubrication.

[Clobbersaurus]

I intend to keep shooting it, so I'll give you an update if it fails.

[farscott]

For lubricating the rails, a grease like Lubriplate 105 would be good. If you are concerned about the grease migrating, you can opt for one with "tackifiers" added, like Slide Glide. Lubriplate 105 is the grease SIG has long used and recommended, and a 92-series is not much different. It is primarily a grease used for engine assembly and is meant to reduce friction before oil is pumped between the sliding surfaces.

[vminrio]

Hi, Greetings from New Mexico, USA

I'm wondering how this gun has been working for you since your last post on it? I just bought the Chiappa-Girsan version a few days ago but I haven't had a chance to go shoot it yet. (..hopefully this weekend if the weather is good..) Mine is an all blued version with some basic Hogue grips added on, but all of the mechanicals look the same. Sure can't beat the price..

Based upon your experiences I'm thinking Outer's gun grease on the rails and Lucas oil in the guts.. Any thoughts here?

Best Wishes!

[Clobbersaurus]

The Girsan works perfectly now. I cleaned and lubed it after the test and then ran it for part of a course, putting about 300 rounds through it with no further issues. I think they are well built guns. I would be surprised if you have any issues with yours. One thing to note is that the Girsan 92 series clones are "F" model clones, as opposed to the Beretta "FS" redesign.

Regarding lube, I have had good success with Lucas Red "N" Tacky #2 grease. There is a lot more info for you in the link below:

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?17768-Beretta-92D&highlight=centurion

[vminrio]

My son and I managed to get out today and put about 300 rounds through the new gun. We shot 200 rounds of Winchester White Box with no problems. We also shot 100 reloads of 115 grain Berry's round nose with 6 grains of Accurate No. 5. (..it seemed to be burning very dirty.. I'm thinking I must have used the wrong primers..) Among those we had 2 stovepipes. So far I am very pleased and I agree with you that they are well built guns.

Thanks for the link & info on lubes. Happy shooting!

[Clobbersaurus]

My son and I managed to get out today and put about 300 rounds through the new gun. We shot 200 rounds of Winchester White Box with no problems. We also shot 100 reloads of 115 grain Berry's round nose with 6 grains of Accurate No. 5. (..it seemed to be burning very dirty.. I'm thinking I must have used the wrong primers..) Among those we had 2 stovepipes. So far I am very pleased and I agree with you that they are well built guns.

Thanks for the link & info on lubes. Happy shooting!
Hmm, did you lube the gun? Beretta's run like a top when wet.

[vminrio]

Based on one of your earlier posts I left it pretty wet. When we first got started I was thinking it might have gone over board with the lube but quickly realized that it probably could have stood a little more.. Lucas Gun Oil in the guts and Outer's gun grease on the rails. All in all I'm very pleased. I think the stovepipes were my fault..
5716

[vminrio]

Last weekend I put another 450 rounds through the gun with absolutely no problems. (..now have 750 total..) Love the gun and the price.;)

[robertbank]

What holster are using for the Girsan? I have the railed version of the Compact.

Take Care

Bob

[Clobbersaurus]

Because I shoot an Elite II I go with a full size Brigadier holster and use it for all my Beretta's. It works fine if you torque down the adjustment screw.

You might be able to get away with a 92A1 holster with your railed version, but the rail is totally different on the Girsan. You could check out Soley Canadian Holsters in Canada and talk to Tim, he may be able to help you out. Girsan clones are pretty popular here and he may have one in his mold collection.