Damage to Shotgun Magazine Tubes

[Tamara]

I've gotta say that the "Mag tube can get dented, rendering the shotgun useless!" thing smells to me like a gunwriter needed to balance out a list of "Pros & Cons" or get another fifty words into a column to make length. Has that EVER happened in a civilian self-defense shooting? That just sounds so Argumentum ad feces fabricatum. :o

[WDW]

I've gotta say that the "Mag tube can get dented, rendering the shotgun useless!" thing smells to me like a gunwriter needed to balance out a list of "Pros & Cons" or get another fifty words into a column to make length. Has that EVER happened in a civilian self-defense shooting? That just sounds so Argumentum ad feces fabricatum. :o

For real!! We had a Mossy 500 in our truck basically an entire deployment & that thing got dropped, stepped on, and had countless heavy things thrown on it & that never happened to it. That just seems highly unlikely, especially in somebody's house.

[NH Shooter]

...Argumentum ad feces fabricatum. :o

Cool Latinese, Tamara - I've got to remember that phrase!

[Chuck Haggard]

We have over 150 Mossbergs in the inventory, almost all of them racked in the cars. Some are breaching guns, some are dedicated range guns. All of them are abused, badly.

I have not yet seen a bent mag tube.

[UNK]

Hmmm fabricatum?
Brownells doesn't seem to think so.
Heres a tool.
http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/shotgun-tools/straighteners-dent-raisers/magazine-tube-dent-raiser-prod25276.aspx

and heres the video to accompany the tool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCqI_KQNDVM
I agree that it was a little too strongly worded. I imagine you could still feed shells one at a time as a last ditch effort.



I've gotta say that the "Mag tube can get dented, rendering the shotgun useless!" thing smells to me like a gunwriter needed to balance out a list of "Pros & Cons" or get another fifty words into a column to make length. Has that EVER happened in a civilian self-defense shooting? That just sounds so Argumentum ad feces fabricatum. :o

[NH Shooter]

BrianB, the tool linked to at Brownells is intended for removing the factory dimples (used for retaining the stock spring keeper) when installing a magazine extension.

Your next post (from Doc) is a good summation of what has been discussed so far and one that I wholly concur with.

[Tamara]

Hmmm fabricatum?
Brownells doesn't seem to think so.
Heres a tool.

Yeah, I've seen the tool. Had one at work, most of the places I've worked. I think I've even seen it used once in all those years, when pawpaw's family heirlump duck gun got run over.

Seriously, there must be a million more plausible things to worry about.

EDIT: I didn't go look, but he was talking about the Remington mag dimple tool? LOLz. I thought he was talking about the rod mandrel thingy Shannon used to fix that one mag tube....

[UNK]

Heres a cut and paste of the Brownell page. Emphasis is mine. Slides into 12 or 20 gauge magazine tubes to quickly remove dents. Grooved to clear “tabs” on 1100 Special Field and 11-87 with new-style magazine spring *retainer.
As Tam was saying it is a mandrel. The second link shows the mandrel in use.


BrianB, the tool linked to at Brownells is intended for removing the factory dimples (used for retaining the stock spring keeper) when installing a magazine extension.

Your next post (from Doc) is a good summation of what has been discussed so far and one that I wholly concur with.

[Tamara]

I'm out. I'll let Brian and Jack thumb wrestle over what Brownells tool to get the dents out of Fallujah. :rolleyes:

[5pins]

Out of the two hundred or so 870’s we have rebuilt in the last year only one had a dented magazine tube. So it’s not very common. On the other hand magazine related problems with the M4’s happen all the time.

[UNK]

I'm out. I'll let Brian and Jack thumb wrestle over what Brownells tool to get the dents out of Fallujah. :rolleyes:
Thank God tuning wasn't involved

[WDW]

Hmmm fabricatum?
Brownells doesn't seem to think so.
Heres a tool.
http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/shotgun-tools/straighteners-dent-raisers/magazine-tube-dent-raiser-prod25276.aspx
That tools purpose is to remove the indents on newer manufacture Remington shotguns.
and heres the video to accompany the tool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCqI_KQNDVM
I agree that it was a little too strongly worded. I imagine you could still feed shells one at a time as a last ditch effort.

[UNK]

Yes but M4 magazine problems are easily remedied. And if you've got one M4 Mag I bet you've got a bunch. All I was pointing out is that it is a drawback to a tube fed gun.

Out of the two hundred or so 870’s we have rebuilt in the last year only one had a dented magazine tube. So it’s not very common. On the other hand magazine related problems with the M4’s happen all the time.

[czech6]

AR mag not a big deal, AR buffer tube is a different matter. Bend or dent that and you get whatever is in the chamber and nothing else. Bent mag tube leaves you with a single shot.

On department weapons we have 870 mag tubes and AR buffer tubes getting screwed up at about the same rate, which in technical terms is once in a blue moon, and usually related to long gun in the trunk and a rear end collision.

[NH Shooter]

Heres a cut and paste of the Brownell page. Emphasis is mine. Slides into 12 or 20 gauge magazine tubes to quickly remove dents. Grooved to clear “tabs” on 1100 Special Field and 11-87 with new-style magazine spring *retainer.
As Tam was saying it is a mandrel. The second link shows the mandrel in use.

I stand partially corrected. But I've never heard of anyone buying one of this tools for any other reason than for removing those stupid dimples. Maybe I just don't get out enough....

[UNK]

No harm. I've heard it mentioned once long ago. I've never seen it nor do I know anyone it has happened to. Just a consideration ...anyone can give it as much weight as they want.

I stand partially corrected. But I've never heard of anyone buying one of this tools for any other reason than for removing those stupid dimples. Maybe I just don't get out enough....

[LSP972]

Hmmm fabricatum?
Brownells doesn't seem to think so.
Heres a tool.
http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/shotgun-tools/straighteners-dent-raisers/magazine-tube-dent-raiser-prod25276.aspx

and heres the video to accompany the tool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCqI_KQNDVM
I agree that it was a little too strongly worded. I imagine you could still feed shells one at a time as a last ditch effort.

Dude... you're grasping. Listen to what these folks are telling you. Just between myself and ONE poster here telling you not to worry about damaging your magazine tube, there is almost 60 years of experience involving shotguns carried (and used) in an LE capacity... and that doesn't count any of the other posters, whose collective experience is probably as much, if not more. It simply is NOT an issue.

It seems you're trying to convince yourself that a carbine is more viable. Okay, no problem with that, if it is what you want. But your 870, with a short barrel (and assuming you know how to properly run it), would be as good an HD long gun as you could ask for.

.

[Chuck Haggard]

Dude... you're grasping. Listen to what these folks are telling you. Just between myself and ONE poster here telling you not to worry about damaging your magazine tube, there is almost 60 years of experience involving shotguns carried (and used) in an LE capacity... and that doesn't count any of the other posters, whose collective experience is probably as much, if not more. It simply is NOT an issue.

It seems you're trying to convince yourself that a carbine is more viable. Okay, no problem with that, if it is what you want. But your 870, with a short barrel (and assuming you know how to properly run it), would be as good an HD long gun as you could ask for.

.



I'll point out that the guys with agency experience get quite a bit more than most folks who may own one or tow for five shotguns. My job has 150+ shotguns that I was directly responsible for, often being used by folks who could give a shit if they break it.

[LSP972]

My job has 150+ shotguns that I was directly responsible for, often being used by folks who could give a shit if they break it.

Counting the "gray-shirts" (non-trooper DPS Police types), we had over a thousand of them on the street at some points. And they all came back to the range for in-service.

Last year, the agency bought AR carbines for everybody, and those who wanted no part of a shotgun have been allowed to turn them in; from what I've been told, most troopers/DPS Police did just that. But until that occurred, EVERYBODY with a commission was issued a shotgun and required to qualify with it. We finally got rid of the last of those steenkin' Ithacas in the mid-90s, and it was all 870s after that. That was a LOT of shotguns, and a metric crap-load of 12 gauge burrets downrange, over 20+ years that I was involved with firearms training.

We saw a lot of rusted guns due to neglect, a few failed ejectors, a few broken trigger groups, and two busted stocks that weren't as hard as the heads they were busted over. But in all of that, I never saw one- nada- damaged magazine tube.

And Chuck was being kind. People who use issued stuff generally not only don't care about it, they can get real creative when it comes to trashing said issued gear.

.

[Tamara]

I don't know nothin' 'bout no police department shotguns*, but I did fill out gunsmithing repair tickets for a living from '93-'07, so I'd like to think that I've seen some of the more common ways guns could break. There are parts I worry about on 870s, but... well... I got ninety-nine problems, but the tube ain't one.



*Outside of buying the occasional job lot of secondhand ones, that is.

[NETim]

My time on the teams* taught me that the biggest danger to shotgun mag tubes was internal rust.




*League trapshooting team

[Al T.]

My time on the teams*

Well played Sir! :D

[Chuck Haggard]

My time on the teams* taught me that the biggest danger to shotgun mag tubes was internal rust.




*League trapshooting team

Same-same for shotguns that ride in cop cars all year.

[TheRoland]

Springs/followers mysteriously binding in long tube extensions is definitely a thing, as is binding due to careless re-essembly. I've seen it happen in just a couple of 3-gun matches, resulting in a very expensive single-shots.

I would imagine it's less common in shorter extensions.

[Hambo]

Never saw it on a PD gun, although they rode around in a car more than they got used. Never saw it at a three gun match, where guns can take some hard hits. Never saw it when I worked PT in a gun shop, and we had a lot of shotguns come through from '97s to the newest thing. On the list of shotgun problems, it's way down at the bottom of the list.

[ST911]

Echo Chuck and LSP, Moss 500 and Rem 870 types. Primary issues are corrosion and the occasional tube that backs out a turn or two.

Oh yeah, and lots of cigarette butts, candy wrappers, gum, etc.