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5pins
09-14-2014, 11:11 AM
About two years ago I got my first sub compact 9MM, a Kahr MK9. Since that time I have not carried or even shot my Smith 442.

The Kahr is the same size, weighs more because it all steel.
It holds more rounds, 7 vs 5.
Fires a much more effective caliber, 9MM vs .38.
Easier to shoot, due in part to weight.
Easier to carry spare ammo, 7 round mag vs 5 round speed loader.

So I have to wonder. Is the .38 snubbie still viable in today’s world of small 9’s?

DonW
09-14-2014, 11:53 AM
I'm still not sold on 9mm Kahr's reliability, with the given that it's not adviseable to rack the slide to load - factory recommendation: use slide release. Seems to me a whole new way to load. A whole new way to clear malfunctions.

Most testing I've seen on 9mm has been with close to 4" barrels and longer. How does the .38 SPL top carry loads through a J-frame compare to 9mm through a short barrel?

45dotACP
09-14-2014, 12:10 PM
Depends...I think a revolver conceals very well because it's less angular. I would personally feel much more confident with a 442 than a Kahr MK9 because of reliability concerns. I've heard that Kahr is either hit or miss and I personally wouldn't drop money on one. If yours works, that's great, but I think small guns like that run into issues more frequently than G19 sized or other service sized pistols because of the speed at which the slide cycles.

It's the same reason I don't trust 3" 1911's. The slide just plain moves too fast. This is just my opinion however, and it may not necessarily reflect reality. If it were a Shield vs a Snubby, I'd pick the Shield every time.

JodyH
09-14-2014, 12:20 PM
I'm a big fan of the Kahr PM9, but it'll never replace my J-frame for pocket carry.
The 442 draws consistently faster with far fewer hangups due to it's grip and frame shape.

Mike C
09-14-2014, 12:20 PM
While I won't argue that there are some serious limitations to a snub I love my 642. It is so easy to carry and draw it's not even funny. I forget it's there when I am running and biking. It fits and draws from a pocket better than any auto I've ever had.

Definitely some drawbacks but still relevant IMHO.

Mike C
09-14-2014, 12:22 PM
I'm a big fan of the Kahr PM9, but it'll never replace my J-frame for pocket carry.
The 442 draws consistently faster with far fewer hangups due to it's grip and frame shape.

JodyH are you going to follow me around the forum and beat me to every post today? Second one in the span of like 5 minutes. I need some more coffee.

RevolverRob
09-14-2014, 12:44 PM
I feel like we've hashed this out...recently -

Backup-NPE-Gun-Conundrum (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?13380-Backup-NPE-Gun-Conundrum)
Is-the-38-Special-still-relevent-as-a-carry-round (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?12512-Is-the-38-Special-still-relevent-as-a-carry-round)
340-PD (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?12282-340-PD)

No the snub revolver is not dead, it has not been supplanted by the compact 9mm guns by most people. It remains, in my not so humble opinion, the best NPE gun you can carry besides a really a tiny gun. It serves in a variety of rolls a compact 9 can't, firing through clothing/bags/etc. Super lightweight versions are the best pocket/ankle/deep concealment guns you can get with decent power-to-weight ratio. Here's an example Tam (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?13351-Modern-44-Special-defensive-ammo) brought up for the roll of the hammerless snub revolver firing from inside of a purse.

These are just examples of where the snub can excel where a 9mm compact can't. Add in that it works just fine for all the other things a handgun needs to do and you have a very durable, reliable, and mission-adaptable package.

Edmo
09-14-2014, 12:58 PM
For pocket carry, I find an "Airweight" J-frame revolver is a good option. Maybe a better option than some of the mini autos out there...

I have a S&W 642 (same as your 442, but with stainless barrel & cylinder) and find it pocket carries very well. This is for two reasons.

First it only weighs 15-16 ounces. You can carry it in your pocket all day without the feeling of your shorts being pulled down. Most autos in this class tend to be a bit heavier.

The second is the snag-free design when drawing from that pocket. An auto, regardless of how small, will always have the slide protruding above your fist clinched around the grip. A Centennial J-frame (concealed hammer version) presents no such snag option with it's smooth transition from the top of the grip to the rear sight.

True, it only carries five rounds and reloads can be slower than an auto, but how many of you carry a spare reload every time you step out of the house? I do, yet many of my friends do not. With a "Pro Series" version you can carry that reload on a moon clip and reloading a snubby just got a lot faster.

I would say the terminal performance differences between a 38 Special +P and a 9mm round aren't as far apart as you might think, especially out of the short barrels we are talking about. This isn't a ballistics sword-fight challenge, just modern ammo has made all of the calibers more effective.

Some advantages the snubby has over any auto is no out-of-battery disconnect generated by a contact shot and no issues when fired in confined spaces such as inside a coat pocket. Both could be of value in a self-defense struggle.

Remember the rule... "Avoid stupid places where stupid people are doing stupid things." This can be a challenge as stupid people are popping up everywhere these days. I often carry an auto if I think one of the "stupid rules" may be in jeopardy, but I still feel covered when I drop my 642 into a pocket for day to day activities.

Edmo

5pins
09-14-2014, 01:07 PM
I only used the Kahr as example because I have one. There are plenty of sub compact 9’s to compare to.

The snub is definitely better for pocket of purse carry.

warpedcamshaft
09-17-2014, 07:13 PM
Quick question for the OP... Have you taken SouthNarc's ECQC class?

It was a motivating factor for me to go back to the snub if I need something really small... I can get a pretty monster 3 finger grip on a j-Frame... but only 2 fingers on the CM9/PM9.

I also get a more consistent grip on the J-Frame from both the pocket, or a IWB setup. (The PM9/CM9/MK9 series is great... and I'm a big fan... but I have found that it works better for my wife than for me personally based on mitt size.)

Will_H
09-17-2014, 07:42 PM
As a follow up, had anyone fine any training with a siminutions snub nosed revolver? I've been curious about it since taking ECQC.

TCinVA
09-17-2014, 08:28 PM
As a follow up, had anyone fine any training with a siminutions snub nosed revolver? I've been curious about it since taking ECQC.

I guarantee a revolver firing sims would work better than the sims Glocks did in ECQC.

It's rather frustrating when your Glock doesn't work and you have to toss it, take the other guy's Glock, and then try to clear a malfunction using his face while you've got him pinned down.

Will_H
09-17-2014, 08:37 PM
I guarantee a revolver firing sims would work better than the sims Glocks did in ECQC.

It's rather frustrating when your Glock doesn't work and you have to toss it, take the other guy's Glock, and then try to clear a malfunction using his face while you've got him pinned down.
Yeah, I did a fair amount of Glock-throwing, as I couldn't keep them clear.

Can hand pressure lock up a cylinder? Could the assailant just hold the hammer down? Are there other failure modes?

I don't have much time behind a revolver, thus the questions.

Jay Cunningham
09-17-2014, 08:43 PM
Yeah, I did a fair amount of Glock-throwing, as I couldn't keep them clear.

Can hand pressure lock up a cylinder? Could the assailant just hold the hammer down? Are there other failure modes?

I don't have much time behind a revolver, thus the questions.

I think part of the whole point of the material is to teach you how to keep their hands off of your gun while you deliver effective fire onto them. Any hand on any gun can F it up.

Edited to add: revolvers can easily be disabled by a good grip on the cylinder.

Will_H
09-17-2014, 08:53 PM
Noted, keeping the gun close in a tangle is something I need to work on. One of MANY things I got a wake up call on in ECQC.

Thanks for the info.

SouthNarc
09-17-2014, 08:54 PM
If guys contact me in advance I can bring 38 sims for them to run their revolvers. I've had 10 or so over the years run J frames and one D Frame Agent. Yes you can grip one hard enough to keep the cylinder from rotating and it's been done in an evolution.

Jay Cunningham
09-17-2014, 08:57 PM
I got to play with my J-frame recently in a formal class environment. I had it AIWB in a DSG holster and was getting great results with both draw speed and quite accurate hits to the standard upper thoracic. I also did a lot of work from position 2 in tight to the target and consistently kept my rounds in a nice tight group in the target abdomen.

No complaints man, though I'm still getting a Glock 42.

orionz06
09-17-2014, 08:58 PM
Would anyone be able to do some testing on the smaller autos to see what it takes to jam the slide up? Most are sprung pretty heavily and are quite snappy. Firing position being ideal is a small auto less likely to malfunction than a G19/G17? Does it approach the potential that the J-frame has?

TR675
09-17-2014, 09:51 PM
Can't speak to the smaller autos off the cuff, but my M&P9c is VERY easily fouled up in position 2 by loose clothing...

orionz06
09-17-2014, 09:52 PM
The 9c is a gun I would guess to be fouled more easily, I believe it has a "real gun" recoil spring.

TR675
09-17-2014, 09:54 PM
It does.

This is giving me ideas for the range this weekend.

Edit to clarify: IIRC the FS and compacts have different recoil spring assemblies but they are both standard and not dual sprung.

jetfire
09-17-2014, 11:32 PM
I obviously wouldn't think the snubbie is dead, because I carry one when I don't carry a full size revolver. There are things you can do with a snub gun that you can't do with an auto, like fire it through a coat pocket multiple times. For people like me who live near the wall, this ability alone keeps the snub relevant.

Chuck Haggard
09-18-2014, 03:10 AM
The other issue with pistols, regardless of what spring, is that the brass has to have somewhere to go. Bouncing back into the ejection port, or not even clearing the port, is common in situations where the gun is fired close in to the body and things are moving chaotically.

DocGKR
09-18-2014, 03:45 AM
As noted in a previous post, as a primary firearm the snubbie revolver is indeed dead to me.

While a compact pistol using the same magazines as the duty pistol is my preferred first BUG for carry in uniform, as an alternate uniform BUG and for civilian CCW, I find there is no better choice than a LW snubbie revolver for versatile carry in a pocket, ankle, chest, appendix, or underarm.

JR1572
09-18-2014, 06:44 AM
We're issued PX4's (must be carried in uniform). I carry a 442 as a BUG because there's nothing subcompact about a subcompact PX4.

Since I don't wear a uniform daily, I EDC a Glock 19 with my 442 as my BUG.

JR1572

LSP972
09-18-2014, 07:44 AM
I don't think the snubbie concept will ever "die"... there are too many folks who still want them.

No doubt that some of the latest small semi-autos are better for a primary carry piece, because they are easier to hit well with at a distant target.

I use a small handgun for a secondary piece; and in that role, I'm staying with the J frame snubby because its a lot more likely to deliver all of its rounds in an EQC/contact encounter.

.

TR675
09-18-2014, 09:07 AM
Yeah, until something else replicates the j-frame's combination of size, weight, footprint/ease of concealment, punch, and near-absolute reliability I don't think they're going anywhere.

rob_s
09-18-2014, 09:26 AM
Have A 642. Pocket carry doesn't work for me with it. Wasn't sure really what to do with it after that. Got a DSG appendix holster for it and that valapidated both the gun and the carry position for me, albeit only when combined.

Tamara
09-18-2014, 10:01 AM
Got a DSG appendix holster for it and that valapidated both the gun and the carry position for me, albeit only when combined.

To this day that is the only gun/holster combo that I've successfully and comfortably carried AIWB.

ACP230
09-18-2014, 10:15 AM
I tried to buy a snubby online this morning. Somebody beat me to it by 20 minutes or half an hour.
Not the only time this has happened lately, either.

Makes me wonder if reports of the demise of the breed might be somewhat exaggerated.

rob_s
09-18-2014, 10:25 AM
I tried to buy a snubby online this morning. Somebody beat me to it by 20 minutes or half an hour.
Not the only time this has happened lately, either.

Makes me wonder if reports of the demise of the breed might be somewhat exaggerated.

You're never going to kill them outside the *intelligentsia*. No matter what the higher-order shooter thinks of them, the masses will always find a use or perceived need for them.

5pins
09-18-2014, 10:53 AM
A lot of good points brought up so far. Maybe "death" of the sunbbie is a little much, maybe more of a decline now that small autos are readily available.

When I got my 442 in 95 there wasn’t much choice. No one had a real subcompact 9 that was worth a kitten.

Pants pocket carry has never worked for me. If I do pocket carry it’s in a jacket and then it’s sparingly. I’m just not a fan of pocket carry. When I do carry my Kahr as opposed to my M&P compact it’s IWB. It’s flatter then the snub and more comfortable.

Jay Cunningham
09-18-2014, 11:03 AM
When I got my 442 in 95 there wasn’t much choice. No one had a real subcompact 9 that was worth a kitten.


You can say "shit".

warpedcamshaft
09-18-2014, 06:03 PM
I've noticed over the course of shooting the CM9/PM9 series from the pocket: it helps a lot to use my thumb to cap the slide at an angle as I draw the handgun out of the pocket.

After I feel my thumb clear the pocket, I roll my thumb down and around the grip, and it has helped a lot with consistency. Still not quite where the J-Frame is for me...but I think I could make due with either with enough practice.

warpedcamshaft
09-18-2014, 06:13 PM
By the way... if anyone knows where the "Snubby Summit" videos are available online now... let me know.

They were available for a few years, but I can't find them anymore. I remember a pretty good counterpoint by Tom Givens, and some really good info from some awesome trainers.

If my brain had been working at the time, I would have found a way to save them somewhere.

cathellsk
09-21-2014, 11:51 AM
www.policeone.com
This is where I found them last time.

JodyH
09-21-2014, 04:25 PM
"Rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated." -Snubbie-

Fon1961
09-21-2014, 09:36 PM
To this day that is the only gun/holster combo that I've successfully and comfortably carried AIWB.

just can't bring myslef to do it...no matter how much more comfortable it may be lol...

Rich
09-24-2014, 10:36 AM
I don't think the snubbie concept will ever "die"... there are too many folks who still want them.

No doubt that some of the latest small semi-autos are better for a primary carry piece, because they are easier to hit well with at a distant target.

I use a small handgun for a secondary piece; and in that role, I'm staying with the J frame snubby because its a lot more likely to deliver all of its rounds in an EQC/contact encounter.

.

I`m with LSP972.

For BUG use I like the M642 over the sub compact 380/9mm. No slide set back , hard to take away. able to fire in jacket pocket.

Now I though about buying a sub compact / HK P2000sk and carrying my m642 instead of P30S 9mm

David Armstrong
09-24-2014, 05:20 PM
Sort of a "to each their own" thing, but I have a few sub-compact autos. They don't get carried nearly as much as my 642 .38 snubbie. For slipping in a pocket I've just not found anything that rides as comfortably and is as reliable in a similar package. So yes, it is very viable to me.

camsdaddy
09-25-2014, 07:46 AM
I have run the gamut of pocket guns. I find that I always return to a snub. I find the semi's harder to draw from a pocket and when I draw a snub from pocket or iwb I have a good grip everytime. Currently my model 60 is getting carried more and more. I find its easy to carry, accurate out to 25 yards in DA, fun to shoot, fast to target. I have thought of getting another air weight but I don't find them near as fun to shoot and considering I'm used to carrying a Glock 19 the weight doesn't bother me all that much.

Rich
09-26-2014, 02:28 PM
I have run the gamut of pocket guns. I find that I always return to a snub. I find the semi's harder to draw from a pocket and when I draw a snub from pocket or iwb I have a good grip everytime. Currently my model 60 is getting carried more and more. I find its easy to carry, accurate out to 25 yards in DA, fun to shoot, fast to target. I have thought of getting another air weight but I don't find them near as fun to shoot and considering I'm used to carrying a Glock 19 the weight doesn't bother me all that much.


Using a 3 finger grip like the Revised S&W Combat Grip makes a world of difference. Also the revised 3finger grip works well in wrangler cargo pants / shorts.
Also the 148gr WC is softer to shoot than some of the +P loads

naughtymoose
10-11-2014, 12:35 PM
I owned lots of autos, and still like the k frame and j frame snubbies.

If1HitU
10-25-2014, 04:25 PM
Well my snubby,is alive and well for now.:confused:

FotoTomas
11-01-2014, 01:33 AM
Reading through this thread the pros of the "J" have been consistently noted. For me I have retired and sold off my last Kahr PM9 and gone back to my 638 as the EDC pocket power. It works and it works well. No reason to fix that which is not broken.

Rex G
11-01-2014, 09:12 PM
I have tried many times, over three decades, to find a true replacement for the .38 snubby, but except perhaps for a smaller cartridge, for less recoil as I become more feeble, I believe I will still be toting a snubby three decades from now, if God grants me the time and health. Previous replies have covered the reasons, so I need not repeat them.

I do, usually, pack heavier than the .38 snubby, for now, so it is a niche weapon, but that niche can be quite important.

Frank R
11-01-2014, 11:48 PM
I've been carrying a snubby for forty six years and doubt I'll ever stop.

coldcase1984
12-04-2014, 10:53 PM
Got a great deal on group buy of Smith Shield 9mms few months back. I habitually carry BUG in Weakhand pocket. Took a 200 mile in -state investigative round trip today. Every time I checked the Shield the short mag had been popped loose. 442 is back full-time tomorrow.

MGW
12-04-2014, 11:06 PM
Got a great deal on group buy of Smith Shield 9mms few months back. I habitually carry BUG in Weakhand pocket. Took a 200 mile in -state investigative round trip today. Every time I checked the Shield the short mag had been popped loose. 442 is back full-time tomorrow.

Interesting. What holster were you using?

coldcase1984
12-04-2014, 11:33 PM
Desantis

Tamara
12-06-2014, 03:53 PM
Took a 200 mile in -state investigative round trip today. Every time I checked the Shield the short mag had been popped loose. 442 is back full-time tomorrow.

That'd put me off my feed, too, alright. :eek:

Chuck Haggard
12-06-2014, 04:36 PM
Right handed guns with a 1911 style mag release, in left pockets, often have the magazine popped loose due to the mag release button being hit.

This is where the HK style paddle release would be a huge win, or even the old school German heel style mag release.

Kyle Reese
12-06-2014, 04:52 PM
Right handed guns with a 1911 style mag release, in left pockets, often have the magazine popped loose due to the mag release button being hit.

This is where the HK style paddle release would be a huge win, or even the old school German heel style mag release.

Single stack P2000 SK in 9x19 w/ LEM would be tits....

serialsolver
12-06-2014, 09:35 PM
This fall I started having significant hip and leg pain on my right side. My gun side. After a little trail and error I found out it was the full size pistols I was carrying iwb. I had been carrying 4 in n frames, 5 in 1911 and hi powers. Can't do it anymore that big nerve in my hip won't put up with it and within 15 minutes I'm limping. A snubby revolver is all I can carry iwb. A snubby m66 is what I'm using now. The snubby is alive and well here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Fon1961
12-06-2014, 09:57 PM
I carry a j frame on a regular basis and have complete confidence in it

SeriousStudent
12-07-2014, 01:17 AM
Single stack P2000 SK in 9x19 w/ LEM would be tits....

On sale for $780: http://www.topgunsupply.com/h-k-p2000sk-9mm-lem-fixed-sights.html

I am seriously thinking about snagging one.

coldcase1984
12-07-2014, 10:56 AM
Right handed guns with a 1911 style mag release, in left pockets, often have the magazine popped loose due to the mag release button being hit.

This is where the HK style paddle release would be a huge win, or even the old school German heel style mag release.

Yes, and I've carried it strong side pocket with no problem, but need some retraining time. My aging brain had been hardwired carrying BUGs weakhand pocket for 22 years.

Going stronghand w Shield couple weeks back a situation after dark in a Wally World parking lot (a speed run that I deemed "gun light") made me want to get a grip on the pistol. But my left hand found nothing but keys!

Two lessons learnt:

1. NEVER, EVER go to Wally after dark w/o a service-sized pistol.

2. Don't carry Shield or any BUG-sized handgun stronghand pocket without retraining the brain.

RevolverRob
12-07-2014, 01:13 PM
Yes, and I've carried it strong side pocket with no problem, but need some retraining time. My aging brain had been hardwired carrying BUGs weakhand pocket for 22 years.

Going stronghand w Shield couple weeks back a situation after dark in a Wally World parking lot (a speed run that I deemed "gun light") made me want to get a grip on the pistol. But my left hand found nothing but keys!

Two lessons learnt:

1. NEVER, EVER go to Wally after dark w/o a service-sized pistol.

2. Don't carry Shield or any BUG-sized handgun stronghand pocket without retraining the brain.

Well, I am going to sound like a dick. You could just stop going to Wal-Mart. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/12/walmart-crime-rates_n_4775169.html

I see a lot of people who carry guns/knives/invest in advanced training and they still do silly things...like go to the places where criminals go to do criminal things. Whole Foods might be more expensive, but there are a lot fewer individuals intending to commit felonious actions walking around in there. Costco memberships are 75 bucks a year. You know what most felonious criminals don't tend to do? Buy Costco memberships.

Lost River
12-07-2014, 02:24 PM
I've nothing really groundbreaking to add in regards to the application of the snubby, though I am a proponent of them as a second gun. When I graduated from a state academy years ago, I received a somewhat traditional gift of a J Frame. Mine is a 442.

I've been back stateside for a few years now, working as a detective for an agency and my J Frame rides in my left front pocket every day.

When coming into contact with an unknown threat, I keep my left hand casually in my pocket while I initiate contact. Once I make a reasonable determination that they are not likely to be a threat, then I casually slide my hand back out and continue with business. This is far less obvious and offensive than having a full firing grip on my primary semi auto worn on my right side.

Few small handguns I've found work well in the role I described above. I shoot my G26 quicker and more accurately than my j frame, but it does not ride in a pocket anywhere close to as comfortably as my old J Frame.

One thing I will add is that the simple addition of a set of crimson trace laser grips increased my low light accuracy quite significantly and I consider them the best single "accessory" a person can purchase for the J Frame.

Also, Milt Sparks has a new pocket holster out for J Frames that looks like a winner of a design. I've one on order after playing with a prototype. If your in the market, they may bear consideration.

Cheers!

SeriousStudent
12-07-2014, 06:38 PM
.......

Also, Milt Sparks has a new pocket holster out for J Frames that looks like a winner of a design. I've one on order after playing with a prototype. If your in the market, they may bear consideration.

Cheers!

I was aware of the PCH-R holster. Is this a different one?

I also have a habit of wandering about with a J-frame in the left front pocket. I am always interested in pocket holsters that advance the state of the art.

Thanks.

Lost River
12-09-2014, 08:48 PM
This is something new.

I just looked and its now on the site. I was concerned that maybe I spoke about it too soon. It's not my place to announce such things and other than being friends with the crew, I'm not associated business wise with the company.

It's called the Manta. I will give a review once I get it and carry it a bit. I've got a pocket holster that I've had for a long time (PCH) and can attest to the first rate quality (typical sparks quality).

The only problem with my original is that its for a right front pocket, and I don't carry a J Frame as a primary, so the holster does not see the use that a left front pocket rig would, as my J Frame is normally a BUG.

Looking forward to playing with the new one.

WDW
12-09-2014, 09:23 PM
I feel that the S&W J frame fills a niche that no other gun can. It's a combo of weight, size, caliber, & reliability that is yet to be matched by anything else. I know I'll always own one.

SeriousStudent
12-09-2014, 10:39 PM
Lost River, thanks for the info. This could fill a niche for me.

MGW
12-09-2014, 11:04 PM
That looks really interesting. Can't wait to hear how it works. I'm 3 1/2 weeks into my wait time for a Kramer. Never thought I would spend that much on a pocket holster so I hope I like it.

LSP972
12-10-2014, 08:37 AM
I'm 3 1/2 weeks into my wait time for a Kramer. Never thought I would spend that much on a pocket holster so I hope I like it.

Just checked their site; their pocket holster looks to be unchanged from the example I have, purchased some 20 years ago. As with all Kramer products, quaility is exemplary. I wore that holster every day I was off for a decade or more; it shows that wear, but still is eminently serviceable. As the description claims, that leather-covered plastic "plate" on the outside makes the holster look like a wallet in the pocket.

The only potential issue is its bulk. It is quite a bit thicker/more substantial than many other offerings. I have been using a single-thickness-leather RKBA pocket holster for BUG use since 2006, precisely because it is super-thin, yet doesn't flop around in the pocket like an Uncle Mike's sausage sack example does.

But if I were to start carrying a J frame in the strong-side pocket again, as a primary, I'd more than likely go back to the Kramer.

Bottom line here is (IMO, of course), you won't beat the Kramer for durability and utility if you can abide the thickness. It works best in "tactical" pants, or other trousers with generous-cut pockets. Wear one in jeans, and folks will think you're trolling... ;)

.

MGW
12-13-2014, 10:41 AM
Christmas came early.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/12/13/4fb1288cebfda38ec97434968a9e5410.jpg

LSP552
12-14-2014, 12:05 PM
Christmas came early.

The Kramer is my favorite J-frame pocket holster. There are some others that are a bit slimmer, but a J-frame in a Kramer looks like a wallet in the pocket.

I should say that I hate their semi-auto pocket holsters. They are WAY to bulky, IMHO.

MGW
12-14-2014, 03:16 PM
The funny thing is the first day I carried it I noticed the extra weight more than anything. Day two I didn't notice it at all. Conceals much better than the uncle mikes type holsters.

JodyH
12-14-2014, 04:04 PM
I've been using a RKBA "Ambidextrous Pocket" for a year or so now and love it.
Prefect retention, light weight, super thin yet stiff and disappears in my Duluth cargo pants/shorts front pocket.
Cannot be beat for $35.

MGW
12-14-2014, 05:20 PM
I have one of those for my 42. Works well in big pockets but needed something that would work better in khakis with the J. Concealment was the first priority.

I ordered one of the JM pocket holsters for the 42 last week. If it conceals as well as I think it's going to and cleans up pocket draws with the 42 I'm going to have a difficult decision to make.

LSP552
12-14-2014, 05:30 PM
I have one of those for my 42. Works well in big pockets but needed something that would work better in khakis with the J. Concealment was the first priority.

I ordered one of the JM pocket holsters for the 42 last week. If it conceals as well as I think it's going to and cleans up pocket draws with the 42 I'm going to have a difficult decision to make.

I need to try a JM pocket holster for the 42. The Kramer for the 42 is never made it out of the house before it went into the dead holster box. As much as I want the 42 to replace my 642/442 from the pocket, doubt it will happen.

Up1911Fan
12-15-2014, 11:07 PM
I need to try a JM pocket holster for the 42. The Kramer for the 42 is never made it out of the house before it went into the dead holster box. As much as I want the 42 to replace my 642/442 from the pocket, doubt it will happen.

I have a left handed one, if you wanna check it out for a day or two, pm me.

LSP552
12-16-2014, 08:19 PM
I have a left handed one, if you wanna check it out for a day or two, pm me.

Thanks for that generous offer! I've seen photos and the reviews have been good so I'll go ahead and pull out the plastic. Thanks again.

Ken