Spare Magazines

[Jay Cunningham]

A spare magazine is a very important accessory to your concealed carry weapon. While having a bunch of additional ammunition is certainly reassuring, the main reason to carry a spare magazine is because they are one of the weak links in the semi-automatic pistol system.

Quite often a bad magazine will cause your otherwise perfectly reliable semi-auto handgun to turn into a malfunction machine. Magazines also have an annoying characteristic of popping off the floor plate right when you don’t want them to and vomiting out your rounds all over the ground. If you don’t have a spare, and the mag in your pistol goes TU, you are stuck with an extremely bulky Derringer. I recommend one spare magazine for double stack pistols and two spares for single stack guns.

Next time you hear “Whutcha need that extra clip fer? You think yer gonna take on a SEAL Team??” you can let them know what they don’t know.


The above is not "The Law as Told By Jay"; it is simply an expression of some opinions that I've formed through my training and experience with several very good instructors. Please feel free to discuss and disagree!

[willowofwisp]

Great post. I have been asked several times why I carry an extra clip or two...I normally tell them its for my garand in the trunk haha.

Do you recommend downloading your extra mag a round?

Sent from my Evo

[Jay Cunningham]

Do you recommend downloading your extra mag a round?

If you carry a Glock, yes.

[LittleLebowski]

The weakest point of magazine fed weapons is the magazine.

[MTechnik]

If you carry a Glock, yes.

Is this because they are difficult to jam in on a closed slide when fully loaded? Reliability when fully loaded?

Do you recommending downloading by 1 for other pistols?

Thanks!

[jthhapkido]

If you carry a Glock, yes.

Hm. Why?

[JV_]

Is this because they are difficult to jam in on a closed slide when fully loaded?That's why I download. It may also increase the life of the spring, but I keep spares on hand, and don't worry about it too much.

[TCinVA]

The general rule of thumb on mags is that you want at least 1/2 a round worth of play when the mag is loaded to capacity. With Glocks often there is almost no movement left when the mag is at capacity. That has the same downsides that loading 30 rounds in a USGI mag has.

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[Force Majeure]

Makes em' easier to insert and also does wonders for spring life not to try and put that last round in. I always download my Glock mags by one round.

Remember, spring compression is like an exponential curve that stacks heavily at the end. That last round makes a tremendous difference.

[JohnN]

Have you ever been to a match and seen someone reload, pull the trigger and the magazine fall out? I would bet some of them reloaded with a fully loaded mag (Glock especially) and failed to seat the mag due to the cartridge column not having much give. Not a huge deal in competition but major in a defensive situation.

[SLG]

I think that downloading a glock by one round is a good thing. However, when I had to carry a glock, I was not allowed to download the mags, and yet I never had a problem reloading. That is a user issue much more than a pistol issue.

Also, while spare mags may be carried for any number of reasons, I carried 18 spare M-4 mags my first deployment to Afghanistan. That turned out to be 13 more than I should have carried (and in subsequent deployments I rectified that mistake), but I can assure you, I did not carry them because I was worried that the mag in my gun might fail...

[ToddG]

Just to follow on to what SLG said, while I think it's certainly legitimate to recognize that mags can and do fail -- particularly the part about floorplates self-destructing -- I've got to say that in my experience mag-related malfunctions in pistols (using quality OEM mags) is fairly uncommon.

To be honest, one of the main reasons I carry a spare is so that when I'm done shooting however many rounds I need to shoot, I can dump the partially spent mag on the ground, load up a fresh one, and still have plenty of ammo. The odds of needing 30+ rounds in one fight are probably fairly slim, but shooting "a bunch" and then being able to go back to a fully loaded gun again without worrying about retaining or retrieving partially loaded mags is nice...

When I carried a lower-capacity gun (like the HK45 all last year), the spare mag was a very real sense of security because I can blow through 10-11 rounds pretty quick.

[David Armstrong]

I've got to agree with SLG and Todd. While carrying a spare mag might be nice, carrying it because you are worried your primary mag may go plum-shape in the middle of a fight shouldn't even be an issue. If you are at all worried about the magazine not working any and every time it shouldn't be in the gun in the first place, IMO.

[vmi-mo]

If it is a 30rd USGI mag, it gets 30rds. If its a 17rd glock mag, it gets 17rds. I have never had any problems with seating or reliability. YMMV


As Pat McNamara stated if a shooter is having problems seating a fully loaded mag there is this thing called a "G-I-M-E,,,,,,G-I-M,,,,,, AHHHHH!!!!!! GYM yahhh go to the GYM"


PJ


ETA: Talking to those involved in shooting people with pistols they have typically said they emptied an entire mag into the threat. Yeah, it might of been dead at round 5, however you dont know that so you just keep shooting. So its nice to have some extra just in case.

[jthhapkido]

If its a 17rd glock mag, it gets 17rds. I have never had any problems with seating or reliability. YMMV


+1 (from a Glock shooter)

Never had a single problem in general practice, competition, or adrenal stress training. (More precisely, never had a magazine problem in those cases. Plenty of shooter problems, :) but none associated with anything that downloading one round would fix.)

Matter of fact, don't know of any Glock shooters around here who download one, either.

First I've heard of that for standard Glock mags.

[David Armstrong]

My notes from the first Glock armorer class I attended say that there should be at least 1/4" of freeplay when the mag is fully loaded, however many rounds that may be. I don't see that admonition in later class notes, so it may have been an issue with the earlier mags.

[TCinVA]

I think David hit upon a key issue: Time.

When I purchased my first Glock the magazines had absolutely zero play in the top round when loaded to capacity. Inserting the magazine on a closed slide required inappropriate levels of force, which beat the top round up (on one occasion raising a bur that ended up sticking the case in the chamber on my gun) and not doing wonderful things for the life of the magazine as a whole.

Later revision magazines with different followers and springs had more give in them when loaded to full capacity.

[Kyle Reese]

I've yet to meet anyone that has survived a gunfight that wished they has less ammunition on their person. A spare mag is cheap insurance. I see no downside to carrying one.

[GLOCKMASTER]

I usually carry one spare magazine for my G19 for most of the reasons listed above.

If I'm visiting Durham I will carry two spare magazines.;)

[Jay Cunningham]

Hm. Why?

Seems like a little less space in them - sort of like AR-15 magazines. They *can* be difficult to seat on a slide in battery. This is me as a VSM Instructor echoing LAV's thoughts.

[LittleLebowski]

Downloading by one round is just common sense to me.

[skyugo]

The general rule of thumb on mags is that you want at least 1/2 a round worth of play when the mag is loaded to capacity. With Glocks often there is almost no movement left when the mag is at capacity. That has the same downsides that loading 30 rounds in a USGI mag has.

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i was playing around with my glock mags one day and came to this conclusion as well. 14 rounds is plenty. with a g19 loaded 15+1, and a spare of 14, you have 30 on tap. I dont' think i have to explain why that's plenty. Seating 14 rounds on a closed slide is substantially easier. Just takes out one possible cause of error.

Do you guys download the one in the gun as well?

[willowofwisp]

i was playing around with my glock mags one day and came to this conclusion as well. 14 rounds is plenty. with a g19 loaded 15+1, and a spare of 14, you have 30 on tap. I dont' think i have to explain why that's plenty. Seating 14 rounds on a closed slide is substantially easier. Just takes out one possible cause of error.

Do you guys download the one in the gun as well?

I don't download the one in the gun.

[BWT]

How many spare magazines do you guys carry?

I carry two. But I also carry a single stack 1911.

I'm thinking when I make the switch (prepping for), I've been in some incidents (rather, sketchy situations I thought, "You know, I would've liked to have had a bright flash light if that situation went a certain way") in this last year, where I'm thinking if I've got 30+ rounds, I might want a good flash light instead of another spare magazine.

What say you guys? I kind of know what some of you are going to say, but just curious what's the general consensus.

[KeeFus]

I carry 1. I usually carry a G-19 fully loaded w/ 124 Gold Dots; same with the spare.
Never had an issue loading them to the max and no issues with malfunctions (FTF).

When I carry my 442 I carry the reload in an HKS speedloader.

[BigT]

I download all my mags by one. So the one in the gun just doesn't get topped off when I load the chamber. Spare is down one as well. I find it makes it a lot less likely that I will have a mag fail to seat under less than ideal conditions.

[SLG]

I don't download the one in the gun.

As I said, I never have downloaded my glocks, though I think it's a good idea. Glock puts more rounds in the mag space than any other manufacturer. If you subscribe to that idea, then the mag in the gun should be downloaded as well. The issue as I understand it is overall reliability, and having a little more room in the mag improves feed reliablility, not just ease of insertion.

I've never noticed the mag being tough to insert fully loaded, but I have seen lots (on the order of 100 pistols a day) of glocks on the line, and a surprising number failed to feed from lack of available spring pressure.

I don't think that is an issue when they are new, but Glock mag springs take a serious set, really quickly. I always thought that was a bad idea, and when you compare them to other guns' mags, they are outside the norm.

Like I said, I've never down loaded my glocks, and mine have been pretty reliable, but not as reliable a some other guns I've used.

[Frank B]

I download my mags by one since I'm introduced to this method two years before. Otherwise I never experienced any problem with a fully loaded mag, like I did it before.

With my G30 I got two mags, who only accept 9 rounds instead of ten. They got replaced for ccw.

[JodyH]

Downloading by one round is just common sense to me.
Depends on the gun.
Glocks tend to be packed tight when they are loaded to capacity, -1 could be a good idea. Since Glocks also have high capacities for their size it's not a big deal to go -1.

My H&K P2000 9mm mags have a lot of room left after being loaded to capacity, you could almost stuff another round in if you really tried. Downloading a H&K mag is not necessary at all.

Downloading my Kahr PM9 mags is not only unnecessary for feeding/seating, but also takes away 10% of my ammo.

[SmokeJumper]

Always carry a spare as I think most if not all you do and have mentioned. I also carry a reload for my BUG. Anyone else carry a reload for the BUG?

[dookie1481]

Always carry a spare as I think most if not all you do and have mentioned. I also carry a reload for my BUG. Anyone else carry a reload for the BUG?

Probably a good idea. A speed strip doesn't take up much space.

[SmokeJumper]

Probably a good idea. A speed strip doesn't take up much space.

Very little space in my 5Shot Leather pocket carry pouch.

[JonInWA]

I always download my Glock magazines by one round-both to provide more freeplay space when reloading when the slide is in battery, and to provide a place for the chambered round if I have to unload and clear the weapon.

I totally agree with Jay's recommendation of one spare doublestack/2 spare singlestack magazines; that's been my modus operendi in that regard for years when carrying concealed.

Best, Jon

[dookie1481]

Very little space in my 5Shot Leather pocket carry pouch.

Gotcha, I didn't realize you would carry it in the pouch as well.

[David Marlow]

Odds are, I will never have to use my carry weapon. I carry a spare mag for it because if I've already beaten the odds by having to use my gun, I don't want to rely on more odds that I'll only need 3-5 rounds from a few feet away.

I don't download my Glock mags and have never had a problem. Granted, me saying I've never had a problem doesn't mean much here because for all anyone knows, I load a mag and never shoot, so of course I would be fine.

[DocGKR]

For CCW, always one spare doublestack or two spare singlestack magazines (downloaded by 1 rd for Glocks).

For uniformed LE duty, I carried 4 singlestack or 2-3 doublestack mags as spares on my person, plus more readily available in the vehicle.

[Jay Cunningham]

2016 Post-PFestivus Necro Bump!

[Leroy Suggs]

For CCW I agree 1 hicap or 2 single stack spares.

For [B]CURRENT[B] G17 or G19 magazines fully loaded +1.
The springs in the current magazines are not over stressed when fully loaded.

No problem with inserting or weakning the spring in my experience.

[Paltares8]

I generally will carry a backup(doublestack). Would like to have 1 or 2 extra either in the car with me or at home. Seeing as how unlikely it is that I'll ever need to use my pistol in a life or death situation, if it happens I think its safe to assume that any other generalities about gunfight (only a few shots fired, encounter at close range, etc.) will be out the window as well. And it helps balance all the shit on my belt or in my pants;)

[RJ]

Well, you know maybe in 2016 a spare mag has even more viability.

I've never really thought about this, but it make sense.

Maybe a dumb question, but it would seem a mag carrier for CCW would be pretty simple. I'll do a search, but are the typical kydex companies gtg for purchasing mag carriers (ex. JM CK)?

[olstyn]

I'll do a search, but are the typical kydex companies gtg for purchasing mag carriers (ex. JM CK)?

It's only one data point, but I've been quite happy with my CCC BMC mag carriers. My Kytex ones, less so. I have, on rare occasion during USPSA matches, accidentally pulled the Kytex ones off of my belt when going for a reload. It's no fun having to shuck the carrier off of the mag before you can insert the mag into the gun, especially given that at that point, you've got a gun in one hand and a mag with a carrier over it in the other. Fixing the situation is a touch awkward. *Probably* less of a concern in a carry scenario than in competition, as the likelihood of having to do FAST reloads is lower, but that doesn't change the fact that I use the CCC carriers for EDC, and the Kytex ones stay home. Your mileage may, of course, vary.

[Sero Sed Serio]

Well, you know maybe in 2016 a spare mag has even more viability.

I've never really thought about this, but it make sense.

Maybe a dumb question, but it would seem a mag carrier for CCW would be pretty simple. I'll do a search, but are the typical kydex companies gtg for purchasing mag carriers (ex. JM CK)?

I have been really happy with my JMCK appendix mag carrier. For weak side behind the hip PerSec makes an awesome canted kydex pouch

[RJ]

It's only one data point, but I've been quite happy with my CCC BMC mag carriers. My Kytex ones, less so. I have, on rare occasion during USPSA matches, accidentally pulled the Kytex ones off of my belt when going for a reload. It's no fun having to shuck the carrier off of the mag before you can insert the mag into the gun, especially given that at that point, you've got a gun in one hand and a mag with a carrier over it in the other. Fixing the situation is a touch awkward. *Probably* less of a concern in a carry scenario than in competition, as the likelihood of having to do FAST reloads is lower, but that doesn't change the fact that I use the CCC carriers for EDC, and the Kytex ones stay home. Your mileage may, of course, vary.

Thanks, I'll look that up.

I looked at a few options online, but really didn't see one I liked for CCW.

The ones I use for USPSA are Blade Tech dual pouches, with Tec-Lok attachments. They seem to work ok for games.

I guess, recognizing Mr. Dunning and Mr. Kruger are next to me here as I'm typing, I'm looking for a simple kydex, vertical, IWB mag carrier, with 1.5" soft loops, that will hold P30/VP9 mags.

[olstyn]

The ones I use for USPSA are Blade Tech dual pouches, with Tec-Lok attachments. They seem to work ok for games.

Probably a bit bulky for carry, though, right?


I guess, recognizing Mr. Dunning and Mr. Kruger are next to me here as I'm typing, I'm looking for a simple kydex, vertical, IWB mag carrier, with 1.5" soft loops, that will hold P30/VP9 mags.

The CCC BMC is OWB with a hard loop, so probably won't work for what you want. I believe he does make an IWB mag carrier as well, though, so it's probably still worth looking at his offerings.

[PNWTO]

Sometimes (70%) I'll just toss it in my back pocket. Really interested to see the IWB carrier Raven is working on, Defoor raved about it at a class.

[Kyle Reese]

Well, you know maybe in 2016 a spare mag has even more viability.

I've never really thought about this, but it make sense.

Maybe a dumb question, but it would seem a mag carrier for CCW would be pretty simple. I'll do a search, but are the typical kydex companies gtg for purchasing mag carriers (ex. JM CK)?

Yes. I was carrying a Glock 17 and spare mag in one of Tony's AIWB holsters and AIWB mag pouch this weekend.

[backtrail540]

I'm currently also using one of JM's aiwb carriers daily and it is excellent. I'm also excited to get one of DSG's new carriers when they come out.

[RJ]

Yes. I was carrying a Glock 17 and spare mag in one of Tony's AIWB holsters and AIWB mag pouch this weekend.

Thanks TYR, I overlooked the AIWB mag pouch since I don't have an AIWB holster.

Yeah, I like how that looks. I will ask Tony if he can make a straight up/down one with a softloop for me.

Ok, dumb question #2, is there any reason I should not wear a magpouch at 3:00 (I'm a lefty)? I mean, do folks generally wear in one location, or is it personal preference?

I am on a diet to get to 175 lbs. i'm at 185.2, down from (cough) 200+. Right now I am in 34" pants, but still have a bit of a tummy to work off. Will it make a difference? I admit Tony's model for AIWB mag pouch is distressingly slim. :(

[scjbash]

Ok, dumb question #2, is there any reason I should not wear a magpouch at 3:00 (I'm a lefty)? I mean, do folks generally wear in one location, or is it personal preference?

I am on a diet to get to 175 lbs. i'm at 185.2, down from (cough) 200+. Right now I am in 34" pants, but still have a bit of a tummy to work off. Will it make a difference? I admit Tony's model for AIWB mag pouch is distressingly slim. :(

I have multiple mag pouches from Tony, though they aren't IWB. I'm also 185, need to be 175, and wear 34" pants. I carry them at 9:00 (I'm a righty) and they work great.

[Kyle Reese]

Thanks TYR, I overlooked the AIWB mag pouch since I don't have an AIWB holster.

Yeah, I like how that looks. I will ask Tony if he can make a straight up/down one with a softloop for me.

Ok, dumb question #2, is there any reason I should not wear a magpouch at 3:00 (I'm a lefty)? I mean, do folks generally wear in one location, or is it personal preference?

I am on a diet to get to 175 lbs. i'm at 185.2, down from (cough) 200+. Right now I am in 34" pants, but still have a bit of a tummy to work off. Will it make a difference? I admit Tony's model for AIWB mag pouch is distressingly slim. :(

Regarding mag pouch placement, I generally run mine (OWB) at 9, but utilize the AIWB pouch when concealment becomes an issue, such as wearing tighter shirts in warm weather, and I don't want the pouch at 9 to print.

[Mr_White]

Regarding mag pouch placement, I generally run mine (OWB) at 9, but utilize the AIWB pouch when concealment becomes an issue, such as wearing tighter shirts in warm weather, and I don't want the pouch at 9 to print.

That sounds about like the way it works for me too.

When I was using two Blade-Tech OWB singles around 3 o'clock, they were the weakest part of my concealment, but the reloads were simple and good.

I've switched to the JMCK AIWB pouches now (high-ride), and they regain a LOT of concealment for me. Getting master grip on the magazine when I reload is maybe a hair less slick than with the OWBs on the support side. I don't think there's ultimately any/much time difference but I haven't gone to a lot of trouble to compare them super closely either.

Just started messing around with the new MagPul 21-round Glock magazines. They didn't conceal well enough with the high-ride JMCK pouches, but they sure do with the regular low-ride ones. Going to be messing around with these for a while I think, while I decide whether they are reliable and if I can conceal them.

[blues]

That sounds about like the way it works for me too.

When I was using two Blade-Tech OWB singles around 3 o'clock, they were the weakest part of my concealment, but the reloads were simple and good.

I've switched to the JMCK AIWB pouches now (high-ride), and they regain a LOT of concealment for me. Getting master grip on the magazine when I reload is maybe a hair less slick than with the OWBs on the support side. I don't think there's ultimately any/much time difference but I haven't gone to a lot of trouble to compare them super closely either.

Just started messing around with the new MagPul 21-round Glock magazines. They didn't conceal well enough with the high-ride JMCK pouches, but they sure do with the regular low-ride ones. Going to be messing around with these for a while I think, while I decide whether they are reliable and if I can conceal them.

Please keep us posted on this. I've been tempted to pick some up but have sufficient OEM mags at the moment. Your info may tip me one way or the other.

[Mr_White]

Please keep us posted on this. I've been tempted to pick some up but have sufficient OEM mags at the moment. Your info may tip me one way or the other.

Will do blues!

I have a lot of hope for them, but only time and round count will tell. I think it's a done deal that I can conceal them as spare magazines in the standard (low ride) JMCK AIWB pouches. Handling them can undoubtedly be worked out. The 21-rounder in the gun sticks out just a little too far, so probably won't work for concealment no matter what I do, though I will keep messing with it and see if I can figure anything out. Long-term reliability is the big question mark. I have plenty of confidence in MagPul, it's just a new product and completely untested by me personally, with no large amount of aggregated experience in other people's hands either. I'll probably use them in practice and training with range ammo for a while, then eventually throw a couple hundred rounds of Gold Dot at them if they are otherwise working and I'm satisfied with concealment.

[StraitR]

I just placed an order for a JM AIWB carrie (http://www.jmcustomkydex.com/p/AIWB-SPMP.html)r (1911), but I didn't see high/low ride as a choice or an option. If there was an either/or choice when ordering, I would definitely pick high over low, so how does that relate to the standard AIWB carrier position?

Can you expound on the differences Gabe?

[blues]

Will do blues!

I have a lot of hope for them, but only time and round count will tell. I think it's a done deal that I can conceal them as spare magazines in the standard (low ride) JMCK AIWB pouches. Handling them can undoubtedly be worked out. The 21-rounder in the gun sticks out just a little too far, so probably won't work for concealment no matter what I do, though I will keep messing with it and see if I can figure anything out. Long-term reliability is the big question mark. I have plenty of confidence in MagPul, it's just a new product and completely untested by me personally, with no large amount of aggregated experience in other people's hands either. I'll probably use them in practice and training with range ammo for a while, then eventually throw a couple hundred rounds of Gold Dot at them if they are otherwise working and I'm satisfied with concealment.


Thank you, sir. (And your take makes perfect sense to me.) My experience with their mags (to date) is solely with PMAGs for the AR. (I have a number of Gen 2s.)

I think the 21 round mag would probably fit nicely in the magazine / knife pocket of the 5.11s I tend to wear out here.*

(*I know they'll get me killed on the street but there's pretty much only gravel roads where I live so I've got that going for me...and so far the deer and bear just roll their eyes when they see me coming. And since everyone in town wears something similar whether hipster or not, (this is a hiking / biking / craft beer mecca )...well, so far, so good.)

[Mr_White]

I just placed an order for a JM AIWB carrie (http://www.jmcustomkydex.com/p/AIWB-SPMP.html)r (1911), but I didn't see high/low ride as a choice or an option. If there was an either/or choice when ordering, I would definitely pick high over low, so how does that relate to the standard AIWB carrier position?

Can you expound on the differences Gabe?

https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7356/26795658315_68d5171aa5_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/GPQKET)20160503_055131 (https://flic.kr/p/GPQKET) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

The 'bundle' of two mag pouches and the knife is what I have been carrying. Those are the high ride pouches. The low ride ones look the same, but lack the round detent at the bottom that keeps the magazine riding higher. Both are in the picture. Look for the round detent at the bottom - that's the high ride one.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/2/1449/26407251520_bd48d49730_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Gew4S1)20160427_061925 (https://flic.kr/p/Gew4S1) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

This is a picture from when I was just starting to get into these pouches, and am wearing one high ride (outside) and one low ride (inside.) So that actually shows the difference pretty well.

https://c6.staticflickr.com/8/7608/26795099645_b4de1d169a_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/GPMTAD)20160503_053953 (https://flic.kr/p/GPMTAD) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

These are both the high-ride, which is what I have been using for some time now. (BTW, using all soft loops on them at present.)

[StraitR]

Perfect. Thank you for the visual aids*. You truly are, King of all Junk Carry.


*Phrasing?

[That Guy]

My Kytex ones, less so. I have, on rare occasion during USPSA matches, accidentally pulled the Kytex ones off of my belt when going for a reload.

May I ask what belt and what magazines? I am curious, because I have been a fan of Kytex pouches for a couple of years now and never had any issues with mine.

[LostDuke]

I normally carry a Ruger LC9 pro in a fantastic JM George ( thank you PF!). Carry with one in the pipe, mag loaded to capacity so 8 rounds total. When I carry the PX4 -same holster- I have 15 rounds in the gun. Normally I do not carry a spare mag at all, and if I do it's in pocket not a dedicated carrier.

Practiced a lot with both guns, and my carry rate is up to 100% except when I go to the pool just because there are no lockers, or when not legal. The transformation is due to the practice and the holsters, but I never felt the need to carry more ammo.

Am I doing it wrong?

[HCM]

I normally carry a Ruger LC9 pro in a fantastic JM George ( thank you PF!). Carry with one in the pipe, mag loaded to capacity so 8 rounds total. When I carry the PX4 -same holster- I have 15 rounds in the gun. Normally I do not carry a spare mag at all, and if I do it's in pocket not a dedicated carrier.

Practiced a lot with both guns, and my carry rate is up to 100% except when I go to the pool just because there are no lockers, or when not legal. The transformation is due to the practice and the holsters, but I never felt the need to carry more ammo.

Am I doing it wrong?

A big argument for at least one spare mag is the mag rather than the ammo since most malfunctions in otherwise reliable pistols are mag related.

[Erick Gelhaus]

The vast majortity of the time I carry a spare magazine, there are the odd times I'll forget to grab one. Once I started with AIWB, I carry in the off-side front pocket in a pocket mag pouch. With the G19, I've been carrying a G17 magazine. A few months back, I added a +4 extention to the magazine. I haven't had an issue with concealing it.

[olstyn]

May I ask what belt and what magazines? I am curious, because I have been a fan of Kytex pouches for a couple of years now and never had any issues with mine.

Walther P99 and P99c mags, with the Kytex carriers on a 1.75" Saddleback Leather Tow Belt. (I've got 2 each of the CCC BMCs and the Kytex, and when shooting USPSA, I use all 4, with the Kytex ones being the two that are mounted farther back on the belt.) I've had it happen maybe 2-3 times in the last 4+ years of shooting, but the number is non-zero, and it sure did add time to the stages it occurred on.

ETA: If you're unfamiliar with the mags in question, the shape of the mag tubes is almost identical to Beretta 92 and CZ75 mags - it's really just the tube length and the mag release cutouts that are different.

[That Guy]

Huh. I've been using mine with P99 magazines with no problems. I use an Ares Gear Aegis belt, though.

Are the edges of your belt very rounded? Only thing I can think of that would explain the difference. Well, that or you just shoot a lot more than me. :)

One thing I have noticed with the Kytex pouches though, is that the belt clips do lose tension over time. Are your pouches older ones, and have they started to do that after being used a fair amount, or were they like that from the start?

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[Mr_White]

The vast majortity of the time I carry a spare magazine, there are the odd times I'll forget to grab one. Once I started with AIWB, I carry in the off-side front pocket in a pocket mag pouch. With the G19, I've been carrying a G17 magazine. A few months back, I added a +4 extention to the magazine. I haven't had an issue with concealing it.

Which +4 extension are you using?

[Mr_White]

Here are a couple of pictures showing the new MagPul 21-round Glock magazine compared to OEM magazines. From left to right, they are a standard OEM G17 magazine, an OEM G17 magazine with +2 basepad, and the new MagPul 21-rounder.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/9/8478/29778670746_52217e7651_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/MnrtkG)20160919_174628 (https://flic.kr/p/MnrtkG) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

https://c4.staticflickr.com/9/8232/29814424435_f695ede2f4_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/MqAHEB)20160919_174606 (https://flic.kr/p/MqAHEB) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

[Erick Gelhaus]

Which +4 extension are you using?

This one: http://henningshop.com/products/operator-magazine-extension ... I bought a couple before I was able to pick up several Dawson Precision extentions for on-duty use. It was awkward to use in the pistol on-duty when seated in the car. So, it works for me in its current role.

I am looking forward to the 21rd Magpul offering, especially there won't be an extention piece to deal with.

[Mr_White]

This one: http://henningshop.com/products/operator-magazine-extension ... I bought a couple before I was able to pick up several Dawson Precision extentions for on-duty use. It was awkward to use in the pistol on-duty when seated in the car. So, it works for me in its current role.

I am looking forward to the 21rd Magpul offering, especially there won't be an extention piece to deal with.

Thank you!

[JCS]

I want to try out some extensions for the purpose of a backup magazine. I can't justify spending $40 for a reliable extension plus the cost of a magazine. The magpul 21s are a significant cost saving. I've had great luck with the 15s and 17s.

[JCS]

This one: http://henningshop.com/products/operator-magazine-extension ... I bought a couple before I was able to pick up several Dawson Precision extentions for on-duty use. It was awkward to use in the pistol on-duty when seated in the car. So, it works for me in its current role.

I am looking forward to the 21rd Magpul offering, especially there won't be an extention piece to deal with.

Which ones do you like better of the two?

[olstyn]

Are the edges of your belt very rounded? Only thing I can think of that would explain the difference. Well, that or you just shoot a lot more than me. :)

I wouldn't say rounded, but it may just be that it's on the upper end of what's compatible with the design of the Kytex pouches, belt thickness-wise. It's 3 layers of leather stitched together. It may also have to do with position on the belt; they're my farthest-back carriers, and I think that leads to them having less compression on the clip between my belt and body vs if I had them mounted farther forward. With a thinner belt and/or positioning them closer to 9:00, it would probably be less likely to be an issue. As far as the amount of shooting goes, I'm a not as high volume as some on here; last year I shot ~2500 rounds of 9mm. I think this year's going to be a bit more, but not grossly so. I might hit 3K or a little above, depending on how the fall goes.


One thing I have noticed with the Kytex pouches though, is that the belt clips do lose tension over time. Are your pouches older ones, and have they started to do that after being used a fair amount, or were they like that from the start?

The first time it happened was 2+ years ago, so my memory is not super-clear on it, but IIRC it was fairly early on in the "service life" of the mag carriers. As I said, though, it's not like it has happened frequently, but I'd prefer that it was zero.

[Erick Gelhaus]

Which ones do you like better of the two?

For pocket carry, the Henning is easier to hook and draw. For my duty belt @ work, the Dawsons are my preference. Hope this helps.

[TGS]

It's only one data point, but I've been quite happy with my CCC BMC mag carriers. My Kytex ones, less so. I have, on rare occasion during USPSA matches, accidentally pulled the Kytex ones off of my belt when going for a reload. It's no fun having to shuck the carrier off of the mag before you can insert the mag into the gun, especially given that at that point, you've got a gun in one hand and a mag with a carrier over it in the other. Fixing the situation is a touch awkward. *Probably* less of a concern in a carry scenario than in competition, as the likelihood of having to do FAST reloads is lower, but that doesn't change the fact that I use the CCC carriers for EDC, and the Kytex ones stay home. Your mileage may, of course, vary.


May I ask what belt and what magazines? I am curious, because I have been a fan of Kytex pouches for a couple of years now and never had any issues with mine.


I wouldn't say rounded, but it may just be that it's on the upper end of what's compatible with the design of the Kytex pouches, belt thickness-wise. It's 3 layers of leather stitched together. It may also have to do with position on the belt; they're my farthest-back carriers, and I think that leads to them having less compression on the clip between my belt and body vs if I had them mounted farther forward. With a thinner belt and/or positioning them closer to 9:00, it would probably be less likely to be an issue. As far as the amount of shooting goes, I'm a not as high volume as some on here; last year I shot ~2500 rounds of 9mm. I think this year's going to be a bit more, but not grossly so. I might hit 3K or a little above, depending on how the fall goes.



The first time it happened was 2+ years ago, so my memory is not super-clear on it, but IIRC it was fairly early on in the "service life" of the mag carriers. As I said, though, it's not like it has happened frequently, but I'd prefer that it was zero.

I've had the same problem with Kytex pistol mag carriers, but not their AR15 mag carriers. For me it was frequently, and the Kytex gear was brand new.

I wear double-layer leather belts with rounded edges. Although double layer, I'm now mostly using JRC belts in which both layers are horsehide, which means they're very, very thin....barely thicker, if at all, than a regular belt. I've had the problem of Kytex mag carriers coming off the belt with thick leather belts from the Beltman and AG Custom, as well as with the JRC belts.

When shooting, my fiancé wears a cheap, thick single-layer leather uniform belt which tends to have squared edges. She doesn't have problems with the Kytex pouches coming off.

As for spare mags, I almost always have a spare mag off-duty now that I'm carrying a P229. My previous carry gun, the P2000, I found the mags to have very prominent edges on the baseplates which were very uncomfortable pressed against the skin. I'm using the CCC BMC pouches for my mags and 4Sevens flashlight as well. I love them....super simple, small footprint, relatively inexpensive, and high-ride. I think they're 10x a better piece of gear than what most people in my agency carry mags with, the Safariland clip on metal mag carriers. With what most of them use to carry gear (holsters, pouches, belts, etc.), it's really no wonder that hardly anyone carries anything off duty and can't stand carrying a full load on duty. In other words, it must be exhausting to push a boulder up-hill everyday.

[olstyn]

Thanks for the additional input, TGS. Sounds pretty likely that it's a belt compatibility issue, then. For now, I'll continue to put up with it, but maybe I'll eventually get a thinner belt for competition use, and the problem will just disappear.

[Chuck Whitlock]

I'll do a search, but are the typical kydex companies gtg for purchasing mag carriers (ex. JM CK)?




I looked at a few options online, but really didn't see one I liked for CCW.


I guess, recognizing Mr. Dunning and Mr. Kruger are next to me here as I'm typing, I'm looking for a simple kydex, vertical, IWB mag carrier, with 1.5" soft loops, that will hold P30/VP9 mags.

Rich, I highly recommend that you give this a whirl:
http://www.customcarryconcepts.com/VersaMag-Carrier_p_30.html

The ambi nature of the pouch means that you can change the clip for OWB or IWB usage. I believe that the clip can also be reversed as a j-clip. You could add a set of soft loops to see if you like that as well. I have one for Glock and had one for a M&P and have/had no complaints.

I'm currently using one of JM's mag carriers (V-2) that he tweaked a little for me, and it is excellent, as well.


May I ask what belt and what magazines? I am curious, because I have been a fan of Kytex pouches for a couple of years now and never had any issues with mine.

My biggest gripe with Kytex is that I have broken a couple of carriers sitting down in a narrow arm chair. Broke at the top of the belt loop.

[The Apprentice]

I'll secound the versa mag by CCC I also like the 10 speed mag pouch by blue force gear for fullsize mags. The 10 speed does not work well with my pps mags.

[olstyn]

Shot a match yesterday, and the little bastards must have heard me badmouthing them on the internet, because on one of my stages, sure enough, a Kytex mag carrier came off my belt with the mag when I went for a reload. Hooray for adding time to the stage. :( Really starting to think about ordering some more CCC carriers or a different belt for competition use. Are Wilderness Instructor belts the best option in their type, or is there something else of that sort that people like better?

[ubervic]

If you happen to carry AIWB, don't miss JMCK's offering for a single mag carrier. I run it and it's simply great: http://www.jmcustomkydex.com/p/AIWB-SPMP.html

[TGS]

Shot a match yesterday, and the little bastards must have heard me badmouthing them on the internet, because on one of my stages, sure enough, a Kytex mag carrier came off my belt with the mag when I went for a reload. Hooray for adding time to the stage. :( Really starting to think about ordering some more CCC carriers or a different belt for competition use. Are Wilderness Instructor belts the best option in their type, or is there something else of that sort that people like better?

Just buy more CCC Basic Mag Carriers, and you don't have to worry about it regardless of whatever belt you happen to be wearing.

[olstyn]

Just buy more CCC Basic Mag Carriers, and you don't have to worry about it regardless of whatever belt you happen to be wearing.

This is true, and probably the route I'll end up taking, but I tend to go through a cycle or two of research/obsess/research/obsess before I make decisions, so I'm just looking for input on alternate options, and a Wilderness belt would be about the same price as a new pair of BMCs.

[deputyG23]

I have been carrying Glocks since the late '80s and have almost always carried at least one spare mag somewhere on my person.
The Glock polymer mag pouches have worked well for me over most of this time. A G22 mag rides in mine always. I can feed all sizes of Glock .40 handguns with it. One is on my belt now along with the Glock polymer sport combat holster which is now my most used off duty holster since my back can no longer tolerate IWB carry.

[Arbninftry]

Have your musket clean as a whistle, hatchet scoured, sixty rounds powder and ball, and be ready to march at a minute's warning.
Robert Rogers 1757

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Rogers%27_28_%22Rules_of_Ranging%22

Don't forget nuthin!

[Hot Sauce]

I use these: Persec Appendix Mag Carrier (http://persec.iconosites.com/page/online-store#!/MARCC-Magazine-Appendix-Reverse-Cant-Carrier-GEN3/p/44885062/category=9758269)

I'm a really big fan of them.

[LSW]

I usually carry a double magazine carrier with a couple of 15 round mags for my M&P and my wife is afraid I'll be characterized as some kind of rambo wannabe if I was ever involved in anything. I really don't see why you wouldn't carry a reload or two if you're going to carry a pistol, the extra weight is marginal. Also a consideration, I used to carry the spare mag in a pocket holster, but after training with that method vs using the OWB kydex mag carrier under a t-shirt, the reload split times are almost twice as long from the pocket. While OWB is slightly less comfortable and less concealable, the speed and dexterity with which the reload occurs is so much greater with the kydex owb that I no longer carry a reload in the pocket unless there's no other choice.

Still searching for a good IWB mag holster, the JM looks interesting. Tried a comptac leather IWB, but it's such a tight fit with an M&P mag that the whole pouch and clip just gets ripped off my belt when I try to use it. It's all leather but I don't know if I have the patience to really break it in.

[Cypher]

Two complete reloads was standard equipment for most police officers before any of us here were born. If I was asked in court why I carry spare ammunition, my answer would probably be the same as my answer for why I load with hollow point ammunition:

"Sir, if the police determined it was the best thing to use to protect people such as myself and my family, it seemed obvious that it was the best thing for ME to carry to protect myself and my family."

This thread is the reason I joined this forum. This topic comes up a lot on the internet but this is the only thread I've ever seen with monolithic agreement on the topic.

I've never been in a gun fight, I've witnessed a few shootings but I've never once been required to draw my weapon in self defense. I carry spare magazines because I've been taught that changing the magazine is the simplest way to reduce a malfunction (something else I've never had to do outside of training). I carry 2 because it really doesn't seem like all that much to carry and as Mr. Ayoob said the cops in my town seem to carry 2 as the standard.

[Malamute]

I'm a hillbilly, I usually carry a spare G mag in a pocket, though 1911 usually one or two on the belt, and maybe another in a pocket. Theres enough spares in the console to stay busy for a while though.

[JustOneGun]

Years ago someone in my agency took an X-ray of a G22 mag fully loaded. The spring was quite twisted. Download it by one and it was not twisted. I replaced my mag springs every year whether they needed them or not. I still download by one and replace the spring every year in my carry mag(s).

As for carrying an extra mag, as an officer I carried two, of course. As a civilian I usually don't carry any extras. Sometimes I still get the habit and grab it. For me the natural limitations of civilian gunfights leaves me not only questioning whether I would need all 14+1 rounds, but in the event of an on-going problem I plan on heading the other way. As for malfunctions I can't see spending any more time tapping and racking when I am taking bullets. I plan on doing something else. Usually I train for a tactical retreat. In civilian language that means I am going to run, run, run, or stab, stab, stab depending on where I am in relation to the bad guy. As usual, YMMV.

[Cypher]

If it's just me I'm going to run like Hell. The problem is my wife, she's crippled, she can't run and I'm not going to leave her.

I don't want to sound like I'm trying to be Joe Badass, I'm old, I'm fat and I'm not the slightest bit tactical but I promise you I'll die or they'll die before they get to her.