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Sal Picante
06-19-2014, 08:30 AM
I had a chance to try out the VirTra (virtra.com) system at a local range (OnTarget in Crystal Lake, IL) that is using it as a part of their CCW training.

I found it fascinating and useful as a training tool. One thing instructor kept asking was if I was feeling nervous at all due to the realism depicted in the situations, etc.
Honestly, I felt fine - to say that I'm "used" to handling a pistol is an understatement - and I've long ago steeled myself for some of the terrible stuff mankind does to one another.

I was surprised to hear that many people/cops just freaked out after running a handful of scenarios... I dunno...

Has that happened to anyone/anyone's dept.? If so, how did you guys/your training methodology deal with it?

Sheep Have Wool
06-19-2014, 09:39 AM
Link to the manufacturer's page (http://www.virtra.com)

Never been in one, but it sure looks cool. I'm also interested to see what people do with the Oculus Rift (http://www.oculusvr.com/) down the road. As far as freaking out, there are plenty of YouTube videos out there of people flipping out at VR environments.

John Hearne
06-19-2014, 09:46 AM
One of my gripes is that too many people focus on building skill with the pistol and not focusing on the application of the pistol. I think that video simulators have a huge, underused training value. The initial cost of simulators deters many but the simulator's ability to remove novelty from armed confrontations is huge.

Sal Picante
06-19-2014, 09:49 AM
As far as freaking out, there are plenty of YouTube videos out there of people flipping out at VR environments.

Freaking out like this? :rolleyes:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbcctWbC8Q0

Sal Picante
06-19-2014, 09:57 AM
One of my gripes is that too many people focus on building skill with the pistol and not focusing on the application of the pistol. I think that video simulators have a huge, underused training value. The initial cost of simulators deters many but the simulator's ability to remove novelty from armed confrontations is huge.

Coming from the other side... I've been building skill for a long time and it was nice not having to think about my ability to "make the shot" or not. That really left me free to pay attention to the situation as it unfolded. Big props to some of the training I've received at Rogers School for being able to just raise the gun and make the shot.

jetfire
06-19-2014, 10:29 AM
I had a chance to try out the VirTra (virtra.com) system at a local range (OnTarget in Crystal Lake, IL) that is using it as a part of their CCW training.

I found it fascinating and useful as a training tool. One thing instructor kept asking was if I was feeling nervous at all due to the realism depicted in the situations, etc.
Honestly, I felt fine - to say that I'm "used" to handling a pistol is an understatement - and I've long ago steeled myself for some of the terrible stuff mankind does to one another.

I was surprised to hear that many people/cops just freaked out after running a handful of scenarios... I dunno...

Has that happened to anyone/anyone's dept.? If so, how did you guys/your training methodology deal with it?

It's all those violent video games, they've desensitized you to virtual violence. If you can drown a Nazi in his own urine and then stab him in the head, a VR school shooter is pretty tame.

KeeFus
06-19-2014, 10:33 AM
This year we started going to the local Community College, which has a PRISim simulator. We are scheduled to use it every quarter this year. Damn thing shoots back too...

Thankfully shooting/practicing a lot on my off days with my duty gear helped me focus on the situations as they unfolded.

I like the training and see it as being beneficial in aiding the decision making process in shoot-no shoot situations as well as which level of force to use should lethal not be required. PRISim has Tasers, flashlights, OC, and obviously firearms that are exactly like the duty weapon and they all interact with the system.

http://www.nitorprojects.com/prisim.php

Sheep Have Wool
06-19-2014, 10:43 AM
Freaking out like this? :rolleyes:

Basically.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmRgW-jxwn8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoQ0OXJCbaE
Freakout starts about a minute in when the roller coaster starts to go downhill.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uEEN9opRCQ

Sal Picante
06-19-2014, 11:06 AM
It's all those violent video games, they've desensitized you to virtual violence. If you can drown a Nazi in his own urine and then stab him in the head, a VR school shooter is pretty tame.

Here's the messed up thing - I get violently ill when playing video games (other than Samy's Sport Shooting...) and haven't played in ~20 years.
I can't even stand to see people playing...

That's said, I wish there were Nazi killing with urine scenarios for this thing!

jetfire
06-19-2014, 11:08 AM
Here's the messed up thing - I get violently ill when playing video games (other than Samy's Sport Shooting...) and haven't played in ~20 years.
I can't even stand to see people playing...

That's said, I wish there were Nazi killing with urine scenarios for this thing!

I actually can imagine a future where FPS games go more immersive like this. Basically holodecks, but you bring your own gear.

(dear Tech Gods, I want a holodeck SO BAD)

jnc36rcpd
06-19-2014, 11:13 AM
We just installed a Ti Training simulator. I think simulators are a great tool, but not to the exclusion of force-on-force or realistic live-fire training. All of these tools have their advantages and disadvantages.

While spendy to purchase, simulators are relatively low cost to operate. While safety protocols are necessary, they are somewhat failsafe and fast to implement. Moreover, simulators allow officers to experience complex scenarios that would be expensive or dangerous to conduct using other methodologies. For instance, in one scenario, my partner and I were on foot patrol when we were suddenly assaulted by gang bangers in a drive-by. (Did not see That one coming.) That would have been impossible to do with marking rounds or live fire.

The downside of simulators is that the officer usually cannot alter tactics. He or she is going to go up the stairs or into the backyard because that is how the simulator is programed. That said, I think simulators can be a great tool to work on observation, decision-making, and to some extent, marksmanship.

MD7305
06-19-2014, 03:02 PM
Our regional academy also has the Ti Training simulator, one fixed to a dedicated room at the academy and another portable unit that can be loaned out to agencies. I believe it's a great tool especially when reinforcing that not every scenario is a shooting, some involve ASP, OC, Taser or a combo. The scenarios can be altered to take different paths so the user doesn't know what's exactly going to happen. The selection of scenario types from EDP to military roadblocks to traffic stops is great.

We've also been using it when we begin introductory firearms. When we discuss grip, stance, presentation we use a bullseye/firing range program. The fine accuracy and sight alignment can't be diagnosed as well as conventional range time though but in the years since we've used this approach we've found we have to spend less time covering those basics on the line, only fine tuning.

As anything else it's a great tool when used maturely and professionally, otherwise it's a big expensive first person shooter video game.