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mongooseman
06-20-2011, 05:37 PM
I work in the Deep South as an LEO Investigator, which means when I'm on duty it's basically open carry most of the year because of heat and humidity. I use Galco leather gear, carrying my personal V3 P30. I was at the range this afternoon drilling on drawing and firing on a steel target, working on that important first DA shot, from approximately ten yards. According to the timer, from a interview position, I was averaging around 1.15 seconds. Just was wondering is this an average time or do I really need to work on speed?

ToddG
06-20-2011, 05:42 PM
What size steel target?

How approximate is "approximately 10 yards?"

How consistent was that in terms of hit percentage and speed (every time, most of the time, some of the time)?

A 1.15 draw is smoking fast for an aimed shot.

gtmtnbiker98
06-20-2011, 06:04 PM
That's fast, now move in to 7-yards and replace that steel with a 3 X 5 card. :o

That 3 X 5 card at 7-yards with a TDA is a Bitch! Some "guy" from Maryland came up with this damn drill that has haunted me since.

JHC
06-20-2011, 07:09 PM
A 1.15 draw is smoking fast for an aimed shot.

SMOKIN' FAST is right! Is this a hip shot? ;) Nice.

mongooseman
06-20-2011, 07:28 PM
What size steel target?

How approximate is "approximately 10 yards?"

How consistent was that in terms of hit percentage and speed (every time, most of the time, some of the time)?

A 1.15 draw is smoking fast for an aimed shot.


OK. Went to range with measuring tape;
Steel target: 12" by 24"
Distance: closer than I thought, 8 yards and a foot.
Hit percentage; 50 round box, three misses. The times? (about third time using timer, will learn how to use it better!) Mostly 1.1_ something. Two of the misses came when I pushed for speed and one due to a poor initial grip, which threw the whole draw off.

I started my career with a Beretta 92 and have always worked on the DA shot. After discovering the drills and particularly the "Fear Not.." article and Todd's press out videos on pistol-training, the clouds parted and the Angelic choir sang. I have been working on improving draw mechanics and press outs while using snap caps. I'm the only one at my small department (25 sworn officers) that carries a DA/SA pistol (Glock .40s and 4 XD's).

ToddG
06-20-2011, 07:55 PM
An 18x24 plate is huge (about eight times the area of an 8" circle). Still, being able to get a shot off in just over a second is very good. I'd suggest getting a substantially smaller target, though.

mongooseman
06-20-2011, 08:09 PM
An 18x24 plate is huge (about eight times the area of an 8" circle). Still, being able to get a shot off in just over a second is very good. I'd suggest getting a substantially smaller target, though.

For practicing realistic combat style shooting, what size target would be best? We have pepper poppers, dueling trees, and a few other steel targets. Or would paper be better and at what range?

vecdran
06-21-2011, 12:59 AM
I'm going to hazard a guess at a reduced IPSC target, if you want to use steel.

I'm usually around 1.2-1.4 from the draw with my V3 P30 to the -0 of an IDPA target. I can go faster, but to be honest I am no longer using the sights and just relying on my muscle memory index when I do that.

ToddG
06-21-2011, 01:01 AM
A mix of paper and steel is best. Shooting at steel is great for working speed, but unless you can easily vary the distance of the target you run out of marksmanship practice pretty quickly. Conversely, it's easy to measure -- and control -- your marksmanship on paper targets but you don't get the auditory feedback that comes with steel and you need to be replacing or pasting the targets pretty regularly during high volume shooting.

If I had to pick just one, it would definitely be paper.

David Armstrong
06-21-2011, 12:29 PM
For practicing realistic combat style shooting, what size target would be best? We have pepper poppers, dueling trees, and a few other steel targets. Or would paper be better and at what range?

For combat shooting I've always been a believer in "minute of paper plate" as a good practice target regime.

mongooseman
06-21-2011, 01:54 PM
gtmtnbiker98, David ; I actually use 3x5 cards and paper plates quite a bit for poor man's F.A.S.T. targets, walk back drills, etc.. Our last qualifications were pretty easy after organized practice of the PT drills and dry firing (perfect scores with a G35 and the P30). I appreciate the feedback (thanks Todd). You guys have heard of a Gym Rat? This forum and pistol-training have turned me into a Range Rat.

acfi
06-28-2011, 09:20 PM
Regarding your question about what is a fast time for a DA shot in the strictest sense and not the pseudo DA that your glocks and other similar striker fired guns are, I would look to Ben Stoeger (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beF4r_wMtac). Granted that this demonstration is not from concealment, I would use it as a good indicator of the upper limits of speed and accuracy. I know that a good deal of members here participate in the shooting sports and it is not often that you see Beretta out on the firing line. He's picked a platform and stuck to it and I would imagine that through his progress he has encountered a number of people who told him that he would never be able to succeed with that platform. A further testament to the adage that it is the Indian and not the arrow.

LittleLebowski
06-29-2011, 08:52 AM
it is not often that you see Beretta out on the firing line.

One of our forum members likes to represent :D (Ernest Langdon winning ESP at the 2011 Carolina Cup)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBKacq8zMzQ&feature=player_embedded