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View Full Version : Facility Review: Threat Dynamics (Tualatin, OR)



RBid
11-27-2013, 12:55 AM
I wasn't sure exactly which sub-forum to post this under, but the purpose driven nature of the facilities seemed to lend Threat Dynamics to "Drills, Tests, and Practice". I'm putting this up for people located in the PNW, as well as anyone who travels to the area. If you come through, I suggest dropping in and checking the place out.

Overview:
Threat Dynamics has live fire, sim ranges, firearm rentals, firearm & accessory sales, and firearms training, all in one location. For the purpose of this write-up, I'll key in on 3 key facility components.

I. Live Fire Range
I'm only mentioning this part to acknowledge that they have live fire considerations. They've converted a shipping container into a 2 lane, 3-10 yard range. It's not awesome, but it's useful.

Sim Guns:
The sim guns at Threat Dynamics are Glock 17s converted to use pistons to cycle the slides, CO2 cartridges in the grip to approximate "mags" (they even reload the same), and lasers in the bore to mark hits. The slides reciprocate completely, and at full speed, though I perceive slightly less muzzle rise than you'd get with live fire.

II. "Flat" Sim Range
This area features a single, wall sized screen. The room has a lot of space for you to move around, so you can either plant and shoot, or go full spetsnaz and roll around the room.

Programs run in this area include some defensive scenarios, as well as a wide variety of courses of fire. You can do anything from normal 'square range' stuff to shooting at movers, while moving, or even do specific courses like shooting the new FBI qual course.

Key value points: Again... you can shoot at movers, while moving, and you can shoot as fast as you want, or as slow as you want. Want to run Bill Drills? You can do that. Want to work on shoot/no shoot? You can do that. Want to try backflip draw to headshot drills? You're a backflip away. This range lets you work on things that most shooters will never get to do.

You can even "put it all together", and run defensive scenarios from the ground up, working on everything from verbal deescalation to surprise gunfights. I'll explain a little more about how scenarios work in the 300 degree range section.

III. 300 degree range
This is the real juice.

http://threatdynamics.com/images/conveniencestore_scenario.jpg

http://img3.findthebest.com/sites/default/files/280/media/images/t2/Threat_Dynamics_1_325334.jpg

As you can see, this area surrounds you with 5 screens, and is open only at the back. Looking closely at the second pic, you'll note a computer screen low/left of the opening into the range. When you use this area of the facility, a staff member (all of whom are instructors, as well) will be at the computer. When you use verbal commands to deescalate or communicate, they can effect scenario progression accordingly. They can also screw with you by punching in sound effects or escalating scenarios, as needed. As with the flat range, you have a bit of room to move around, and scenarios obviously include human targets moving at human speed, at a variety of distances. This can be very eye opening, and does a great job of demonstrating how much distance and dynamic targets increase the difficulty of getting quality hits.

You can do nearly anything on this range, from the already mentioned scenarios, to Hogan's Alley stuff, to speed challenges.

IV. The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly
- the resolution and proportion of images on the screens can really impact information gathering processes. I've run the scenario depicted in the top pic, and depth perception on the left/rear screen (looking toward the back of the mini market in the scenario) was distorted. On occasion, you will find yourself wondering what you're looking at. This doesn't reduce the overall value much, if at all, but it can influence the outcome of some scenarios.

- The 300 degree range is awesome in that it really hammers home the value of scanning, assessing, and reading what is happening in front of you to help indicate what is going on behind you. For example, there is a scenario in which guys in front of you start to run for cover when a guy emerges behind you with a gun.

- They can replay scenarios after you go through them, showing you where every round fired went. There is a lot of discussion about being responsible for every round fired. This throws that right in your face. My lady sent an errant round right through the front door of the mini market, and the guy running the scenario pointed out that she could have killed an innocent beyond the door.

- It is common for people to forget to use their sights under stress, right? This was very helpful for correcting that tendency. I missed my sights in one scenario, and I was on them reflexively and consistently very shortly after.

- Speaking of stress, this can certainly provide performance stress for many users. You WILL get immersed, and find yourself yelling at the people in scenarios, moving around, and having physiological stress reaction (tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, etc). You'll decompress between scenarios, and go into them mostly relaxed, then wind up again in scenarios that escalate. The staff does a good job of manipulating this by talking to you between runs and recapping scenarios you just completed.

Totem Polar
11-27-2013, 01:36 AM
Thanks for the review! Next time I'm in the Portland area, I'll do my best to chip away some time. I've certainly traveled further to do less productive things for fun. Looks like an interesting experience.

RBid
11-27-2013, 01:04 PM
Thanks for the review! Next time I'm in the Portland area, I'll do my best to chip away some time. I've certainly traveled further to do less productive things for fun. Looks like an interesting experience.

It truly is an interesting and surprising experience. You'll probably come out of it realizing some things are harder than you expected, while you're better in other areas than you may realize.

The mini market robbery and office based active shooter scenarios are almost "must do" runs.

MDS
11-27-2013, 01:46 PM
Interesting. I heard there's a Gander Mountain in central Florida with similar simulator, but I never took the chance to visit when I lived in Miami. Any other places with this sort of capability?

RBid
11-27-2013, 02:29 PM
Interesting. I heard there's a Gander Mountain in central Florida with similar simulator, but I never took the chance to visit when I lived in Miami. Any other places with this sort of capability?

Embarassingly, I never thought to look into that. Chalk that up to living within walking distance of Threat Dynamics :)

To answer your question, I ran a Google search for "300 degree simulator". Here are some links that popped up. Based on the pictures, it appears that they use the same technology.

(Arizona?): VirTra "V-300"
Facility site link: looks like they have ARs for this, as well... wonder if TD does...
http://www.virtra.com/v-300/

YouTube link for VirTra:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78WkQPPSenc

- there are multiple YouTube links to check out. I like that particular one.

(Location - ?): Gander Mountain
https://gandermtnacademy.gandermountain.com/ranges-simulators/simulators

Interestingly, Gander Mountain's site says that they are the first and only place offering this to the public. I don't think they verified that claim before making it.

(Georgia) Southwest Georgia Technical Institute:
http://www.southwestgatech.edu/Content/Default/10/108/0/continuing-education/firearms-training-simulation.html


There are probably more. Those were just a few quick hits. I also saw notes about a PD in Vallejo, CA getting a V-300 range. Not sure if that's available to the public, or not. Similarly, a 'private security' group called Tundra has one.

Mr_White
12-02-2013, 12:35 PM
Does the staff running the simulator offer much in the way of critique/debrief/instruction/counseling with regard to participant actions and use of force decisionmaking? Or is it more that they just run the machine? Or does it depend on the circumstances in which the simulator is used, such as in a formal training class vs. a customer just paying to use the simulator?

Thank you for the report!

Clusterfrack
12-02-2013, 01:07 PM
The times I have used the 300deg simulator, the staff went through what we did right, and what could be improved. I found it well worth it, and have learned something every time.

It's also interesting to use the shock belt. And amusing to watch others use it ;)

Mr_White
12-02-2013, 02:21 PM
The shock belt sounds pretty cool.

RBid
12-02-2013, 03:45 PM
When they run scenarios, the staff can make changes on the fly to make the sims respond more or less to specific things you say. If you're using ineffective verbal commands, or say something that could escalate a scenario, they can escalate it. Naturally, that means you can also talk your way through some of them without shooting.

There are a LOT of Easter Eggs in the scenarios, as well. For those not familiar with the term, it's a reference to hidden or not obvious elements. For example, there is an active shooter scenario set in an office. While moving through it, there is a dark shape in a dimly lit corner. That lump is a person huddled up with a dark hoodie on. Looking even closer, a dark shape can be seen on the ground near him. Looking even closer than that, you may notice that it appears to be a phone. If you're not processing information well, you may completely fail to notice him, or may notice him and accidentally shoot. There is also a dark shape that runs across a hallway far ahead. If you fixate on that, you may get shot.

In another scenario, two men walk in, with one immediately (and casually) splitting off from the other. The other guy gets loud and violent in short order. Where did that second guy go? ...

There are lots of opportunities to test your situational awareness, and to hammer home the importance of problem solving quickly. Failing to do so may cost you or an innocent, or it may lead to shots where violence was avoidable.

B.K.
12-02-2013, 03:56 PM
Thanks for the review. I live about 5 miles from there and drive by at least a couple times/week. I've been meaning to stop and check it out but hadn't gotten around to it yet. Looks interesting.

ACP230
12-09-2013, 08:30 AM
The Gander Mountains near Madison, WI and near La Crosse, WI have simulators.

I haven't been yet but it is on my list.

RBid
12-09-2013, 12:50 PM
I just realized I could have summarized by saying the whole thing is an exercise in problem solving chaos.