What's your .357 Magnum Carry Ammo?

[Glock17JHP]

There you go, HST is the better modern bullet so order some and see how it goes

I am planning to buy some .357 Magnum HST and test it in my water test tank, along with a new test with recently purchased .357 Magnum Silvertip.

Comparison...

[03RN]

I really wouldn't trust xtps to expand below 1000fps

[Guerrero]

I emailed him to ask about the velocity from a 4" barrel, and he replied that it's ~900 fps. That would be really nice for my 4" M19 if it expands at that velocity. If it doesn't, I'd be afraid of overpenetration. I haven't ordered any yet.

IIRC, DB said the goal of this round was to be able to shoot full .357 Magnum out of a classic K frame without beating the crap out of it.

[Ghost Dog]

I am planning to buy some .357 Magnum HST and test it in my water test tank, along with a new test with recently purchased .357 Magnum Silvertip.

Comparison...

Will this be videotaped?

Can you chrono them? Curious if new Silvertip is a good bit slower than old.

So you will get really really good vs really good lol starting to split hairs

Silvertip in water will get more expansion less Pen, unless you push it too fast the edges frag off. I don't think this will be too bad in Ruger 4.2" though Ruger barrels are generally very fast, but I would expect it from a 6".

HST will be far superior in 6-20" barrels as well, as well as through serious barriers and bone

Over 30 oz revo should get HST if we are optimizing
Under 30 oz revo Silvertip for better control, though an sp101 w Rubber Grips probably handles HST well if you needed that for woods and city.

The interesting test to me is HST vs 125 xtp vs 158 xtp in a lever gun....a guess because I have never owned one and would like to get one lol. I think any of those loads would likely do whatever is reasonably expected to do with them from a lever gun.

Either way both are very good for bipeds/city. HST slightly better for animal defense and windshields I would expect IMO.

post your results.

[SwampDweller]

I had purchased a hundred rounds of recent production Winchester Silvertip before I read about current QC issues (but I had experienced numerous QC issues with other Winchester loads). I actually bought it because for some reason I was under the impression that it was a mid-level .357 load that still had excellent ballistics. It was relegated to practice ammo. Just recently I ended up shooting it and it had as much recoil/blast if not more (subjectively speaking) than my old standby Remington 158gr SJHP, and shot noticeably dirtier. However, I didn't have any issues with it going off, and it wasn't unpleasant to shoot by any means.

I've dropped the Silvertip from consideration due to the well-deserved reputation of Winchester's poor QC in ammunition nowadays as well as the fact that it's really no more controllable than a full power 158gr SJHP.

For a mid-weight grain .357 I've found the Hornady Critical Duty to have a little less muzzle flip (relatively speaking) and blast than my favorite full-power Rem 158gr SJHP load, though there are no practice .357-level loads available in 135gr.

Even the Remington 158gr SJHP .357 load is plenty pleasant enough for me to shoot through a 4" or 5" GP100 with the Hogue Tamer grip on it. I still like the idea of a mid-level .357 load that still gets .357 Magnum ballistics. The Remington 125gr Golden Saber is one I'm looking into. On paper, it doesn't look like it really has anything over a 9mm +P, but from what I've seen handgun hunting, .357 certainly has a more desirable effect on game even if the expansion/penetration numbers on paper aren't all that dissimilar to a 9mm 124gr +P Gold Dot.

Another load I'm looking into is the 125gr and 158gr XTP. I'm also trying to find information on the best general purpose (defense/hunting) load for a lever action rifle. Can't find much specific on here other than handloads that is still in production.

[Ghost Dog]

I had purchased a hundred rounds of recent production Winchester Silvertip before I read about current QC issues (but I had experienced numerous QC issues with other Winchester loads). I actually bought it because for some reason I was under the impression that it was a mid-level .357 load that still had excellent ballistics. It was relegated to practice ammo. Just recently I ended up shooting it and it had as much recoil/blast if not more (subjectively speaking) than my old standby Remington 158gr SJHP, and shot noticeably dirtier. However, I didn't have any issues with it going off, and it wasn't unpleasant to shoot by any means.

I've dropped the Silvertip from consideration due to the well-deserved reputation of Winchester's poor QC in ammunition nowadays as well as the fact that it's really no more controllable than a full power 158gr SJHP.

For a mid-weight grain .357 I've found the Hornady Critical Duty to have a little less muzzle flip (relatively speaking) and blast than my favorite full-power Rem 158gr SJHP load, though there are no practice .357-level loads available in 135gr.

Even the Remington 158gr SJHP .357 load is plenty pleasant enough for me to shoot through a 4" or 5" GP100 with the Hogue Tamer grip on it. I still like the idea of a mid-level .357 load that still gets .357 Magnum ballistics. The Remington 125gr Golden Saber is one I'm looking into. On paper, it doesn't look like it really has anything over a 9mm +P, but from what I've seen handgun hunting, .357 certainly has a more desirable effect on game even if the expansion/penetration numbers on paper aren't all that dissimilar to a 9mm 124gr +P Gold Dot.

Another load I'm looking into is the 125gr and 158gr XTP. I'm also trying to find information on the best general purpose (defense/hunting) load for a lever action rifle. Can't find much specific on here other than handloads that is still in production.

I am personally not that impressed by Critical Duty for Terminal Ballistics for In Gun, though as a reload is fine. The recoil is mild...velocity may be slower than you expect as well....
In Smaller lighter Revolvers I do find the 145 gr Silvertip less recoil than the 158s, which lighter than 30oz 158s are too much for IN GUN as far as fast splits and transitions between targets. A reload with Critical Duty, or 158s (though will hit a bit higher) is just fine IMO.

For 4-5" if you are getting to where you need less recoil I would be fine with 125 xtps from that long a barrel, if you want more velocity than what 125 Golden Sabers will give. That may be the middle ground load for the 4-5" Gp100s. Though honestly If all your batch you bought has been fine, I would carry the Silvertips and not worry depending on your needs.

I am wanting a 16" .357 Lever, just because it's short enough for actual city Home Defense if needed, light enough to maneuver for a woman/teen, and can still reach out 100-120 yards. If it was city home I would likely go 125 xtps. If out in woods cabin, both biped and animal defense and hunting 158 xtp though curious how well the HST's do as stated above.
Be careful of the many many companies that load with 158 gr xtps....Some are so slow skimping on powder as to be worthless.

Maybe something there helps.

[Ghost Dog]

OK Hairsplitting data time boys

.357 154 gr HST Real World Chronos from various sources on the nets
2" 1112 fps 423 ME a different 2" different day 1115 fps 425 ME
4" Smith 1255 fps 538 ME
4.2" Ruger GP100 1318 fps 594 ME

[Ghost Dog]

Winchester Silvertip .357 Man 145 Grain Data over the ages
FBI
1989 OVERALL OG 8 EVENTS AVGs
3" Smith M13 1166 fps 438 ME 13.76" Pen .499 Exp 82.5% Pass (of the 40 rounds I believe to get at least 12" Pen through various barrier events)

1989 FBI BARE ORGANIC 15.8" .58
Heavy Clothing 12.9 .64

Winchester DATA 2010 at 1290 fps
4 LAYER DENIM
16.4" .58


And very possible the load had rolling changes. Winchester bragged it was 4 layer Denim testing in 2010, and didn't say in 2016 if it was still 4 layer denim or if they switched to 4 layer heavy clothing?

Also, not sure if new stuff is as hot as old stuff.

[Ghost Dog]

Part III. FBI Ammunition Tests Data:

.357 Magnum 125 grain Remington Golden Saber JHP, 2/9/93:

Test Gun Barrel Length Velocity
Bare Gelatin

Clothed Gelatin

Penetration Expansion Penetration Expansion
S&W M19

4" 1220 fps 14.40" 0.56" 20.55" 0.48"




.357 Magnum 125 grain Federal JHP, 7/27/90:

Test Gun Barrel Length Velocity
Bare Gelatin

Clothed Gelatin

Penetration Expansion Penetration Expansion
S&W M13

3" 1265 fps 10.65" 0.49" 11.75" 0.51"





.357 Magnum 145 grain Winchester Silvertip JHP, 2/21/89:

Test Gun Barrel Length Velocity
Bare Gelatin

Clothed Gelatin

Penetration Expansion Penetration Expansion
S&W M13

3" 1166 fps 15.80" 0.58" 12.90" 0.64"




.357 Magnum 158 grain Federal JHP, 2/28/91:

Test Gun Barrel Length Velocity
Bare Gelatin

Clothed Gelatin

Penetration Expansion Penetration Expansion
S&W M19

4" 1200 fps 16.50" 0.50" 15.90" 0.64"




.357 Magnum 158 grain Federal HydraShok JHP, 7/14/89:

Test Gun Barrel Length Velocity
Bare Gelatin

Clothed Gelatin

Penetration Expansion Penetration Expansion
S&W M13

3" 1183 fps 24.70" 0.37" 34.50" 0.46"

[Ghost Dog]

Winchester 2010 manufacturer data 4-Layer Denim
125 gr Super-X JHP 1450 fps 584 ME 12.3" Pen .54 Exp
158 gr Super-X JHP 1235 fps 535 17.7 .48 exp

Of note both there 125+p and 158+p .38 loads failed to expand through 4 layer denim

What changes made, and if less powder used, slower now vs what was then claimed is anyone's guess

Call the old LE ask questions line and it sounds like a Fax for a second and hangs up


Also note-
Some 158 gr SJHP will expand good, to great in Federal's case. Most 158 sjhp will expand just a bit and penetrate far. Crowded City too much pen for my liking though fine for reload. For those of you NW or out in sticks that have to worry about both 2 legged and 4 legged it's likely good enough for most situations. Again though, like I mentioned with 158 xtps, it seems some that a lot of companies started when Bad Flu happened had to skimp on powder and now a ton of magnum stuff...isn't magnum and won't expand.