FWIW I bought my P30 on the grounds that it would be the safest bet. Never a hint of a problem, though I'm a low volume shooter too. I also only have a little over 2k rounds through mine, cleaned it at 2k. I probably should have posted in the 2k challenge thread.
Cool thread, hope it doesn't die
Trouble is often specific. For example, "Glocks" don't have issues. The 9mm have been hit or miss, but the other caliber lines have been great. There are tons of 21s, 22s, 23s, 30s, etc out there. You won't hear people talking about problems with them any more than you'll hear about trouble with HK or other makes.
The P30 and HK45 are great. I appreciate them (especially those ergos!). They're not the only game in town, though.
Gen 3 Glock .40s suffered well-known reliability issues, especially when fitted with WMLs. I've heard the rumor that the Gen 4 redesign was to correct specific failings in the .40 cal guns, so the fact that it wound up also borking the nines is more than a little ironic.Originally Posted by RBid
Also, IME, Glock 30s & 36s receive more reliability complaints than any other Glock models. The 36's teething problems after its long-delayed launch were epic.
Last edited by Tamara; 07-28-2013 at 07:37 PM.
RBid--Tamara's comments above are correct. The 3rd gen G22's have caused numerous problems for multiple LE agencies and quite a few G23's have prematurely broken in Federal LE service. Pre-4rth gen G21's had well described issues at several LE agencies. NYPD had the infamous Phase III malfunctions with their 3rd gen G19's. Let's not get started on G30/G36 failures...
Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie
*cough* Glock 31 *cough*
"For a moment he felt good about this. A moment or two later he felt bad about feeling good about it. Then he felt good about feeling bad about feeling good about it and, satisfied, drove on into the night."
-- Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy --
I had my own string of bad luck with Glocks - five, count 'em, FIVE bad G19s in the space of two years. All but the first two were factory replacements for the second (3rd Gen) that couldn't be made to run reliably by the factory. The five G19s were three 3rd Gens and two Gen4s - made between mid-2010 and early 2012. After the last "hand picked" G19 beaned me and three other team mates REPEATEDLY in the forehead with brass and had 2-3 FTEject per magazine did I give up the ghost, and switch to HK. OBTW, I also had an early Gen4 G23 that was spotty on reliability and would shoot more than 18" off POA when myself or any other shooter I handed it to tried to run it.
I have a very good friend of mine, possibly one of the finest "self taught" LE shooters I've ever met, who HAS (please notice current tense) multiple issues with his Gen4 G23. Most notably, and, unfortunately, after I convinced him to dump his 3rd Gen G23 (which wouldn't work with any WML), he now has a "newer and better" G23 that won't reliably function with any WML he's tried on it.
I realize that I and my friend are in a TINY minority of folks who've had EXTREMELY bad luck with recent Glocks, but, it sure puts a bad taste in your mouth... Full disclosure, I do still own three Glocks - two Gen4 G19s and a Gen4 G23. One of the 19s is a commemorative, so unfired in box. The other was reliable through the first 800 or so rounds, then started getting "wonky" on ejection - which situation was remedied immediately by the addition of the Apex FRE. The G23 has had so little range time I wouldn't want to give an impression - still well under 500 rounds through it - just enough to convince myself (again) that, for me, .40 S&W and Glocks are not a combination I like.
I bought my P30 in a fit of anti-Glock emotion, and it has been boringly reliable, and significantly more accurate than any Glock I've ever shot. The P2000 that I picked up on a lark as a "backup" for the P30 is even better - never a single hitch in the gitty up, and even more accurate and easy to shoot than the P30. Now if I could only convince Ameriglo to make their "CAP" front and "Operator" rear NS for my HKs, I'd be close to perfectly happy with them...
I think the Walter PPQ might be another option that gives HK-like ergos, reliability and accuracy, while offering a trigger that's more "workable" than even the Glock's, but I don't have any personal experience with that platform, and I know magazines and accessories are woefully thin.
Regards,
Kevin
Guess again, bud. The local PD here, last year, replaced ALL (three hundred plus) of their G22s because they were starting to break parts- mainly the "third pin". When one of those broke during a gunfight, that was the last straw, so to speak. Fortunately the officer- who got off one round before his pistol puked- wasn't hit in the exchange. And before somebody chimes in with the fact that all the other major agencies around here also use the G22, I would remind him that those guns are relatively new (3 to 5 years max). The PD weapons were in service for ten years.
Heck, even a certain federal agency who uses HKs has had some slides crack. Personally, I think the .40 S&W cartridge is the culprit re breakages, because you simply do not hear about 9mm pistols breaking things. But, as others will no doubt pipe up here with details, Glocks have other issues too.
And "the 9mm have been hit or miss" ONLY since Glock began trying to "improve" things. Many of us here have 90s and earlier vintage Glocks (mainly in 9mm) that simply work... with the monotonous reliability the brand WAS famous for. Many of that same batch of folks will have nothing to do with recent-production Glocks... regardless of caliber.
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As others have said, this is incorrect. Before 4th gen, it was always "9mm Glocks are fine, it's the other calibers that are hit or miss." That was never really true, but it was the conventional wisdom. I've got a folder full of documents on my desktop from a large LE agency that contacted me about substantial problems they're having with their .40-cal gen4 guns. The FBI rejected its first (very large) order of gen4 G23 pistols due to reliability issues. Etc.
I'm not bashing Glocks. I was in a class this past weekend and if I'm recalling correctly, six out of the ten students were shooting Glocks. They didn't become that popular without being decent guns. But suggesting they don't have problems is pure fantasy.
Any specifics on the Gen 4 .40 issues you can share?
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