Is the P229 viable as a carry gun in 2024?

[Sig_Fiend]

Don't HK and Glock use MIM parts in their current duty guns that work just fine? I don't understand the problem with MIM specifically with SIG but not other brands. They're just about all filled with MIM parts now. This is a genuine question, maybe SIG's MIM parts aren't done right or something, that's why I'm asking.

Correct. MIM in and of itself is not necessarily a problem. Porsche (and I think BMW or Mercedes) even uses MIM in certain engine components. MIM can be done in a quality manner. With HK, for example, you generally never see any issues from the components that are MIM.

With SIG, at least in the past, one issue is that they've apparently repeatedly switched between parts subcontractors at various times. That isn't an uncommon industry practice. At certain times, this seems to have led to a few issues with QC or metallurgy, parts breakages, out of spec parts, etc.
Most of my own limited experience seeing this first hand was about a decade ago working at multiple gun stores, a range, and on the wholesale side, so take from that what you will. By most accounts now, it seems these issues are considerably less common with SIG, specifically with the classic P-series.

In hindsight, I wish I could edit my poorly-worded original post so it doesn't sound like I'm implying that there's still a substantial problem with the classic P-series. My post was more in response to Sero Sed Serio's in which he raised the QC issue.
My response was more to point out that, if that was an issue with anyone's gun, there are now quality aftermarket options for nearly all of the components that they might have a problem with, so it's just not a big deal worth worrying about. Sorry for the confusion.

[HCM]

Don’t HK and Glock use MIM parts in their current duty guns that work just fine? I don’t understand the problem with MIM specifically with SIG but not other brands. They’re just about all filled with MIM parts now. This is a genuine question, maybe SIG’s MIM parts aren’t done right or something, that’s why I’m asking.

Two factors with MIM:

- MIM works best in applications where the material properties of MIM are factored into the design. Modern HK pistol extractors were designed to be made from MM, and took into consideration the material properties of MIM.

The problems with MIM tend to manifest in trying to make part designed for a different material with different properties out of MIM.

For example, the original extractors on classic P series pistols were designed around the properties of a part machined from tool steel. When SIG tried to make an exact copy of that part out of a different material instead of tool steel, i.e. MIM, it was a failure. When SIG finally figured this out and redesigned the part in a manner that took into account the material properties of MIM, i.e the Sig “long” extractors, the MIM part worked fine.

MIM parts are normally surface hardened as opposed to traditional parts that are hardened all the way through.

- like everything else, quality is a factor. The faster you want to make parts and the lower your reject rate, the cheaper the part. When you pay for higher quality, you are paying for increased production time per part and increased reject rate.

[Sensei]

I decided to put the 357 Sig barrel in my 90s era P229. This was 125 grain Speer GDHP from the early ‘20s. While the gun is comfortable when shooting 165 and 180 grain Speer GDHP in 40SW, it sucks a bag of dicks in 357 Sig.

[HeavyDuty]

I decided to put the 357 Sig barrel in my 90s era P229. This was 125 grain Speer GDHP from the early ‘20s. While the gun is comfortable when shooting 165 and 180 grain Speer GDHP in 40SW, it sucks a bag of dicks in 357 Sig.

It sucks an angry bag of pissed off dicks, maybe? I always feel like I’m getting something done when I shoot my G33.

[G19Fan]

Two factors with MIM:

- MIM works best in applications where the material properties of MIM are factored into the design. Modern HK pistol extractors were designed to be made from MM, and took into consideration the material properties of MIM.

The problems with MIM tend to manifest in trying to make part designed for a different material with different properties out of MIM.

For example, the original extractors on classic P series pistols were designed around the properties of a part machined from tool steel. When SIG tried to make an exact copy of that part out of a different material instead of tool steel, i.e. MIM, it was a failure. When SIG finally figured this out and redesigned the part in a manner that took into account the material properties of MIM, i.e the Sig “long” extractors, the MIM part worked fine.

MIM parts are normally surface hardened as opposed to traditional parts that are hardened all the way through.

- like everything else, quality is a factor. The faster you want to make parts and the lower your reject rate, the cheaper the part. When you pay for higher quality, you are paying for increased production time per part and increased reject rate.

Great post. Learned something new today

[Wondering Beard]

I decided to put the 357 Sig barrel in my 90s era P229. This was 125 grain Speer GDHP from the early ‘20s. While the gun is comfortable when shooting 165 and 180 grain Speer GDHP in 40SW, it sucks a bag of dicks in 357 Sig.

I have a gen3 G23 with an extra 357 SIG barrel. When shooting the 357s, it is loud as hell, hits a bit harder in my palm but tends to come back down faster and without any "wobble".

The noise is the only thing I disliked.

[MattyD380]

Two factors with MIM:

- MIM works best in applications where the material properties of MIM are factored into the design. Modern HK pistol extractors were designed to be made from MM, and took into consideration the material properties of MIM.

The problems with MIM tend to manifest in trying to make part designed for a different material with different properties out of MIM.

For example, the original extractors on classic P series pistols were designed around the properties of a part machined from tool steel. When SIG tried to make an exact copy of that part out of a different material instead of tool steel, i.e. MIM, it was a failure. When SIG finally figured this out and redesigned the part in a manner that took into account the material properties of MIM, i.e the Sig “long” extractors, the MIM part worked fine.

MIM parts are normally surface hardened as opposed to traditional parts that are hardened all the way through.

- like everything else, quality is a factor. The faster you want to make parts and the lower your reject rate, the cheaper the part. When you pay for higher quality, you are paying for increased production time per part and increased reject rate.

What’s interesting is that Sig still uses the short extractors on P220s. Do we think they’re using machined steel for those (I doubt they are). Or are they just kinda looking the other way and hoping for the best?

Or is there some other factor that makes .45 and 10mm different when it comes to extractors?

[BCG]

January 13, 2017

We've reached number one on my list of the best 5 guns for concealed carry and this is probably going to be a surprise to some people.

It is the Sig Sauer P-229 in nine-millimeter.

This gun is the same size as a Glock 19.

Meaning it is easy to conceal. It holds the same number of rounds as a Glock 19. Meaning it has plenty of ammo on board.

It is a little bit heavier. It has an aluminum frame which I kind of sort of prefer a little bit. It comes from the factory with night sights which are better than the Glock 19. And it is inherently better for my preferred method of concealed carry - appendix carry - because it has a hammer on it. When you go to holster this gun at the appendix carry position you can place your thumb over the hammer and put it into your holster safely.

I love DA/SA guns. DA/SA guns are great. And I think this is the best example of a compact concealable DA/SA gun on the planet.

Sig Sauer P-229 in nine-millimeter is my number one choice for concealed carry.

I'm Caleb Giddings. Remember our motto: run your gun, not your mouth.

Although in the related blog post he wrote that

It is an honest assessment of the guns I regularly recommend for concealed carry. I actually end up recommending the Glock 19 a lot more than I recommend the P229, because people tend to balk at paying nearly $1,000 for a carry gun. But I like it.

[echo5charlie]

So a big FU to this thread. Y'all cost me some money.

After reading all the posts I did something I thought I'd never do at this point in my life - buy a SIG P-series in today's age. Since SIG has discontinued the basic non-Cali P226 9mm I had to order a MK25 as I was not looking for the fluff versions they still offer. Also, after conferring with JMCK about fitment due to the 1913 rail, I bought a AIWB holster for it. FWIW, the 1913 rail works fine with the AIWB 2.5 I received.

Initial feelings on the MK25 I received (mfg 11/23): Good to go. Decent DA, SA is good. Finish looks good as well, but I know the barrel will quickly show wear since it is phosphated as opposed to Nitron. I prefer the original sized grips to the E2 so I am good there. MecGar 18-rounders are a huge bonus. Since this is what I would have hoped to get, you guys don't get a FU.

Initial feelings on potential AIWB use: Lots of surprises for me here. This thing is almost as concealable as a G19, it pretty much falls between a G17 vs G19 using a JMCK 2.5 as a baseline across the board (in a t-shirt), it disappears with a button-down cover garment. Another surprise was that I only had to use a flat wedge to achieve that result. I full wedge or teardrop style results in the same level of concealment, which I found interesting. So, yesterday I went 12 hours wearing the MK25 loaded with a MecGar 18-round mag. House chores, watching TV, cleaning up the yard (lots of bending) and I felt no discomfort at the end. I also wasn't having to make microadjustments to the rig - there was no holster roll or canting to the left or the right. I already carry my G19 everyday of the week, regularly for 10+ hours a day, so that was nice. Now this has me really thinking....you guys get an FU for that.



Off to the range in a few hours to do a few TDA Dot Torture runs followed up with some basic marksmanship and 'worn' carry ammo expenditure. I wonder if y'all will be getting any more FUs?

[breakingtime91]

So a big FU to this thread. Y'all cost me some money.

After reading all the posts I did something I thought I'd never do at this point in my life - buy a SIG P-series in today's age. Since SIG has discontinued the basic non-Cali P226 9mm I had to order a MK25 as I was not looking for the fluff versions they still offer. Also, after conferring with JMCK about fitment due to the 1913 rail, I bought a AIWB holster for it. FWIW, the 1913 rail works fine with the AIWB 2.5 I received.

Initial feelings on the MK25 I received (mfg 11/23): Good to go. Decent DA, SA is good. Finish looks good as well, but I know the barrel will quickly show wear since it is phosphated as opposed to Nitron. I prefer the original sized grips to the E2 so I am good there. MecGar 18-rounders are a huge bonus. Since this is what I would have hoped to get, you guys don't get a FU.

Initial feelings on potential AIWB use: Lots of surprises for me here. This thing is almost as concealable as a G19, it pretty much falls between a G17 vs G19 using a JMCK 2.5 as a baseline across the board (in a t-shirt), it disappears with a button-down cover garment. Another surprise was that I only had to use a flat wedge to achieve that result. I full wedge or teardrop style results in the same level of concealment, which I found interesting. So, yesterday I went 12 hours wearing the MK25 loaded with a MecGar 18-round mag. House chores, watching TV, cleaning up the yard (lots of bending) and I felt no discomfort at the end. I also wasn't having to make microadjustments to the rig - there was no holster roll or canting to the left or the right. I already carry my G19 everyday of the week, regularly for 10+ hours a day, so that was nice. Now this has me really thinking....you guys get an FU for that.



Off to the range in a few hours to do a few TDA Dot Torture runs followed up with some basic marksmanship and 'worn' carry ammo expenditure. I wonder if y'all will be getting any more FUs?

I am a lem and DA/SA convert. I recently mulled the idea of changing back to a glock and I cant give up the hammer and long first trigger pull. I had a pair of p229s a couple years ago. Fantastic guns, sold them and went with a lighter arrangement (p2000). There is something to a metal framed fire arm though, I have been fighting the urge to revisit something like a p229 or 92 compact.