Flashlight Techniques

[Chuck Haggard]

Chuck,
Thanks for educating us. BTW, I really liked how you emphasized that violating rule 2 is the cause of so many bad outcomes. I hope you don't mind I quoted one sentence from your article: "Covering the body of another human being with the muzzle of a firearm is a use of force, a threat of deadly force, whether shots are fired or not."

So, proper training is the key to use of weapon mounted lights...I see that clearly now.

So, since this is a pistol forum, let me ask this: Then do you recommend the use of both a WML on your handgun AND a handheld flashlight for lighting up the environment and use in the eyes of a suspect as a defensive tactic? Or, do you recommend just using a flashlight that has enough spread that you can operate without the handheld? Or, does it all depend on the situation?

I am just trying to figure out how the two work together.

Thanks,
Cody

I strongly advocate both if one has the means to do so. For home defense where the good guy might be using a long gun to hole up and wait then a bright WML with good throw and spread will work.
For LE it's a no-brainer, even with a WML you need a handheld.

[cclaxton]

Chuck: When I read this article I immediately thought of what you said about Cooper's Rule #2. These were Boy Scouts. Border guards should be trained better than this.
http://www.conservativeoutfitters.co...rison-and-fine
Cody

[Chuck Haggard]

Chuck: When I read this article I immediately thought of what you said about Cooper's Rule #2. These were Boy Scouts. Border guards should be trained better than this.
http://www.conservativeoutfitters.co...rison-and-fine
Cody

Ummm, yeah.

Filming the cops is a well established area of case law. People can do so, period.

Pointing guns at people is what would be some version of Agg. Assault under most versions of the various state laws. Wearing a badge and saying "that's the way we do it around here" doesn't change that. That level of force should only be used when the threat of death or GBH is a valid response. Graham and Garner are always in play.

[KevinB]

Ummm, yeah.

Filming the cops is a well established area of case law. People can do so, period.

.

Border Security Zones - and other Security Zones don't apply to that.

However that issue with the gun pulling, it does seem to be a little odd that when you ask a person (or even suspect) to perform an action you can't then use their action (that you asked them to do) as grounds for escalation of force.

[TheTrevor]

However that issue with the gun pulling, it does seem to be a little odd that when you ask a person (or even suspect) to perform an action you can't then use their action (that you asked them to do) as grounds for escalation of force.

Seems to me that that's exactly how I would expect it to work. But maybe I'm just looking at this the wrong way. Or that didn't come out the way you meant?

[KevinB]

Seems to me that that's exactly how I would expect it to work. But maybe I'm just looking at this the wrong way. Or that didn't come out the way you meant?

Officer A: Sir get out of the car.
Suspect: Yes Sir - gets out of car
Officer A: Draws down on person for getting out of car.

Compliant Suspect.


If Border Patrol Agent had told the Scout to stay in the vehicle, and to not get up and get the luggage down from the car rack for inspection, then you could perhaps articulate as to why you where escalating beyond verbal commands.

But when you tell someone to get something, you cannot then shoot them for reaching for it...
Baiting - its illegal most places (unfortunately )

[Dropkick]

Yeah, so flashlights...
I got a compliment today on my little Pelican 1910 I've been carrying lately. It takes a AAA, so it's easy to clip onto a pocket and not notice, but this guy did. I let him look it over for less than I minute and he offered to buy it from me on the spot. Sometimes it's not the size of your light that matters.

[cclaxton]

Just picked up one of these in green at the Chantilly Gun Show....
AAA battery, 130 lumens....includes strobe function. Twists on.
I hardly notice I am holding it when I am using two handed grip on the gun.
This is my new flashlight for dark stages in IDPA and KSTG.
http://powertacusa.com/index.php?rou...product_id=219

Cody

[Up1911Fan]

A P2ZX Fury Combatlight should arrive tomorrow to see how it works out.

[Chuck Haggard]

Just picked up one of these in green at the Chantilly Gun Show....
AAA battery, 130 lumens....includes strobe function. Twists on.

Cody

Makes it a good admin light for if you need to change a tire in the dark or whatever, but a horrible tactical light.