How to shoot like a navy SEAL

[Jeep]

Way #1 is generally how it is taught during initial training in order to get to #2. Things are dependent on where folks stop the training. The reason Way #1 is an initial training thing is that it is slow, and by the time the shooter feels the reset, they have had more than enough time to find the sights. I find way #2 in your description to be the goal for total control of every shot. We try to have folks weened off of way #1 as soon as they are capable. Distance to target and complexity of shot may dictate what comes sooner, re aligned sights or the trigger reset and staged to break, but the process is essentially the same.

Again, people shooting in other kinds of venues don't need that level of control and are looking for different performance gains. I find it different rather than profoundly bad.

You know, the thread drift to trigger control has raised some extremely good issues that I never considered enough--if at all.

We love your photos of great Smith's and Colt's in the revolver forum, but please occasionally come back here. This is an excellent thread.

[john c]

The best way I can interpret it...

Way #1: Break shot. Gun recoils. Hold trigger to the rear. Acquire second sight picture. Let trigger start to reset. When you feel the click, press next shot.
Way #2: Break shot. Gun recoils. Let trigger reset and prep trigger for next shot. Acquire second sight picture. When sight picture is adequate, press next shot.

The difference between the two is that in the first one, your cue to break the shot is actually the tactile sensation from your trigger finger rather than the visual confirmation that your sights are on target or not.

Your sight picture should always be the driver for deciding when to break a shot.

Pure gold. Thank you.

[john c]

Way #1 is generally how it is taught during initial training in order to get to #2. Things are dependent on where folks stop the training. The reason Way #1 is an initial training thing is that it is slow, and by the time the shooter feels the reset, they have had more than enough time to find the sights. I find way #2 in your description to be the goal for total control of every shot. We try to have folks weened off of way #1 as soon as they are capable. Distance to target and complexity of shot may dictate what comes sooner, re aligned sights or the trigger reset and staged to break, but the process is essentially the same.

Again, people shooting in other kinds of venues don't need that level of control and are looking for different performance gains. I find it different rather than profoundly bad.

Thank you. Analysis like this is why this forum is so great.

[Dagga Boy]

The problem is that way #1 creates a training scar. I have observed at a very limited level many people slowly reset and then when they hear the click of the Glock, do a quick trigger jerk. I used to do it myself, because I was trained that way. Why not just teach recovering the trigger during recoil? The way I go by is that it is ok to go fully off the pressure wall as long as it is prepped before the next shot is made.

I find it to be a process, just like teaching draw stroke in pieces. The problem is two fold. Students learn the initial part and never progress their training, and instructors who don't advance enough themselves to teach past the initial stages of learning. We have all seen the student with a horrible draw stroke with all sorts of extraneous movement.....not a debate between draw strokes that are all efficient but different, but just flat out crappy. That is what happens when it is not taught properly in pieces. Then you have people with very slow, but correct draws...(you can almost see them counting) . They learned properly, but have just not worked past having to do each part in order.

I ll try to do an analogy. When I first learned to fly a helicopter, it was very difficult as you have to do multiple things at the same time with both hands and both feet. When something was going wrong (which in a helicopter is most of the time), you need to do multiple things to correct it. In the early stages you fix the problem in order. You move the stick, then pull the collective, then apply pressure to one of the pedals. As time goes on, you are doing everything at the same time. A good instructor can get you to be able to hover in about the equivalent of a one day class in terms of hours. You can stop there and say "I can hover a helicopter" (you also have the skill at that point to fly straight and level). With that said, you will not be able to land or take off until you can do all of the controls together and rapidly transition. Many folks and instructors cannot get past the hover.....or for most of the population, watching from the airport fence. It will take continual work and practice to really be a pilot, a ton of experience and hours to do auto rotations (about the scariest stuff ever when the instructor shuts the power off in flight and dives for the ground), and tons more work with multiple SME's to be able to teach auto rotations, flying on NVG's, pure instrument flying, etc. It very much mimics what we do.

[taadski]

[GJM]

It is a lot better to crash in a Bell than a spitball (Eurocopter).

[Dagga Boy]

As GJM have found, the helicopter/shooting stuff is great for making points on neutral ground. Like aviation, we tend to learn a ton from people crashing. Folks who study why crashes happen tend to be far better off than those who think they are so good it will never happen to them. Even the best pilots can fall victim to things breaking or things hitting them, and preparation for the worst case goes a long way.

[taadski]

It is a lot better to crash in a Bell than a spitball (Eurocopter).

Yep. Lucky day. We were very fortunate indeed.


Darryl, I didn't realize you were a pilot.

[Dagga Boy]

Yep. Lucky day. We were very fortunate indeed.


Darryl, I didn't realize you were a pilot.

I am not. As a full time TFO for four years, it was critical that we could both land and fly our "office" if the pilot was ever shot or medically disabled. My first pilot was our instructor pilot, so I spent a ton of time flying with him and he liked being able to train me. It paid off when we had a runaway trim (stick is mechanically driving itself to one side..GJM will have a better technical description). I flew the ship back to the airport and set up the approach which was tiring because you are in a physical fight to overpower the helicopter to maintain control. It allowed the pilot to save his strength to fight the thing in for the much more complex landing itself. He would often just say that he was down, and I would immediately have to take over the ship, get landing clearance at a busy International Airport, and get the ship safely on the ground in front of the fire station, and shut it down with both a standard shut down and an emergency shut down. A lot like the tactics stuff on the ground, constant training for emergencies was critical. Working nights, I would usually fly the last flight when it was slow on the police side of the helicopter. I was usually flying at least thirty minutes to an hour a day. So.....not a pilot, but likely had more actual flying hours than many recreational helicopter pilots. The MD-500 was a really fun ship to both learn to fly and to fly in. Sort of the sports cars of the helicopter world.

[SGT_Calle]

Don't sell yourself short. You need to follow that up with Army Bandsman Fitness, Breaking Band Training: How Regular Guys Can Become Army Bandsmen, 100 Deadly Skills: The Bandsman's Guide to Eluding Pursuers, Evading Capture, and Surviving Any Dangerous Situation, and Bandsman Self Discipline. If you ever run out of SEAL books to knock off, which is highly unlikely, you can get a ghostwriter and do novels about an Army Bandsman and his elite band saving the world.

Talk about a niche market, I could be king!



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