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Thread: Importance of a rail on your handgun

  1. #111
    Very Pro Dentist Chuck Haggard's Avatar
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    It makes Baby Odin weep, he sobs uncontrollably in his crib, due to the amount of bad low-light training is going on out there.
    Last edited by Chuck Haggard; 11-23-2014 at 10:13 AM.

  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by mosin46 View Post
    seems to me that lights might be like tracers. they work both ways.
    I don't turn the light on and leave it on. Just because you have it, doesn't mean you ned to use it at that time. But if you have it, you have the option to use it.

    I spent about 20 years as a LEO without a WML before they were authorized. I can and have used just about every type of method for shooting with a hand held light. Some work better than others for me. But none work as well for me as using a two handed hold on my pistol when shooting. A WML permits a two handed hold for me. The best technique I ever used with a hand held light gives me about a 1.5 hand hold on my pistol.

    In my mind, putting rounds on target is the ultimate goal. A WML helps with this task.

  3. #113
    Member orionz06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mosin46 View Post
    seems to me that lights might be like tracers. they work both ways.
    Sure, but so does gunfire and verbal commands.

    Doesn't change the fact that we still need to see what we're shooting. Lights present a problem if use incorrectly so we train it instead of leave them at home.
    Think for yourself. Question authority.

  4. #114
    I am not really understanding the conflict here? Any piece of gear, equipment, weapon or tactic needs to be trained, practiced and self vetted. We need to understand when / how / why we use anything. Here are some things we can all ask ourselves. Below is my own ask / answer. Not everyone may be the same.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a handheld light vs. a weapon mounted light? Yes, most definitely. Quite frankly I do way more searching with a handheld light and yes that evil WML stays off.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a weapon mounted light over a handheld light? Again, most definitely.

    - If a light is attached to the weapon does that automatically stop me from using a handheld light? Of course not.

    - Would I be increasing or decreasing my potential advantages by having only one light source? Well that depends of course on the user and we can perhaps sit here and reference Hicks Law all day long, but if the training and practice is there, options or "tactical advantages" are a good thing. For myself both lights give me a distinct advantage in the number of techniques and tactics that I might be able to use.

    - Is there a recognizable Downside by having the light available on the weapon? No.

    - Is there a recognizable Upside by having a light available on the weapon? Yes.

    Training and understanding the benefit or advantage vs. any drawbacks or disadvantages and knowing when / how to deploy or use anything is the key. If you don't have the time or resources for purchasing, training and practice then simplifying things may be the answer. If you are narrow minded to the point where we mentally cannot get past Hicks Law, or mentally get past the light hanging off the weapon then keeping the scope of options narrowed might be better perhaps from a psychological standpoint. But if we have mental blocks that hinder our progress, then perhaps we might need to do a real "no shit" self evaluation.

  5. #115
    Oils and Lotions SME
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    I couldn't agree more.

    Quote Originally Posted by Surf View Post
    I am not really understanding the conflict here? Any piece of gear, equipment, weapon or tactic needs to be trained, practiced and self vetted. We need to understand when / how / why we use anything. Here are some things we can all ask ourselves. Below is my own ask / answer. Not everyone may be the same.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a handheld light vs. a weapon mounted light? Yes, most definitely. Quite frankly I do way more searching with a handheld light and yes that evil WML stays off.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a weapon mounted light over a handheld light? Again, most definitely.

    - If a light is attached to the weapon does that automatically stop me from using a handheld light? Of course not.

    - Would I be increasing or decreasing my potential advantages by having only one light source? Well that depends of course on the user and we can perhaps sit here and reference Hicks Law all day long, but if the training and practice is there, options or "tactical advantages" are a good thing. For myself both lights give me a distinct advantage in the number of techniques and tactics that I might be able to use.

    - Is there a recognizable Downside by having the light available on the weapon? No.

    - Is there a recognizable Upside by having a light available on the weapon? Yes.

    Training and understanding the benefit or advantage vs. any drawbacks or disadvantages and knowing when / how to deploy or use anything is the key. If you don't have the time or resources for purchasing, training and practice then simplifying things may be the answer. If you are narrow minded to the point where we mentally cannot get past Hicks Law, or mentally get past the light hanging off the weapon then keeping the scope of options narrowed might be better perhaps from a psychological standpoint. But if we have mental blocks that hinder our progress, then perhaps we might need to do a real "no shit" self evaluation.

  6. #116
    Site Supporter DocGKR's Avatar
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    Surf--excellent post!
    Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamara View Post
    Who would you suggest as an arbiter of my needs and my "level"?
    Given your level, probably yourself. I would also suggest that your level of expertise is relatively rare in the gun owning world, which is the problem. If everyone actually knew what they were doing many of these issues and questions would be non-issues.
    Last edited by David Armstrong; 11-25-2014 at 07:13 AM.
    "PLAN FOR YOUR TRAINING TO BE A REFLECTION OF REAL LIFE INSTEAD OF HOPING THAT REAL LIFE WILL BE A REFLECTION OF YOUR TRAINING!"

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drang View Post
    Rejoice! Taurus has heard your plea!
    Problem is that I only buy TDA Pistols from Sig/Beretta /HK .

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surf View Post
    I am not really understanding the conflict here? Any piece of gear, equipment, weapon or tactic needs to be trained, practiced and self vetted. We need to understand when / how / why we use anything. Here are some things we can all ask ourselves. Below is my own ask / answer. Not everyone may be the same.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a handheld light vs. a weapon mounted light? Yes, most definitely. Quite frankly I do way more searching with a handheld light and yes that evil WML stays off.

    - Are there times and places where I may find a distinct advantage to using a weapon mounted light over a handheld light? Again, most definitely.

    - If a light is attached to the weapon does that automatically stop me from using a handheld light? Of course not.

    - Would I be increasing or decreasing my potential advantages by having only one light source? Well that depends of course on the user and we can perhaps sit here and reference Hicks Law all day long, but if the training and practice is there, options or "tactical advantages" are a good thing. For myself both lights give me a distinct advantage in the number of techniques and tactics that I might be able to use.

    - Is there a recognizable Downside by having the light available on the weapon? No.

    - Is there a recognizable Upside by having a light available on the weapon? Yes.

    Training and understanding the benefit or advantage vs. any drawbacks or disadvantages and knowing when / how to deploy or use anything is the key. If you don't have the time or resources for purchasing, training and practice then simplifying things may be the answer. If you are narrow minded to the point where we mentally cannot get past Hicks Law, or mentally get past the light hanging off the weapon then keeping the scope of options narrowed might be better perhaps from a psychological standpoint. But if we have mental blocks that hinder our progress, then perhaps we might need to do a real "no shit" self evaluation.
    Excellent

  10. #120
    Member Wheeler's Avatar
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    The rail and the use of the potential accessories is relavent only to how the user intends to use it. Is a WML a good thing? Yes for most. Same with a laser. Is it necessary for an individual to do good work in no/low light conditions? Absolutely not.

    People should use what they are proficient with. Not all pistols come equipped with a rail and not everyone that owns a handgun will be convinced that they need one. To that end it's not necessary for those individuals.

    To be clear, I'm not arguing the potential advantages of a rail and a WML. Nor am I arguing the differences in speed, accuracy and overall proficiency provided. We live in an anecdotal world where 'good enough for my purposes' is the most commonly heard mantra. So a rail isn't 'necessary' but it's a good thing to have if one is going to utilize it.

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