Speer Gold Dot G2 147 grain PT 9mm

[VT1032]

Much like the Hornady Critical Duty and Winchester Ranger Bonded, the Speer G2 is engineered to perform more consistently across the full spectrum of FBI barrier test protocols. Other loads offer better performance in specific test criteria, but don't do as well against other scenarios. Each end user must decide what performance parameters are most important to their possible engagement scenarios and what features are lawful in their jurisdictions.

I know you are bound by an NDA, but just a few questions if you can answer them.

Were the results I got in the photos above at all consistent with what you have been seeing or was this a fluke and they normally hold together better in actual gel tests? I was surprised that it almost shed 2 of the petals in just water.

Would you consider these overall to be superior to the 147 HST's? Like I said above, I tried to use my remaining jugs to get one for comparison, but it passed through.

If you can't answer any questions, understood, but any input is appreciated.

[DocGKR]

Polymer tip handgun bullets do some strange things in water testing--that would not be my first choice in testing these...

As always, mission requirements and expected engagement scenarios drive equipment choices.

For my current needs, I am perfectly comfortable using the 147 gr HST I was issued for free.

[Chuck Haggard]

My Gold Dot 124+P penetrated three water jugs breaking the plastic on the fourth jug and fell inside the third jug with expansion like I have never seen on a 9mm round.
My HST 147+P penetrated the fourth jug and fell between the third and fourth jug and had normal expansion with all the petals pressed against the base of the bullet.
HST 147+P average expansion .699"
Gold Dot 124+P average expansion .936"
No petal breakage on either.

On another note all three 124gr. NATO rounds exited the side of the seventh jug near the rear not striking the #8 jug and were never found.
Was this side exit due to loss of velocity causing the round to go left or right?

Your NATO rounds likely started to yaw, which normally means a change in direction also.

[nycnoob]

DocGKR I have been hearing that "modern ammo" (like last 5 years) outperforms the older stuff. This has struck me as strange
as I do not hear much about incremental ammo improvements. Do you think I was hearing about agencies using the new G2?
or has all the ammo actually been getting better the last few years?

[Beat Trash]

DocGKR I have been hearing that "modern ammo" (like last 5 years) outperforms the older stuff. This has struck me as strange
as I do not hear much about incremental ammo improvements. Do you think I was hearing about agencies using the new G2?
or has all the ammo actually been getting better the last few years?

Or it can take forever to get approval to change ammo. We carried the Winchester 147 gr JHP white box loading until 2012. A lot of people had to be convinced there was an issue with the issued ammunition in order to justify the switch. When this load work, it worked well enough. But sometimes it plugged up with clothing and body matter. This was the selling point that got us authorization to switch to the Winchester Ranger T 147 loading. Only because new leadership was able and willing to gather the data of inconsistent expansion during several of our recent (at that time) OIS incidents.

When I retire and I run out of the issued 147 gr Ranger ammunition, I'll most likely try to obtain some of this new G2 loading to carry in my guns. But for now, I'm more concerned about shot placement and good tactics than I am about carrying the Ranger T 147 load.

[Chuck Haggard]

I'm not sure why nycnoob, I see and hear about stuff like this regularly, although much more a few years ago than now.

Even within a line of ammo improvements happen. The first version of the 124gr +P Gold Dot didn't perform nearly as well as the current version, I got to see those improvements first hand and be a party to talking to Speer about what we were seeing on the street.

[Jeep]

This projectile is obviously designed to expand, where as the Sierra MatchKings were not.

Yes--but if the purpose of the expansion is to avoid over-penetration and the resulting potential injury to civilians, one could argue that "customary international law" recognizes that as a greater good that trumps the pre-engineered bullets provisions of the Hague convention, and point to the fact that the world's police forces are now moving to expanding bullets for that purpose.

To put it in a slightly different context, if the groups now campaigning against land mines could be persuaded to also campaign against FMJ pistol bullets because of their potential for wounding children do you have any doubt that the bureaucrats at the State Department might try to persuade the military to adopt hollow point pistol rounds?

These days most "international law" has little to do with law but much to do with the currents among political liberals in Europe and North America. Tap into that and this restriction could be eliminated, I believe.

[Sparks2112]

I was VERY surprised when I shot the G2 in gel. Top row is all G2. There is a fifth round that made it through 32" of Gel that was not recovered. I assume it failed to expand as well. Bottom row is 124gr +P GD, 147gr HST, and 115gr +P Barnes respectively.

I assume I have a bad lot of ammo, but it was still interesting to see.

[MVS]

That is very interesting John.

[Sparks2112]

That is very interesting John.

It'd be a little more interesting to me if I hadn't just purchased 1800 rounds of very very expensive FMJ...