FBI Study Finds, Surprise, Surprise, mass shootings are over before cops arrive

[cclaxton]

Page 8 has the Findings. Here is a critical quote:

"The findings also reflect the damage that can occur in a matter of minutes. In 64
incidents where the duration of the incident could be ascertained, 44 (69.0%) of 64
incidents ended in 5 minutes or less, with 23 ending in 2 minutes or less. Even when law
enforcement was present or able to respond within minutes, civilians often had to make
life and death decisions, and, therefore, should be engaged in training and discussions on
decisions they may face. In 6 incidents (and, in addition, at least 4 schools), officers were on the scene when the shooting began.


As expected, therefore, many incidents ended before police arrived. Of the 160
incidents, at least 107 (66.9%) ended before police arrived and could engage the shooter,
either because a citizen intervened, the shooter fled, or the shooter committed suicide or
was killed by someone at the scene."
Source: Federal Bureau of Investigation, 2014

http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2014...-2000-and-2013

This reminds me of a IDPA Match Director who said, "Sometimes Sh*t happens fast!" when I complained about how fast a disappearing target disappeared.
Cody

[GardoneVT]

It is amazing how so many misguided souls think the numbers nine ,one, and one will magically save them When Evil Happens. No disrespect to Law Enforcement, but the concept is like calling the Auto Insurance Hotline to prevent an accident . A cell phone has the same ability to stop a madman's bullet as it does a drunk driver-none.

[JM Campbell]

Doesn't matter, the anti gun lobby will call it lies regardless of the source.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk

[orionz06]

Active shooter policy at work seems reasonable and the training referenced some of this.

[Lomshek]

Active shooter policy at work seems reasonable and the training referenced some of this.

There are still way too many agencies who plan to wait until there are more than two officers on scene to make entry. Common sense should have told everyone the results of this study years ago but no one wants to consider that changing protocols so radically as to say first one on scene goes in like a bat out of hell would be a good idea.

Hopefully since it's on paper by the feds more agencies will quit working harder to establish site control than solving the problem.

[Chuck Haggard]

This is one of the reasons I wrote that article ref solo officer response to active-shooter incidents, and I often piss people off noting that one does not have time to jock up or form teams before getting to work.
Lots of folks trying to sell active-shooter gear that one has zero time to use.

[KeeFus]

This is one of the reasons I wrote that article ref solo officer response to active-shooter incidents, and I often piss people off noting that one does not have time to jock up or form teams before getting to work.
Lots of folks trying to sell active-shooter gear that one has zero time to use.

^^^This. The only thing I have practiced doing (gear wise) in an active shooter incident is grabbing my 'jump bag' which sits on the front passenger seat. The only thing it has is 2 extended mags (14 rounds), 3 regular mags (10 rounds), a box of ammo and 2 officer down kits (TacMed solutions...Thanks Tom!), and a bottle of water.

Getting all 'kitted up' on an active shooter response wastes too much time.

[cclaxton]

The point of the FBI findings is not to try and improve LEO response times, but an admission that it will never be fast enough. Six of these incidents had LE's on site. It therefore is focusing on how targeted organizations should react. They should train in how to react to an active shooter situation, such as lock down versus evacuation, etc.. They also mentioned the role that armed citizen's may play in stopping the perpetrator.

I think this is a siren-call for ordinary citizens to train well, carry whenever possible, develop their shooting skills, and to roll back restrictions on where we can carry.
Cody

[JV_]

The point of the FBI findings is not to try and improve LEO response times, but an admission that it will never be fast enough.

I think it's both. While many of the incidents were over before police arrived, that's not all, and the stats may be different if the police were able to respond faster. You can make improvements in all areas, there's no need to focus on one.

[Chuck Haggard]

I think it's both. While many of the incidents were over before police arrived, that's not all, and the stats may be different if the police were able to respond faster. You can make improvements in all areas, there's no need to focus on one.

^This^

Sometimes LE response is in fact fast enought to make a difference, was on one of the two I have been to.