When is it too soon to get on the trigger?

[jetfire]

There is a potential downside - if you get on the trigger really really too early, you can get a trip to the DQ.

I do think the important thing that we've hit on is the "Decision to fire" bit; and how that by itself makes a huge difference in when we start tickling that trigger.

[GJM]

There is a potential downside - if you get on the trigger really really too early, you can get a trip to the DQ.

different game, I am talking about test 1 and 2 at Rogers.

[Mr_White]

different game, I am talking about test 1 and 2 at Rogers.

You having shot much more DA/SA and Rogers than I, do you think starting with finger on the trigger of a DA gun in extended confirmed ready gains you anything on Rogers tests 1 and 2? Or any of the other Rogers tests?

[PPGMD]

Yet he starts with finger on the trigger with DA/SA guns in extended ready, lightly touching and what not. To me it is one of confirmations of what we talked about yesterday; different triggers perhaps could be handled differently.

Exactly the gun you are shooting will factor in on when you start prepping the trigger. I get on the trigger much earlier with my M&P than I do with my 1911, and compared to my Sig it is also much later on the press out.

As a matter of commonality, I don't want my finger on the trigger, regardless of platform type.

I don't remember if Todd or SLG has stated this, but I think part of the reason for the SIMP is that if you believe in trigger prep you have to spend time adapting to the different guns.

[YVK]

You having shot much more DA/SA and Rogers than I, do you think starting with finger on the trigger of a DA gun in extended confirmed ready gains you anything on Rogers tests 1 and 2? Or any of the other Rogers tests?

Not directed to me, but I'll take it anyway .
The answer is yes, it does. The more extended you are with a DA trigger, the more handicapped you are by it. Test one, for example, the body shot is a "drive by" shot, as you remember. Even little pause throws you back (don't ask me how I know).

I agree with you that there's no reason to keep it on the trigger. I actually do understand the rationale of touching that trigger of FS type Beretta but, once safety status is verified, I don't get it why that finger should be left on, or why Beretta practice should be extended to all TDA guns. My cynical explanation is "to meet test times".

[Mr_White]

Test one, for example, the body shot is a "drive by" shot, as you remember. Even little pause throws you back (don't ask me how I know).

It's possible that video review would tell me otherwise, but I think I did stop the gun on the body target spot for that first shot...

[YVK]

That's because you don't know how to shoot Rogers tests...

:-D

Day two, when I did pause, I got whole of 5 points on test one. Also, observing less speedy shooters, I thought that removing the stop on a body shot was a low hanging fruit for improvement.

[JustOneGun]

In a self defense setting: To avoid shooting yourself while using the same draw from a variety of positions it seems that putting your finger on the trigger before the pistol is parallel to the ground might cause problems (I.e. sitting). When parallel, if you accidentally press the trigger and the bullet misses the target you have no idea what it will hit. So in reality deciding when you put your finger on the trigger comes down to, if it goes off before you want it to, will you miss the target with the resulting loss of life/freedom that may occur?

Watching novice shooters draw and shoot I came to a very obvious conclusion, unless you put the sights on the target, stop moving and then put your finger on the trigger any accidental breaking of the trigger will probably result in a miss. I learned to shoot this way. Over time and experience I improved my efficiency and thus speed. I got fairly fast. Then I learned to cheat by prepping the trigger right before my front sight stopped moving on the center of the target. So I technically violate safety rules every time I shoot. I think it's a violation because of when I actually see the front sight and my inability to tell distance under severe tunnel vision during a real gunfight. Hint I will then not see the front sight while beginning to touch the trigger, while I see the sight at the beginning of the prep process just fine during training.

Watching a few videos of exceptional shooters, no matter the draw type, most prep the trigger before the pistol is done moving and not at all close to being on target. They are doing two things at once in order to save time. And why not, it is their life on the line?

We are all betting the trigger won't break too soon because of our experience and training. If it does break too soon in a dynamic shoot and move gunfight I will probably miss. If bad guy stands in front of me like my paper targets then I have a chance of hitting them. Many people use the latter idea and say that's why they safely prep the trigger early. That is a calculated bet. How far are you really from the target? Will an early shot hit it? Tunnel vision makes it hard to tell your distance (i.e. your brain lies to you).

So at best I stretch the safety rule because I disagree with a literal interpretation of what is "on target". At worst I just plain break it where I would never had done so as a new shooter and my then poor trigger control. Just because that super shooting gun guy does it doesn't mean you as a new shooter should. The answer to many gun questions depends on where we are in our training progression and the chances/bets you are willing to take.

[LSP552]

For defense/offensive use, I don't want my finger in the trigger guard unless I'm driving the gun to the target and have made the decision to shoot. With both those conditions met, I will start prepping the trigger of a DA/SA SIG a bit earlier than a Glock, but not so early in the extension that a premature shot is going off the target. If I'm in a low/compressed/high/whatever ready position, I want my finger on the frame and not the trigger, until the gun is oriented to the target and I've decided to shoot.

IMO, pointing guns at folks in a high-stress situation is no time to be trigger checking or creeping on the trigger early. An early round into the dirt in a match could just as easily smack someone's grandma in the leg elsewhere.

[GJM]

In a self defense setting: To avoid shooting yourself while using the same draw from a variety of positions it seems that putting your finger on the trigger before the pistol is parallel to the ground might cause problems (I.e. sitting). When parallel, if you accidentally press the trigger and the bullet misses the target you have no idea what it will hit. So in reality deciding when you put your finger on the trigger comes down to, if it goes off before you want it to, will you miss the target with the resulting loss of life/freedom that may occur?

I think you need to consider a variety of scenarios.

1) you put your finger on the trigger early, and trigger a shot harming yourself or someone else.

2) you put the finger on later, and miss, harming someone else or yourself, by virtue of missing.

3) you put your finger on later, and never get the shot off, harming yourself or someone else by virtue of not shooting.

I think folks need to work out what method is correct for their ability and the pistol they shoot. Then test the heck out of it to determine whether the reality of their ability, platform and technique meshes with what exactly happens. Ideally, subject it to the stress of competition, training and on-demand performance in front of others, to see what they really do when the "buzzer" goes off.