What could/should USPSA do to attract the average CCW holder

[PPGMD]

What do people mean when they say 3-2-1 or 2-2-1 stage layouts?

It refers the number of short and medium courses for every long course.

I think the biggest problem with USPSA (not attracting the average CCW holder) is that there are too many rules. To make things worse, the rules change and new rules are added frequently (in a relative sense). It's like the federal government creating more an more laws and regulations all the time . . . I don't know how big the USPSA rule book is now, but it's big. It's very difficult for a relatively new shooter, an experienced shooter who is relatively new to competition shooting, or even the occasional competition shooter to get comfortable and competent in USPSA matches.

Yes there are more rules, but for the most part they are rules that the average shooter doesn't need to know about. And USPSA rule changes are announced at least a year ahead of time before they are enforced, that gives plenty of time to fix issues and even have a rule completely overruled (like the production trigger pull weight rule).

[Jared]

Move to TIME+ Scoring, and dump the sponsored shirts, provide opportunities for use of cover, and stop making fun of people (Or orgs) who aren't as great a shooter as YOU...that is not aimed at anyone in particular....just saying...plenty of ego going around in USPSA. The "EGO crushing comment" is a perfect example of the arrogance that scares people away. Learn to be good coaches.
Cody

I definitely would not want the scoring system changed. I think the hit factor scoring system is one of the best things about USPSA.

As far as the sponsor shirts, I don't get the issue. I've seen so many shooters wearing those that nowadays, I just don't even notice. Even before my first match, I was hip to the fact that a fancy Tech Wear jersey don't necessarily mean the dude wearing it is a god. Today, I think of a sponsor jersey the same way I think of the t-shirts my employer give out every so often. Simply, it's just a shirt with your employers logo on it, nothing more.

One can use cover as much as they like in USPSA, although I do agree that maybe most people don't realize it.

I've never been to a USPSA club where I would describe the match officials as arrogant. I've met a shooter or two that maybe was, but in all honesty, I meet far more arrogant people in my daily life than I ever have on a range. I don't think I've ever seen the USPSA organization make fun of another shooting organization. I could have missed it, so I'm not saying it's never happened, but I ain't seen it. Now as far as individual shooters ripping other org's, I don't see how the USPSA as a whole can control that.

[JV_]

As far as the sponsor shirts, I don't get the issue.

Neither do I.

And what they don't need is a rule book littered with large sections focused around things like the dress code.

[Jared]

If your local USPSA club's top shooters max out at B or C class, is there a lot of "premier" or "ego crushing" anything going on? Having shot in a few of those, guys shooting production or limited in practical gear can remain quite competitive, and the matches have a very regular-guy tone overall. Even with some space guns and polyester shirts.

What are the stats for distribution of classifications, number of divisions, etc across clubs? Anyone keep them?

I don't know the stats across clubs, and honestly wouldn't know where to find them.

As far as the top classed shooters at a club go, that can really vary. In some areas, Limited may be the most talent stacked division, in others it could be Production. I know at the locals I've shot, Limited usually had a deeper talent pool. Interestingly enough, when I was at our sectional match last year, the Production division brought in 4 GM's, while I think Limited topped out with an M.

I would roughly estimate that a reasonably well attended club probably has at least an A in Open, Limited, and Production. How ego crushing a shooter finds shooting against a solid A class shooter is really on them. I never had my ego crushed by shooting USPSA. I have learned a lot about where I really stacked up, but I don't consider that crushing, just motivating.

[rob_s]

t specifics of local clubs largely override philosophical preferences.

This is the truth of the single biggest reason any one person shoots one game over another. All the rest of the douche-y defense of a choice based on feelings is just that.

You can't market that.

[Fourtrax]

Funny, I hear a bunch of sour grapes. Like a couple of grade school kids bickering.

First, USPSA rules are pretty simple and frankly, don't change very often. I think it's difficult to get a damn rule change myself.

Second, I wear a sponsor shirt.......drops my times by 5% ..........low drag baby. If some shooters wearing fancy shirts scare you off, well then that brings me to ........

Third, do you know how to tell if you have a fragile ego? I sure do.

Fourth, cover is everywhere in USPSA matches, I know of IDPA shooters who have a blast shooting our matches and using our cover. We just don't force you to use cover. Basically, it's your PIE, eat it how you want, we won't be subjective.

USPSA can probably market a little better in some regards, but for some, as with all things, it would never be enough.

Grab your gear and drive to us, free thinking shooters will have a blast.

[YVK]

Grab your gear and drive to us.

You too. Come show some technical superiority and crush some egos, it will be fun for all of us.

[Mr_White]

I know of 1 person who thinks USPSA should have a "defense" division where LEO's and CCW could shoot their carry gear and not be bumped to a different division albeit for gear placement or minor rule difference. But there are other options

I have envisioned 'Duty and Carry' Division. It would be an amalgam of Open, Limited, and Production. Production-type guns, perhaps a little more restrictive than current Production rules allow. Mag pouches and holsters don't have to be behind the hip. Concealment or retention gear required. Magazines filled to capacity, with some limit on length of magazine. Lasers, WML, and slide-mounted mini RDS allowed. Minor scoring for everyone.

Frankly, I have become largely convinced that, as cool as I think this hypothetical division would be, it's completely unnecessary. Almost no one would shoot that division, at least initially. Any of the people who would fit 'better' in Duty and Carry are already able to shoot an existing division if they want (Open, Limited, Limited-10, or Production.) I'm sure it is a major undertaking to create a new Division and it should be done pretty conservatively.

I have brought maybe ~8-10 new shooters to USPSA. They aren't new shooters, they already do defensive pistol training, but they are new to competitive shooting. They really enjoy it, and don't have a problem playing the game straight up under the existing rules. They pretty much all shoot Production, though also Limited or Limited-10 occasionally. I sold them on trying it on the basis of technical challenge and problem-solving stages solely according to their own wishes instead of someone else's vision of tactics. We already practice tactics according to our own views in defensive training all the time. We don't need that from a competition.

Heck I saw a group with jerseys at a GSSF match.

Lol, I am the captain of a GSSF team. We have polos though.

Yes there are more rules, but for the most part they are rules that the average shooter doesn't need to know about.

I agree. It seems like there are fewer rules that the shooter actually needs to deal with.

[Failure2Stop]

I have envisioned 'Duty and Carry' Division. It would be an amalgam of Open, Limited, and Production. Production-type guns, perhaps a little more restrictive than current Production rules allow. Mag pouches and holsters don't have to be behind the hip. Concealment or retention gear required. Magazines filled to capacity, with some limit on length of magazine. Lasers, WML, and slide-mounted mini RDS allowed. Minor scoring for everyone.

I completely agree.

And also agree that it probably isn't going to bring in anybody that isn't already shooting.


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[PPGMD]

Lol, I am the captain of a GSSF team. We have polos though.

Just to reinforce that the jersey doesn't mean you shoot well. There was a group there at the GSSF match I shot. I was far enough away that I didn't see the dude's score or time, so I asked him a question about why he shot the near targets first and he said "Because I can point shoot them." After the match looking at the results I was over 28 seconds faster on the final score. Imagine how fast I would've been if I wore my jersey?