Witnessed Model 1911 600yd shot

[BLR]

Probably deleted - that seems to be a growing trend on M4C.

But as for the rail replacement - me neither. I'm not familiar with Glock at an armorer level and don't know what it takes to get that sort of work done. Pure speculation but is it possible to replace rails on the same frame (not a typical option but for someone like Defoor maybe Glock did him a solid)?

It is not. They are molded into the plastic. If I were to make a WAG about this, I'd say this was multiple frames at a minimum.

[Tamara]

Pure speculation but is it possible to replace rails on the same frame...

This would be the first I've been aware of it.

[JV_]

Pure speculation but is it possible to replace rails on the same frame (not a typical option but for someone like Defoor maybe Glock did him a solid)?

No idea, but either way, there are important tidbits about that gun that we should have if we're going to use it as some type of standard.

Broken rails are more than just a worn out springs and a barrel.

[hossb7]

It is not. They are molded into the plastic. If I were to make a WAG about this, I'd say this was multiple frames at a minimum.

This would be the first I've been aware of it.

No idea, but either way, there are important tidbits about that gun that we should have if we're going to use it as some type of standard.

Broken rails are more than just a worn out springs and a barrel.

Hmm. Then I don't know what the specifics would have been.

[Lomshek]

Why do you say that? Based on what? What makes a handgun different than any other machine?

I think this is the crux of Bill's point.

If a handgun were actually engineered for optimum endurance and manufactured to a properly fitted spec with ideal materials & surface treatments they could last for far beyond what we think is normal and shoot more accurately than we accept. We'd probably end up with guns that could survive hundreds of thousands of rounds with just some spring replacement (not as often as current springs need replaced) and have sub 2" 25 yards pistols out of the box.

Since most consumers think 200 rounds per year is a lot and hitting a milk jug at 15 yards with a few rounds out of a magazine is great manufacturers cater to the easier demographic and leave the high end .0001% of shooters to deal with it.

This is just like the bicycle industry. Most folks consider a 10 mile ride long and couldn't conceive of riding 1000 miles per year much less 10,000. If companies designed bicycles around the elite few they'd cost a bit more and last nearly forever but almost no one would notice. Meanwhile the manufacturers would lose sales to the company that designs bikes around the average user and sells them for $150 less while keeping profits high. It frustrates me to no end but I understand the logic.

[GardoneVT]

I think this is the crux of Bill's point.

If a handgun were actually engineered for optimum endurance and manufactured to a properly fitted spec with ideal materials & surface treatments they could last for far beyond what we think is normal and shoot more accurately than we accept. We'd probably end up with guns that could survive hundreds of thousands of rounds with just some spring replacement (not as often as current springs need replaced) and have sub 2" 25 yards pistols out of the box.

Since most consumers think 200 rounds per year is a lot and hitting a milk jug at 15 yards with a few rounds out of a magazine is great manufacturers cater to the easier demographic and leave the high end .0001% of shooters to deal with it.

This is just like the bicycle industry. Most folks consider a 10 mile ride long and couldn't conceive of riding 1000 miles per year much less 10,000. If companies designed bicycles around the elite few they'd cost a bit more and last nearly forever but almost no one would notice. Meanwhile the manufacturers would lose sales to the company that designs bikes around the average user and sells them for $150 less while keeping profits high. It frustrates me to no end but I understand the logic.

You see this effect going the other way with cars.

Wasn't too long ago a car going past 100,000 miles on the original motor and transmission was pretty exceptional.

[Wayne Dobbs]

Rails are molded into the frame when it is poured into the mold. Therefore, the premise that Kyle's were "replaced" is suspect. Glock may have replaced a frame, but didn't replace the rails. I've been a certified Glock armorer since 1989 and have the advanced certification and more actual time on the gun as armorer, instructor and carrier than this old guy wants to admit.

[jetfire]

At what juncture is "a gun" not the same gun it was from the factory? Or are they like my dad's old axe that's had 3 new handles and two heads, but it's still the same axe.

I mean, replacing the frame is a pretty obvious one, but what about barrels and slides?

[JAD]

.

Wasn't too long ago a car going past 100,000 miles on the original motor and transmission was pretty exceptional.

LOLwut?

[Lomshek]

You see this effect going the other way with cars.

Wasn't too long ago a car going past 100,000 miles on the original motor and transmission was pretty exceptional.

Bingo! Because the average driver drives lots more miles than they did 40+ years ago and demands a vehicle that won't leave them stranded.

ETA

LOLwut?

Some folks definition of "not long ago" is skewed by their age. My 72 year old dad is an example.
(not saying Gardone is an old man)