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Thread: Safeties - How do we (or not) adapt to them?

  1. #51
    Site Supporter Slavex's Avatar
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    Feb 2011
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    after struggling with the safeties on my Tanfoglio Stock II and finally getting a Shadow, I then discovered the flush safeties while in Czech. For me that was the "moment", I hate manual safeties on pistols, hate, hate hate them. I hate grip safeties even more. At least on the 1911 I can get a proper grip and thumb placement on the safeties, whereas on my CZ or Tan, no dice. No matter what I did I'd end up engaging the safety while shooting, my thumb could not override my grip pushing up. With the flush safeties I don't have to worry about it.
    As for mag disconnects, I know of 3 people who were either seriously injured or died as a result of not being able to fire their pistol when the mag came out, one was a pretty highly publicized case of a female RCMP member in her car. I don't recall the whole thing right now, but the general feeling was if she could have gotten even that one shot off, she might have survived. I am certainly no expert on carry pistols and their use, but I'd never carry one with a mag safety if I was given a choice.
    ...and to think today you just have fangs

    Rob Engh
    BC, Canada

  2. #52
    We are diminished
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    Feb 2011
    The only response I have to the "my finger is all the safety I need" crowd is, it must be nice to be have that much faith in personal perfection under the threat of lethal stress. And if you can be described as such, more power to you. But understand that most folks aren't infallible. Heck, I've even see people have NDs at matches!

    Slavex, regarding the mag disconnect, I'd be very interested in seeing the details of those instances if you can get hold of them. I know Smith used to have file drawers full of reports of cops whose lives were saved by mag disconnects during gun grabs, and that obviously doesn't even begin to reach all the instances someone might have had an accident clearing a weapon or administratively handling one but was saved from their own errors by the mag disconnect.

    I'm not necessarily an advocate of the mag disconnect, it's just something that so many people have demonized that I think our community sort of turns off the critical thinking when it comes up and blindly accepts the "OMG I might need that one bullet!" as supreme reason.

  3. #53
    Site Supporter Slavex's Avatar
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    The one that sticks out the most in my mind right now is the one with the female RCMP officer who's mag came out of the gun during a car chase and crash and the badguy popped shots into her and she couldn't fire back the one round she had. I'll see if I can dig up info on it and the others.
    I fully accept that there are going to be those those that have been saved by them, but how many stories have you heard about guys fighting for control of their gun, and the mag coming out, but they do manage to shoot the perp with the one round that's left? I've heard a lot of those stories over the years, usually from police who have had mag safeties at some point in their career.
    Regarding the trigger finger being all I need for safety, again, not a tacticool god or anything, but I've done a lot of FOF with the local police, which I understand is not anywhere near as stressful as a real gunfight, with no issues. Now was I using my CZ in those FOF? No, we were using Glocks, but I still found myself indexing the trigger finger the same way when off target. Were I to run a 1911, I might consider doing as you do Todd, but most likely not in a match.
    ...and to think today you just have fangs

    Rob Engh
    BC, Canada

  4. #54
    We are diminished
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    Feb 2011
    Robbie -- That's why I'm not going to say "everyone should have a mag disconnect." Depending on what you imagine as the most likely threat and solution maybe it's a life-saver or maybe it's a life-risker. We cannot predict in advance with 100% accuracy which will be the right answer. If I could wave a wand and get a mag disconnect put in my SIGs ... I probably would. But there's a reason why 99% of SIGs ship without a mag disconnect. Perhaps, as I like to say... clue?

  5. #55
    Site Supporter Irelander's Avatar
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    Venango County, PA
    Quote Originally Posted by NETim View Post
    No problem. I can see no difference in practice. A Glock wouldn't be leveled and on target at that point either. "Snicking" off the safety occurs shortly after acquiring the grip and is a simultaneous part of the process, not an additional step.
    I was taught that the manual safety is disengaged during the press out. Is that not the preferred method? I'm a Glock man but just got a 1911. I too am trying to adapt to the safety. I won't be carrying the 1911 until I have it mastered.

  6. #56
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    Apr 2014
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    Seattle
    I don't think there is any science to this topic because there aren't enough condition 1 shootings, and it is really hard to tell what a real encounter is going to be like without starting the scenario by getting your ass kicked.

    Most practiced shooting scenarios are only realistic if you believe your attacker is most likely to attack you from 5 yards with harsh language.

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