Just when you thought that IDPA was done with the stupid ideas...

[Alpha Sierra]

I'll give a little background about myself before I weigh in on this issue. I first joined IDPA around 2001. I've been most active in the last few years. I'm an SO. I regularly shoot local matches and I'm often running a squad. I've competed in about half a dozen sanctioned matches. I've worked the New England Regional match the last two years. I'm classified as Expert in a couple divisions, Sharpshooter in another. I competed in S&W Indoor Nationals last year and had signed up for the match this year.

I am also a member of USPSA, but only shot a couple matches last year. That will change this year.

I chose not to attend this years Indoor Nationals (even though I had registered and paid my fee) because of Code of Conduct that we were required to sign.

I have no problem with a match having a code of conduct that requires good sportsmanship and safe gun handling. No one likes competitors behaving badly and when it comes to safe gun handling, that is not up for debate.

But this Code of Conduct went far beyond that. I won't always be a champion of IDPA and I will not agree to be muzzled. Frankly, I probably wouldn't have said anything about the IDPA rules at the match -- I would have been too busy figuring out my stage plan and visualizing it, and bitching would have reduced my focus.

But I simply will not abide when someone tells me to shut the heck up. And that is what IDPA has been doing lately.

When it comes to the new rules, IMO IDPA blew it. The flat-footed reloads rule is, in my opinion, simply wrong. Their justification of it -- tactical Teddy's told us so -- is simply not believable. Are there situations where it makes a lot more sense to complete a reload while stationary? Absolutely. In fact, probably most of the time. On the other hand, there are situations when it might make sense to run like heck while reloading, and reloading on the move is a valuable defensive skill.

I have tried to change IDPA from within. I sent comments on the proposed rules to IDPA HQ. Joyce gave their response in the Tactical Journal -- "IDPA isn't for everyone." In other words, shut the heck up or leave.

The latest clarification of the rules made it worse. Now, even while at a single point of cover, you can't move your feet while reloading because that would be "advancing to another point of cover." In other words, a single point of cover is now no longer a single point of cover.

And then we get to the S&W Indoor Nationals and Joyce's decision to make up rules or ignore rules as she pleases. National matches must publish their courses of fire 14 days prior to the match. That is in the new rule book. At this year's SWIN, they posted the COF two days before the match. When I pointed this out to Joyce, she said (I paraphrase) "I won't criticize the SOs because they are working so hard preparing for the match." Well, you know what? I've helped set up the NER two years in a row. I know how hard it is. But if she isn't going to enforce the rule, then why is it in the rule book? She wouldn't answer that.

Were there safe tables at this year's SWIN? The rule book requires them. There weren't any at last year's SWIN. Yet another rule ignored by Joyce and company.

Last year's SWIN had an illegal stage. Another rule ignored.

I know the guys running SWIN. They are good guys. They work hard. I know about the accident at Hartford and the individual being sued. I contributed to his defense fund at the last NER. This isn't personal against the guys at SWIN.i

Regarding the positive comments about NER, those are greatly appreciated. I know that in the past couple years the MDs at NER tried hard to make stages that were challenging for Master level shooters but also completable by Marksmen. Masters could go for the gusto, take risks and maybe make up a lot of time. But the goal wasn't to have Marksmen screwed by targets that disappeared before they could clear their holster.

In my opinion, some of IDPA's problems stem from the fact that the folks in charge (Joyce Fowler, Rob Ray, etc.) are basically marksmen (despite what their classifications might be). They simply make bad decisions.

A number of my shooter friends have made similar decisions about IDPA. Two long time shooters that are buddies went to USPSA exclusively last year. I know a distinguished master who is tossing it in for the same reasons. And I know a safety officer instructor who is doing the same.

It is a mistake to dismiss us as malcontents and dismiss our criticisms. These people getting chased away are the backbone of IDPA. We are the SOs and MDs. We are the people who write the courses of fire, get their early for setup, and stay late for tear down. And many of us have had enough with the arrogance of IDPA HQ.

This post just closed my decision to not renew my membership.

[_JD_]

Flat footed reloads: Tactical?



Sticking you're entire head out past cover....tactical?

Sent via Tapatalk and still using real words.

[jetfire]

Flat footed reloads: Tactical?



Sticking you're entire head out past cover....tactical?

Sent via Tapatalk and still using real words.

Making tactical judgements about an IDPA stage that you can't see all of isn't very smart. I mean, I know where that camera was placed and where the targets were on that stage, because I was there.

Of course, any discussion that involves "tactics" and "IDPA" is doomed to a horrid death anyway. Seriously, no thinks IDPA is teaching serious tactics. Can't we just let that horse die?

[MDS]

Seriously, no thinks IDPA is teaching serious tactics. Can't we just let that horse die?

It needs tenderizing, first, so after it dies we can make asajo and continue the discussion over dinner.

You know what I hate about idpa? The whole-day commitment. Do the rules allow for relays of small squads, each shooting all the stages in about an hour? Works well for fitting kstg into a busy Tuesday, any reason it wouldn't scale to at least club-level idpa matches?

[orionz06]

It needs tenderizing, first, so after it dies we can make asajo and continue the discussion over dinner.

You know what I hate about idpa? The whole-day commitment. Do the rules allow for relays of small squads, each shooting all the stages in about an hour? Works well for fitting kstg into a busy Tuesday, any reason it wouldn't scale to at least club-level idpa matches?

To shoot 100 rounds...

[cclaxton]

It needs tenderizing, first, so after it dies we can make asajo and continue the discussion over dinner.

You know what I hate about idpa? The whole-day commitment. Do the rules allow for relays of small squads, each shooting all the stages in about an hour? Works well for fitting kstg into a busy Tuesday, any reason it wouldn't scale to at least club-level idpa matches?

Most local matches are done within 4 hours. Some clubs require shooters to help set up and tear down, so that adds another hour. There are a few that will have 1 hour slots for about 5-6 shooters. For sanctioned matches, there are three types: half-day formats, whole day formats and multi-day formats (which really only happens at the Carolina Cup). This will depend a lot on the Match Director. The one-hour club matches are usually limited to 4 short stages. The 4 hour IDPA matches are usually 6 more challenging stages (such as drop-turners, movers, etc.), and sanctioned matches will have the most challenging types of stages. When I shoot Annapolis, which is a 4 hour club match, I usually shoot about 150 rounds unless they convert to a steel match due to weather. For the Carolina Cup, it will be about 300-350 rounds. But the point of IDPA is not to shoot a lot of rounds, but to focus on testing skills on very difficult courses of fire (i.e. shooting while moving, shooting moving targets, disappearing targets, managing cover, slicing the pie, etc.), so the FOCUS is different.
Cody

[LeonardRockstein]

You know what I hate about idpa? The whole-day commitment. Do the rules allow for relays of small squads, each shooting all the stages in about an hour? Works well for fitting kstg into a busy Tuesday, any reason it wouldn't scale to at least club-level idpa matches?

I understand the complaint, but whenever I shoot a USPSA match it takes forever as all the gamers spend at least 20 mins strategizing, and when its their turn to shoot they do like 10 practice draws, turn their red dot on and off 3 times, check their magazine 3 times, scuff their feet for 10 seconds, airgun for another 30 seconds, and then give the nod.

IDPA can get alot like that but at lease there is no delay for an epic 20 minute stage strategy session. Anyways these games are alot more fun when you yell "LEEROY JENKINS!" and run through the course doing things inefficiently and shooting one handed when you don't need to.

[ST911]

Anyways these games are alot more fun when you yell "LEEROY JENKINS!" and run through the course doing things inefficiently and shooting one handed when you don't need to.

Next match.

Thanks for that.

[orionz06]

I understand the complaint, but whenever I shoot a USPSA match it takes forever as all the gamers spend at least 20 mins strategizing, and when its their turn to shoot they do like 10 practice draws, turn their red dot on and off 3 times, check their magazine 3 times, scuff their feet for 10 seconds, airgun for another 30 seconds, and then give the nod.

IDPA can get alot like that but at lease there is no delay for an epic 20 minute stage strategy session. Anyways these games are alot more fun when you yell "LEEROY JENKINS!" and run through the course doing things inefficiently and shooting one handed when you don't need to.

This stuff still happens at IDPA. Perhaps not as bad but it is still a game and the players still do gamer things. Maybe they don't check the laces on their Salomons as often but they still do all that crap.

[ToddG]

If you're going to a match for the round count, you're doing it wrong.