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I have noticed that each of my wife's Gen 3 triggers (stock or LW - connector) feel noticeably better than my Gen 4 triggers (stock, except a LW - connector). Assuming our experience is typical, is that just the way it is, or is there something that can be done to bring Gen 4 triggers to Gen 3 pull characteristics?
The connector sits in the housing at a slightly different angle, it produces a different (heavier) pull. I used a Ghost 3.5# connector in my Gen4 19s, it produced a trigger weight of about 5#.
does replacing the trigger with trigger bar from a gen3 change anything? i'm looking to put a flat trigger on my gen4 g19 and wasnt sure if the dot on the gen4 makes a difference.
It doesn't make that big of a difference.
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If you are referring to the . connector the trigger pull is about 8oz. lighter than a 5.5# connector and about 8oz. heavier than a 4.5# connector.Quote:
Originally Posted by turbolag23
What are you referring to when you say you are going to put a flat trigger on your G19?
Sounds like a 1911 trigger.
The compact & subcompact Glocks have a stepped/serrated trigger face and the full size guns have a flat faced trigger. It was done because of BATF import points.Quote:
Originally Posted by JBP55
The trigger bars differ between Gen3 and Gen4 guns in one little area, the point that depresses the striker safety. The Gen4 guns have a dimple on it to prevent deflection. It adds a little bit of friction to the trigger mechanism, but I don't find it noticeable.
Im assuming he's referring to the fact that G19s come with the ridged "target" trigger (because of ATF importation points as I've always understood it) and many like to replace with the smooth face trigger from a G17.Quote:
Originally Posted by JBP55
EDIT: oops, JV beat me to it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
I am familiar with Glocks I have just never heard of anyone referring to any Glock trigger as a flat trigger.
JV, I tried the Ghost Connector, from TLG, and I wasn't crazy about the feel at the time. May have to put it back in and try it again.
Would installing a no-adjustment Glockworx fulcrum trigger, Vanek Custom, or other option in a Gen 4 get you more of a good Gen 3 trigger or compromise reliability?
Sorry, but I can't help. While I really wanted one, I never ponied up the money to try one for a high number of rounds. $125 for a trigger assembly crosses my threshold, I'll change my trigger habits to fit the gun rather than make the gun fit me.Quote:
Originally Posted by GJM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GJM
I have fired 27,000 flawless rounds from a G4 G17 with a Vanek trigger. The Vanek trigger works great in a G3 or G4 Glock.
Is that a carry gun/trigger, and if so, about what weight pull? Which model Vanek is this?
Any opinions on the GlockTrigger Guardian?
I put a Vanek Classic in a Gen 4 17 briefly for games. It's very light with all of the installed springs, probably just south of 3 lbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by GJM
I wouldn't remotely put the full trigger in a carry gun, both because it's too light (for me) and because eventually you're likely to get a few light strikes if you stick with the stock striker and the lightened strikers aren't as reliable. If you change out the striker spring regularly and use Federal primers, you can get good reliability, but you are at the hairy edge.
I just bought a g26 gen3 and I can tell a difference in the trigger from my G23 gen3. I put a new connector in my 23 and it makes abetter tigger but the 26 has a fine trigger with out the changes but I found this on you-tube and have posted it before so itf it looks like you have seen it; you might have
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mj8Qt...ure=plpp_video
I'll take this opportunity to repost my reply to that video:Quote:
Originally Posted by barstoolguru
Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
I have posted a video showing proof of a difference; he does show the difference with a hand held scale and I do agree with you that the connector does make a difference in earlier models but so do changing springsQuote:
Rather than remove the dimple on the trigger bar, just lube the points where it rides on the slide, I used slide glide. I have not found that dimple to make a big difference in the trigger pull. What is different, that makes most of the difference in the trigger feel, is the connector angle in the housing.
The mechanical side of me says no matter how much you grease something it still drags. when you are talking about ½ lb increments they do add up to equal drag.
That dimple does nothing but direct the bar across the button but it drags on the inside of the slide. My g26 gen3 has the same slide without the dimple and has a smooth trigger (sorry no trigger scale at this time) so it makes me wonder BUT if you have proof please post it
As an experiment, I just ordered the Guardian non-adjustable carry trigger for my Gen 4 G17 from Jeff at GlockTriggers.com. After discussing what I was looking for, a 4.5-5 pound trigger, with the characteristics of a good broken in Gen 3 Glock 17 trigger, he suggested that I get the Guardian trigger package with a Gen 3 trigger bar. I intend to drop the kit into a non-carry Gen 4 G17, and experiment with both the trigger characteristics and reliability, before proceeding. Jeff made a point of saying that for reliability reasons he would never use a non-Glock connector in a carry pistol.
I picked up my Gen4 23 today and with the factory installed "." connector, the trigger pull was quite good, but you could still feel the dimple dragging. I installed a Gen3 smooth trigger w/o the dimple and the trigger pull felt much much better. Lighter in weight and no more dragging.
one thing that might help too is replacing the trigger spring (the little one in the rear) from 5 to 6 lbs which will lower the trigger pull by a half lb
I have installed several of Jeff's triggers and none of them had an OEM Glock connector and all have been reliable.Quote:
Originally Posted by GJM
I understand what the guy in the video is attempting to show, but I'm saying that his use of a homemade trigger scale is at best - severely suboptimal. To measure the trigger correctly, you should be pulling the trigger straight back, the same way your trigger finger would, and it needs to contact the same point on the trigger every time. You can get wild variations in pull weights if you're not careful - especially with Glocks. I make a point to use a silver sharpie to mark my trigger face to make sure I can contact it in the same place between iterations, especially since some time can pass as you disassemble and reassemble.Quote:
Originally Posted by barstoolguru
I've spent a lot of time swapping trigger bars, connectors, and a ton of other parts in Glocks to get a better pull. IME - removing the dimple is does not make a noticeable difference if you properly lube the the contact point with the slide. I've swapped trigger bars with Gen3 guns and noticed less than a quarter pound difference. I've only extensively messed with (2) Gen4 19 triggers, so my sample size is only 2.
Does every piece add up? Sure, but I don't believe that dimple is what makes the trigger feel so much different when compared to a Gen3.
One thing to note about older trigger bars, compared to new ones (like Gen4 bars), they have a larger trigger spring hole (and groove) which helps with trigger spring life.Quote:
Originally Posted by GJM
FWIW: I have a Gen3 37 trigger bar, and it has the new trigger spring hole/guide. I think it's something that they're doing to all new trigger bars, but I'm not sure. I know all of the Gen4s have the enlarged hole.
I just received the "Guardian" trigger from GlockTriggers. com. While it was for a Gen 4 17, I specified a Gen 3 trigger bar. This is their non-adjustable carry trigger, that uses all Glock factory parts.
My objective was to achieve a trigger in my Gen 4 that felt like a good, well shot in Gen 3 trigger. Quick answer is the trigger is just what I was looking for -- feels like a great Gen 3 trigger. Appropriate weight for carry and just the amount of roll I like. Based on a number of his trigger posts, my guess is TLG would love this trigger in his Gen 4 G17.
Great!
When you get a minute, can you take a look at the back end of the trigger bar, the part that engages the ledge on the connector, and see if it's the same profile as an OEM trigger bar?
Gen4 trigger bars differ in one other respect. The angle of the sear has been increased to ride up higher and a little more firmly against the striker lug.Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
Me, too!Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
I have the following trigger bars in my spare parts bin:Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistolero
(4) Gen4 17
(3) Gen3 19
(1) Gen3 17
None of those trigger bars have any discernible differences in the part that contacts the striker.
I don't know what you've got? I do know that photos and descriptions of this change were announced on Glock Talk some months back. I saw the pictures; and I read the posted comments. What I am not going to do is go back to Glock Talk and search through months of posts in order to prove a point. Besides Glock, GmbH does so much screwing around with component parts - much of it undocumented and unannounced - that you could have anything, in whatever version number, in your spare parts bin.Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
I'll make a mental note of your reply; and, if I come across this information again I'll post to this thread.
Here! Because we don't know one another yet, and I'd like to get off on the right foot with you, I just had to look: http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1307456 Post #16.Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
As I said, I have no idea what you've got in your spare parts bin; but, it might not be what you think it is; and, THAT would be, 'perfect Glockola'.
It's talking about the bend where the spring attaches, not the bend "UP" that touches the striker. That's a big difference.
Yes, there is a new spring attachment point. It has a larger hole and a guide for the spring, both are supposed to increase spring life. The Gen3 bars have the larger hole too.
FWIW: If you want to compare the difference between a Gen4 trigger bar and an older Gen3 trigger bar, somewhat isolating the impact of the "dimple" (without getting out the dremel), you can get one of these (new spring loop/dogleg - no dimple):
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Q...3-new-loop.jpg
The only caveat is that you can't get too fine with your comparisons because it's not exactly a precision part, and the variation between two similar models is sometimes noticeable. Some people go as far as buying a bunch and cherry picking the one that feels best.
Yes. Now that I've taken the time to read the thread I see where it describes the bend in the tail, and not the sear tab, as being different. I've, also, noted that the Gen4 connectors now sit at a more inclined angle that, along with the bump on the FP safety cam, is reported to increase the cumulative trigger pull. I've looked at quite a few pictures of Gen3 and Gen4 sear plates, too. You may be right. I don't see any increased angle on the sear tab at all. Right now I don't know where I got that information from. Possibly I stand corrected. If so, thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by JV
Is there any indication that a Gen 4 stock trigger will smooth a bit with heavy use/time or is manual intervention the only course of action?
I don't mind the pull weight for carry, and I don't lose any sleep over it, but I have noticed the difference from gen2/3 guns I've fired.
Smooth out or lighten? I have not noticed a rougher Gen 4 pull, just heavier for any connector than a Gen 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by EMC
Sorry, bad terminology on my part. Lighten is correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by JHC
I haven't noticed any lightening of the pull for volume of firing. Connector time! ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by EMC