Todd Louis Green and the modern approach to using your sights

Let's keep it simple: Should I focus i my rear sight then my front sight?
Randy

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Originally Posted by randyflycaster

Let's keep it simple: Should I focus i my rear sight then my front sight?
Randy

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I'm just now seeing this, so forgive the delayed response.

No.

Put as simply as I can in text:

- See the target you want to hit. On a humanoid target, this would mean looking at the exact piece of anatomy you are trying to put bullets into.
- Get that into your rear sight window. You aren't really looking at your rear sight, you are looking through it at what you want to hit.
- Without changing your visual focus, ensure your front sight is in the rear window. If it isn't, get it in there.

Most people will not have to change their visual focus to achieve what is detailed above. If you are looking at dude's aortic arch, you drive the rear sight during your draw so that the rear sight window frames his aortic arch, you passively see the front sight inside that window and you start giving him reasons to stop trying to kill you.

One of the things that causes folks to struggle is that they look at the target, then at the front sight, then at the rear sight, then at the target...all these changes in focus take time and mental effort. Instead if it is at all possible, I want to be looking at the thing I'm trying to hit as it is framed in the rear window.

The cures that I need to change some of my visual focus is if the target fits entirely inside my rear sight window. Then I need to see my front sight's relationship to it a little more clearly. If the target is smaller than my front sight...which is common with some of the bigger front sights on the market when you are shooting a B8 at 25...then I need to have a much harder focus on the front sight to get it aligned properly on the target.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TCinVA

I'm just now seeing this, so forgive the delayed response.

No.

Put as simply as I can in text:

- See the target you want to hit. On a humanoid target, this would mean looking at the exact piece of anatomy you are trying to put bullets into.
- Get that into your rear sight window. You aren't really looking at your rear sight, you are looking through it at what you want to hit.
- Without changing your visual focus, ensure your front sight is in the rear window. If it isn't, get it in there.

Most people will not have to change their visual focus to achieve what is detailed above. If you are looking at dude's aortic arch, you drive the rear sight during your draw so that the rear sight window frames his aortic arch, you passively see the front sight inside that window and you start giving him reasons to stop trying to kill you.

One of the things that causes folks to struggle is that they look at the target, then at the front sight, then at the rear sight, then at the target...all these changes in focus take time and mental effort. Instead if it is at all possible, I want to be looking at the thing I'm trying to hit as it is framed in the rear window.

The cures that I need to change some of my visual focus is if the target fits entirely inside my rear sight window. Then I need to see my front sight's relationship to it a little more clearly. If the target is smaller than my front sight...which is common with some of the bigger front sights on the market when you are shooting a B8 at 25...then I need to have a much harder focus on the front sight to get it aligned properly on the target.

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Thank you so, so much,
Randy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TCinVA

I'm just now seeing this, so forgive the delayed response.

No.

Put as simply as I can in text:

- See the target you want to hit. On a humanoid target, this would mean looking at the exact piece of anatomy you are trying to put bullets into.
- Get that into your rear sight window. You aren't really looking at your rear sight, you are looking through it at what you want to hit.
- Without changing your visual focus, ensure your front sight is in the rear window. If it isn't, get it in there.

Most people will not have to change their visual focus to achieve what is detailed above. If you are looking at dude's aortic arch, you drive the rear sight during your draw so that the rear sight window frames his aortic arch, you passively see the front sight inside that window and you start giving him reasons to stop trying to kill you.

One of the things that causes folks to struggle is that they look at the target, then at the front sight, then at the rear sight, then at the target...all these changes in focus take time and mental effort. Instead if it is at all possible, I want to be looking at the thing I'm trying to hit as it is framed in the rear window.

The cures that I need to change some of my visual focus is if the target fits entirely inside my rear sight window. Then I need to see my front sight's relationship to it a little more clearly. If the target is smaller than my front sight...which is common with some of the bigger front sights on the market when you are shooting a B8 at 25...then I need to have a much harder focus on the front sight to get it aligned properly on the target.

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Thanks, TC.

This thread is practically a paradigm shift. I want to share this with my people.

As I was trolling the internets today, I came across this video. It is a concise video about focusing on the front sight. There are some graphics that go along with the points he is trying to make. I really enjoyed this presentation.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lMYzJpD4n8

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TCinVA

One of the things that causes folks to struggle is that they look at the target, then at the front sight, then at the rear sight, then at the target...all these changes in focus take time and mental effort. Instead if it is at all possible, I want to be looking at the thing I'm trying to hit as it is framed in the rear window.

The cures that I need to change some of my visual focus is if the target fits entirely inside my rear sight window. Then I need to see my front sight's relationship to it a little more clearly. If the target is smaller than my front sight...which is common with some of the bigger front sights on the market when you are shooting a B8 at 25...then I need to have a much harder focus on the front sight to get it aligned properly on the target.

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One of the biggest steps I made in iron sight shooting was not switching my focus on most shots, but shifting more attention to the sights based on target difficulty. I used to be able to rapidly snap my focus, and that let me do more hard front sight focus at a relatively high speed (B-A level USPSA shooting). But, it definitely led to a hard plateau when going faster until I switched to target focus for essentially all shots. I haven't seriously focused on iron shooting for a couple years, but I've been thinking about seeing how primarily shooting dots has affected my iron shooting.

I recently saw a video with Pranka and Stoeger where Ben says he no longer teaches newer shooters front sight focus at all. He basically said that he's found most of his students tend to over focus on the fiber and it actually makes it harder for them to get the post all the way into the notch at speed.

Interestingly, I recently heard a podcast with Nils, and it sounds like he believes his ability to quickly shift focus to his front sight has been a big part of his success with irons.

The recent Lucky Gunner video gets the good stuff from Mr. Ashton Ray and Mr. Tim Chandler.

This is the clearest guidance I have yet seen on sight usage, it appears to derive exactly from this thread, and this will be something I'll be eagerly passing off to the new shooters in my social circle. (It's weird, my friends are either brand-new to it all, or faaaar more talented than I am).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPhl1K6OHwE

I figured out after shifting back to irons after my finger surgery that I needed to shift between front sight focus and target focus.. I did not realize what I was doing was "rear sight focus" but ya, it made irons a whole lot more useful to me. Great thread.

I enjoyed the video and found it to be an excellent explanation of “see what you need to see.” Also, as soon as I saw the iron sights training aid they used, I immediately knew I had to have them. If anyone else wants a set, they’re available at trainingsights.com. I found a 10% off code too, TSIGHTS. They aren’t cheap if you want them in anything larger than wallet sized, but I can see them being excellent training aids when I’m teaching so I bought an “Instructor Kit” in 4”x6” which has pistol iron sight, rifle iron sight, and red dot sight training aids.